Australia - you're standing in it

Sheepdog's picture
Sheepdog started the topic in Friday, 18 Sep 2020 at 11:51am

The "I can't believe it's not politics" thread.

factotum's picture
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factotum commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 12:35pm

As for the media reform 'stories', first some historical context is handy. After Murdoch successfully went to war on the Whitlam Labor government (and in which he hasn't really let up since), old Hawkie, the great appeaser, and his government’s changes to media laws in 1987 were largely a rearguard action. After News Limited’s takeover of the Herald & Weekly Times group, it had unrivalled newspaper reach in all capital cities other than Perth anyway.

Belatedly, Labor realised that its decision not to oppose the takeover would not buy Murdoch editorial support. Dancing with the devil, you get burned. So Keating in 1992, moved to restrict foreign ownership, cross-media ownership and to try to guarantee some diversity of news and current affairs voices with the two-out-of-three rule.

This Keating measure was finally put to the sword by Turnbull and Fifield.

Anyway, here's a brief history for the readers out there:

https://www.eurekastreet.com.au/article/the-sad-history-of-australian-me...

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 6:24pm

"Murdoch endorses Rudd as PM

Media mogul Rupert Murdoch has endorsed Kevin Rudd, saying the federal Opposition Leader would make a good prime minister."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2007-04-21/murdoch-endorses-rudd-as-pm/25286...

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 6:38pm

I don't think you've worked out how Murdoch operates Indo.
His default position is to endorse conservative candidates until it is obvious they are going to lose. His papers then endorse Labor or Labour (in the UK) very late in the election cycle so he can claim he isn't a hyper partisan media owner.
I can't believe I have to explain this to you.

"angry online, smiley in the brine"

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 6:40pm

Ha ha okay.

Love it how there is always an excuse for everything with you.

factotum's picture
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factotum commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 6:59pm

And, Info..?

He flew to NY to kiss Rupe's arse before the 2007 election, as others have.

Rupe's vain-glorious self-image as the 'kingmaker', both here and overseas, is legend.

Then again, Shorten didn't go to his lair when bidden...and what happened there?!

The point is to break his toxic influence.

factotum's picture
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factotum commented Sunday, 1 Nov 2020 at 3:02pm

A side note: Murdoch was 'all aboard' for Whitlam early on. The mail is he had an eye on an ambassadorial slot, but then Whitlam shot that down in flames when he got in.

The 'mogul scorned' blowback was brutal.

In hindsight, one of Whitlam's biggest gaffes?

Imagine the world without the Murdoch media influence from the mid 70s till now.

A better place, no fucken doubt.

Then again, imagine him directly involved in politics over that period?!

D-Rex's picture
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D-Rex commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 7:30pm

It is commonly accepted that Whitlam getting the boot in 75 was the saviour of the Oz economy. Murdoch should be given a knighthood if he had anything to do with it.

Rabbits68's picture
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Rabbits68 commented Friday, 30 Oct 2020 at 11:40pm

“Ha ha okay.

Love it how there is always an excuse for everything with you.”

C’mon Indo, stop playing the man. Play the ball mate....

Pristine

JQ's picture
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JQ commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 7:29am

Gotta love it how in Indo's eyes Murdoch's backing of Rudd proves that he doesn't just strive to get conservative governments in.

Murdoch doesn't like to back a loser, when he knows a conservative isn't going to win, he'll back someone else to save face.

views from the cockpit's picture
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views from the ... commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 8:04am

Irrespective of who ya follow- the reduction in FOI from State and Federal Govt is something we should all get fkn angry about.
Those dirtbag weasel filth scum shit who are currently in power are increasingly keeping us ignorant of their corruption and failures.
Can anyone be held to account?????

Fliplid's picture
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Fliplid commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 8:20am

This article won't be of much comfort to you views, but worth a read to get an idea of where we are heading. Eventually the coalition will have a perfect veneer of honesty and integrity because there will be no-one left to reveal just how rotten they are

"The Audit Office made these revelations, along with the still-running saga of sports rorts, and was rewarded by a $14 million cut in this month's federal budget (as a result of "efficiency dividends"), which will see the number of its audits cut from 48 to 38 each year."

"Things aren't going all that well over at the Office of the Australian Information Commissioner, either.
The office, which is responsible for both privacy and freedom of information (FOI), was wiped out altogether briefly in the Abbott years, but since being restored has been the subject of severe funding restraints, despite an increasing workload, particularly given the new challenges posed by social media platforms and privacy issues.
What that means in reality is that it has been unable to address a growing backlog of FOI cases, and its budget documentation showed it was unable to achieve seven of its eight performance goals for 2019-20."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-31/morrison-government-transparency-...

Hiccups's picture
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Hiccups commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 10:35am

"Gotta love it how in Indo's eyes Murdoch's backing of Rudd proves that he doesn't just strive to get conservative governments in.

Murdoch doesn't like to back a loser, when he knows a conservative isn't going to win, he'll back someone else to save face."

Apparently indo is the only person in Australia that isn't aware of this.

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 12:51pm

More on Coal-mo's bullshit about backing gas over renewables

Screen-Shot-2020-10-31-at-12-48-27-pm

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 2:56pm

@JQ

ha ha yeah right, you guys will spin it whatever way you can.

Yeah sure Murdoch backs conservative governments most of the time, but his news outlets give it hard to both sides.

They do this because it sells if all his media outlets was as bias as Skynews they would have failed long ago.

The whole Murdoch thing these days is close to irrelevant anyway, it's 2020 not 2000.

Gone are the days where you had no choice you either got your views and news through print media, radio or TV that was limited to a handful of channels.

Everything has changed most people source their news online in some way the whole playing field is more level than ever, add to that people basically create their own bubbles click on one site or page and the whole algorithm suggest similar sites/pages/videos, links shared by friends etc.

Personally id be happy to get my online news from Murdoch but again most of its paywalled, so i often end up at sites like the ABC who if anything are bias to the left.

Then you have all these social justice political type movements that try to influence politics Get Up being the most obvious example but social media is swamped by them

Anyway this is from UK but expect similar in OZ

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 3:28pm

"More on Coal-mo's bullshit about backing gas over renewables"

Once again full of shit.

Scomo doens't back gas over renewables, it's not about one or the other, he backs a balance realistic approach.

Most of our gas as we know goes offshore that demand has increased quite a bit in the last ten years.

Even with the increase in renewables we will need solutions to the intermittency issues, it wont be all one thing, it will be a combination like batteries, pumped hydro, hydrogen and other tech all that will take time.

And if we want to get rid of coal we will need gas peaking plants to ensure consistent energy supply, gas is also much more flexible than coal for peaking stations and these plants can be converted to hydrogen.

BTW. saw some Greens thing on social media whinging about how Labor also support the gas thing.

Quick google comes across a few recent articles like this

"Shorten backs gas in widening Labor rift on energy"

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/shorten-backs-gas-in-widening-la...

"Labor commits to 'environmentally sustainable' gas development"

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/sep/23/labor-commits-to-...

Id expect your graphs like many are misleading and don't take into account many aspects.

Michael Bourne's picture
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Michael Bourne commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 3:17pm

A culture with a common goal. The very same goal that united the many Indigenous Australian Cultures, who upheld that goal for around 80,000 years, in all possibilty, even many more thousands of years than even that exemplary, unmatched in human history number.

The one glaring difference is british colonialism's influence in each case. In just 200 odd years, Australia's very own, even more successful version of Bhutan has been transformed, actually oblitherated, trampled, despised and mocked by the genocidal, british invaders, into the exact opposite. As the ever expanding avalanche of manic, deranged, lunatic, delusional 'kings' and 'queens' and 'prime' 'ministers' run amock, fueled by their nationally astute...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tmullen/2018/02/27/why-bhutan-is-still-out-...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culture-shocked/202003/are-peopl...

https://voelkerrechtsblog.org/articles/semi-colonialism-and-internationa...

https://thediplomat.com/2020/05/what-explains-bhutans-success-battling-c...

Hiccups's picture
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Hiccups commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 4:01pm

"Yeah sure Murdoch backs conservative governments most of the time, but his news outlets give it hard to both sides"

Ah yep. Sure. Just as hard to both sides. Yep.

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 5:56pm

A fairly recent example so go back and look at the murdoch media press around the fires, Scomo got smashed by murdoch media, trip to Hawaii and handshakes were the big news, while the actual announcements on important aspects got little press.

It's purely because aspects that stop up people and divide people or negative stories gets peoples attention and sells or gets clicks.

Murdoch press like all press has it's bias but end of the day they will make the most of any situation and exploit what ever angle will get the most attention.

Michael Bourne's picture
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Michael Bourne commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 7:17pm

‘A fairly recent example so go back and look at the murdoch media press around the fires, Scomo got smashed by murdoch media, trip to Hawaii and handshakes were the big news, while the actual announcements on important aspects got little press.‘

Interesting example. And what a ‘leader’. Follow the ‘leader’.

https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/mainstream-me...

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 8:07pm

Early count in the Queensland election and One Nation's vote has absolutely collapsed. Suck shit Pauline, Queenslanders have woken up to the fact that One Nation are a rabble.

"angry online, smiley in the brine"

JQ's picture
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JQ commented Saturday, 31 Oct 2020 at 8:09pm

Please Indo, Murdoch's outlets do not give it hard to both sides, not at all. Yep sure, when there's wide spread criticism hitting a conservative government they'll jump onboard. Note how this was also right after the election, this criticism could safely be levelled without risking votes in an election.

Murdochs media is not irrelevant these days, because his journalists represent such a high percentage of journalists at press conferences, they get to control the narrative sheerly by numbers, they ask the most questions. Their overwhelming resources mean that other, smaller media outlets use the information that comes out of these press conferences. Even if you choose your own media sources, you'll still most likely see the issues and the questions that Murdochs staff want asked and answered.

The narratives and attack lines that are concocted at his media outlets reverberate through social media and parliament. I mean we've frequently seen you adopting these narratives and attacks from their outlets.

They also wield influence by personally attacking and smearing individuals to silence them.

No other media outlet - in Australia at least - behaves as shamelessly and openly tries to (and succeeds) in influencing politics.

Make no mistake, his influence has played a major role in both keeping conservative governments in power, kicking 'progressive' governments out and pushing both conservative and progressive political parties further to the right.

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Michael Bourne commented Sunday, 1 Nov 2020 at 11:41am
factotum's picture
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factotum commented Sunday, 1 Nov 2020 at 11:57am

Who is the photographer here?
https://www.news.com.au/national/queensland/politics/qld-election-live-r...

Answers on the back of a Poh Lin Hansun tear stained 'how to vote' card.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-01/queensland-state-election-2020-wi...

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Sunday, 1 Nov 2020 at 3:18pm

That second Singapore video seems interesting, might have to give it a watch latter.

These days i normally go to KL but went back to Singapore last year for a few days and did that Garden by the bays, worth doing if you are in Singapore, pretty well done.

@ JQ Argh totally disagree but cant be bothered at the moment.

bluediamond's picture
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bluediamond commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 10:33am

Thought this was a really well written and balanced piece written on the Oz/China relations that was worth sharing. Cheers.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-04/australia-china-relations-power-s...

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 12:38pm

Balanced ?

Geoff Ruby is literally a registered agent of foreign influence for China. He is paid to provide propaganda and soft power initiatives which further China’s ambitions.

It says a lot about the ABC that they failed to mention this fact. Predominantly it says that this particular journalist at the ABC can’t be relied on to do their job. Assuming that ineptitude is the end of the matter of course.

Here’s a letter to the ABC from the publisher of Macrobusiness :

“ To whom it may concern,

My name is David Llewellyn-Smith. I am an economist at MacroBusiness and write about Chinese relations every day. I am also Chief Strategist at Nucleus Wealth, an independent fund manager.

Previously, I was the founding publisher and global economy editor at The Diplomat, the Asia Pacific’s leading geo-politics and economics portal. And an economic commentator at The Sydney Morning Herald, The Age, ABC and Business Spectator, as well as co-author of The Great Crash of 2008 with Professor Ross Garnaut plus editor of the second Garnaut Climate Change Review.

This morning Fran Kelly interviewed Geoff Raby on the state of China/Australia relations. The interview never mentioned that Mr Raby is a registered agent of foreign influence for Yancoal, a major Chinese state-owned enterprise: https://transparency.ag.gov.au/Registrants/Details/fb03987a-5144-e911-81...

Nor did it mention that Geoff Raby Associates works for just about everyone engaged in Chinese commerce: http://www.geoffraby.com/customers/index.html

These are important facts that influence how listeners should perceive Mr Raby’s views. He has financial interests in the debate that colour his pedigree as former ambassador.

Mr Raby contends that Australia and China are inexorably and inevitably intertwined economically. This is bad geopolitics and weak economics.

The vast majority of Australian exports to China are commodities. If China stops buying Aussie commodities then it must buy them elsewhere. That swing in demand opens new deficits in supply elsewhere that Australia can fill.

That is, Australian commodities will get shipped regardless of whether China buys them or not, so long as its demand does not exit the global economy. This process is already underway in such markets as barley and coal. There is an adjustment period but it is quite manageable for the Australian economy to weather considerably lower Chinese exports.

Moreover, this indicates that Australia has a lot more wriggle room in dealing with China than Mr Raby makes out. Even to the point of choosing to entirely decouple if we so wish.

I would like to put myself forward for an interview with Fran Kelly to rebut the views of Mr Raby.

Please respond urgently. Thanks and regards,

David“

stunet's picture
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stunet commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 12:38pm

Gimme a hot take, Blowin:

You dont dig Sino.

But you do dig Trump.

Fairies nuts that Trump is calling Xi and the Boys out on US trade and whatnot, however in his policy of isolationism he's ceding East Asia to China, and with it us.

Under Trump, Australia cant count on US protection and cant possibly stand up to China.

Wouldn't Biden the Hawk be your guy?

Remember, hot take, thirty secs at best.

bluediamond's picture
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bluediamond commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 12:40pm

Sorry blowin. You've proven plenty of times you're not someone worth engaging in a 'balanced' conversation with.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:03pm

Biden is hawkish but not towards China in any way shape or form. It was under the Biden Vice Presidency that the most threatening event possible for East Asia occurred . Namely the militarisation of the Spratly Islands in the South China Sea.

Obama’s pivot to Asia was far too little and far too late. All trust regarding US resistance to Chinese ambition has eroded at that point.

What evidence do you have that Trump has foresaken East Asia ? Ties between US and Taiwan - the canary in the coal mine - have strengthened considerably. US is performing regular missions through the SCS. The Philippines was drifting towards alignment with China until the Trump presidency was established. The Quadrilateral Security Dialogue - Australia, Japan , India and the US - is our best chance at containment of an expansionist China . It’s a US initiative which has been receiving much attention from our US allies of late.

I’m not quite sure where the “Trump has abandoned us “ rhetoric is backed up by any evidence at all. Could you provide some ?

Trump has literally spurred the world towards reacting to the increasing belligerence of China. He’s brought the subject to the world stage amd even his critics accede to this fact.

How can you claim Trump is isolationist and does nothing for Australia when he’s provided the canvas and the backing of our rejection of the path upon which we were blindly careering ? Without Trump making China an issue we would still be subject to the gaslighting that introducing consumerism to their empire would force them towards an open democratic society.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:00pm

Bluediamond....I’m engaging you with civility now as I have always tried to do. I have my opinion and perspective. If I don’t agree with you it does not render either of our opinions unbalanced just different.

Either way I’ve provided external links which certainly show that the ABC piece does not come from an impartial perspective as one would expect from the National Broadcaster.

Forget the stuff between Facto and myself it doesn’t need to ruin every part of the site and every interaction with anyone else.

stunet's picture
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stunet commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 12:59pm

TL;DR

Can you condense it a bit?

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:01pm

Yep...Biden isn’t hawkish on China and the claims that Trump has dumped us because “ isolationism “ are overblown hogwash.

Lookup the Quadrilateral Security Dialogue.

stunet's picture
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stunet commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:09pm

Gotcha.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:23pm

What are your feels on the issue ?

Trump or Biden ....who’s better for Australia re the Chyna

bluediamond's picture
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bluediamond commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:35pm

Fair enough Blowin. No need to shoot the messenger though and i personally found the article pretty good in providing a balanced view on China, regardless of the writer. It addressed some thoughts i already had on the issue in an articulate way so i wouldn't say the author influenced my thinking, just put it into a coherrent structure, which i couldn't do.

stunet's picture
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stunet commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 1:42pm

Who's better..?

For trade, I imagine Biden would be better.

For independence, Trump, though it comes with many worrying caveats.

On that issue, I'd say 'go the Don', but for every other one, in fact the whole damn farce, I throw my hands in the air. Who knows..? The only certainty in American life is increasing friction and strife.

The genie is out of the bottle.

simba's picture
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simba commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 2:21pm

well ive got a johnny burger on the line...go trump!.........still can't believe out of 400 million people or whatever that they chose these two gumbies.....

simba

velocityjohnno's picture
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velocityjohnno commented Wednesday, 4 Nov 2020 at 5:56pm

Australia - you are standing in it.

Australian QE

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-04/what-is-quantitative-easing-and-h...

more detail here:

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2020/11/still-more-on-rba-printing/

Back in 2009 there were many curses sent at Ben Bernanke, Fed chair, when he unleashed his unconventional monetary policy. In fact, this is probably bigger news for our lives than the 2020 USElection today.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/b/benbernanke.asp

If we are to look at what followed, US stocks rose to incredible levels and decoupled from their local economy; commodities took off again, banks didn't fail, the finance system kept working; 5000 year low interest rates allows zombie companies to continue to exist, the term 'TBTF' was created, RE took off again, wages didn't keep up so everyday people got squeezed. Along the way there were blips like the PIIGS lending crisis, QE2, QE3, 'Operation Twist', and late last year the Fed had to step in to try to control repo rates which tends to suggest systematic problems - but, hey, corona.

https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/federal-reserve-reacts-to-repo-rate-sp...

So now Australia has joined the QE crowd, and if you read the MB article it is accompanying a targeted lowering of the AUD (probably as everyone else is lowering their currencies by printing cash out of thin air).

0.1%. Yield, baby.

gsco's picture
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gsco commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 8:15am

I have lived and worked in China regularly over the past 5 years with my Chinese girlfriend and her extended family.

Many of the thoughts I have come to about China very closely align with those of Geoff Raby.

The most blatantly out of control, hyper, warfare-like propaganda, misinformation, confusion, and conspiracy theory generating machine is the Western media. Our media is just a bot that spams warfare-like deception about China.

Anyone who bases their opinion and views about China on what they see in our media has in their heads a different China on a different planet in a different solar system in a different galaxy in a different corner of the universe. The reality "on the ground" of the China on our planet Earth is very different.

stunet's picture
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stunet commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 8:19am

While we weren't watching...

"If you are a property developer wanting to curry favour with the NSW Labor Party or the Queensland Liberal National Party, you are now allowed to make a donation of $14,299 and no one will ever know. All you need to do is tell the party the money is “for federal purposes”.

Tasmanian lower house MP Andrew Wilkie described the law as allowing “brazen money laundering”. Senator Jacqui Lambie said the law was “a doozy” of a way “to hide big donor money from the voters” and “the latest in a long line of betrayals of the public’s trust”.

At the risk of drawing a long bow, this sets Australia one step further down the path of America's lead, where democracy for the people is subverted by corporate influence, yet today there are just two media outlets covering it, The Conversation - if you can even call them a media outlet - and The New Daily.

Also interesting is that the author of the above Conversation article is Luke Beck who discloses he's a member of the Labor Party while also damning them.

thermalben's picture
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thermalben commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 8:50am

Cathy Wilcox nails it pretty much every time.

AndyM's picture
AndyM's picture
AndyM commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 9:23am

Or on the words of Andrew Wilke -

"Today the Govt & Oppn shamefully voted to allow federal political parties to accept donations from donors banned by state & territory govts. They can use the money, or pass to their state branch which is brazen money laundering"

How good is a two party system??

How good is it that the LNP and Labor acted together in federal parliament to weaken political donation laws?

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 11:35am

ALP and LNP need to be nuked from orbit.

Time to have a big farewell dinner for the both of them and their will fully blind apparatchiks then send the lot down to the jobs boards at Centrelink.

We’ve got no chance without a fresh start.

bluediamond's picture
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bluediamond commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 3:01pm

Great feedback GSCO. Thanks for sharing it and keeping it real.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 5:12pm

Living the dream in the Northern Rivers?

If you paid $76,000 for a home in Bangalow in 2000 it is now valued at $1.05 million,
an increase of 1,281 per cent.

Bangalow has had the highest price growth in housing prices, not just in regional areas, but capital cities too.

https://www.abc.net.au/radio/northcoast/programs/breakfast/bangalow-hous...

udo's picture
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udo commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 5:46pm

AndyM - new listing Sulva St .

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 5:49pm

Banga hole.

a more pretentious up itself over-priced joint God has yet to set eyes on.

velocityjohnno's picture
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velocityjohnno commented Thursday, 5 Nov 2020 at 6:26pm
Ralph's picture
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Ralph commented Friday, 6 Nov 2020 at 7:51am

Prices are really crazy on the Northern Beaches too. I reckon there's so much cash sloshing around in the system with ultra low interest rates and money printing and its driving up asset prices.

Distracted's picture
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Distracted commented Friday, 6 Nov 2020 at 10:30pm

Interesting stat on Gruen tonight. Aussies normally spend $40B a year overseas.... if we’re not going anywhere next year then the local tourism will be out of control and the home hardware shops will be going nuts.

Wonder just how far house prices can go on the North Coast? It will be a housing bubble inside a bubble.