The Kellycopter.....
There can't be many 40 year olds around trying those airs

"You'd have to invoke the GOAT as the exception to prove the rule. As a 40 year old he produced two of the biggest airs ever seen in competition at Bells Beach and New York in the early 2010's. Otherwise, his skill set in small surf is clearly going backwards."

I think his performances are still as good as ever in the small stuff, but there are so many now at a level in the small stuff that KS never got to, Filipe, Gabriel, etc.

Thanks, Steve. Once again you think and write, and then make us think.

Quick answer: not easily. Growing up in Denmark I came to surfing late in life and then mostly on trips. Home was garbage, but we embraced that garbage. I was always destined for mediocrity, however.

Once installed in NZ, I only improved slowly till I started to think about what to do and how my body worked. I managed to improve into my 50s, but fuck a lot of things come and derail you: Lockdowns floored me, and the last few years in general have been mentally hard, as have injuries. Death of parents; loss of friends.

Living in a place with really consistent surf has been a boon. No longer fretting to surf whenever it's on, but whenever it's good or you feel like it, or aren't having lunch with the missus. So there are still glimpses of magic where I surprise myself, but it's too late for proper improvement. Reckon I can surf a 12-15ft wave again, though, if my body allows. That'd do me.

It's almost entirely about consistent time in the water.

Once you have kids its basically just trying to maintain, rather than improve, your skillset by getting out in the water whenever possible. So that when it gets good you can actually enjoy it.

Assume that in 40s and later, age becomes a major factor too.

Cool article and pretty much spot on.

I reckon if you don't start surfing in your teens then you are gonna be a pretty mediocre surfer forever. Doesn't mean you won't have fun, just that you're not going to turn out to be a ripper. I can't think of one person who started in their twenties who went on to become really good. I can't think of anyone who started in their thirties to be even half-way decent. Happy to be corrected but nobody I know.

As for me, I'm as good as I'm ever gonna get, that's including snowboarding too. I might have the odd glimpse here and there of pulling something that surprises me but for the most part, everything performance-wise in surfing for me has well and truly been preceded.

Not wrong, zen. Started skiing real young, and even at 59, I could come back to it post Covid and improve.
Surfing, different story

Good read and reckon you are spot on. Reckon the years between 12 and 16 are the key, stating the obvious I guess, but if you are not a great surfer at 17-18 you never will be. You may become competent, but not a outlier. Geez some of the young guys and girls are doing unbelievable stuff now. I mean wtf???
https://m.

Great article FR. I waste way to much time watching crew surf and theorise that pretty much by the time a life long surfer hits their early 40’s they basically surf every wave on their home break the same. Give’m a 5’6” and they’ll be Mr Squiggle for a couple of waves then fall back into their usual routine. Give’m a 6’3” and after a few waves they’ll wind it up to surf the same as on their 5’9” goto. Yep we get more consistent with time but few genuinely seem to improve, although those skills developed in our early childhood seem to be relatively easy to regain or maintain. Kudos on your two most memorable rides. I didn’t even do a turn on my biggest ever wave but I’m claiming it.

Tend to think many surfers slow their progression by simply not trying to improve. Soccer and football players attend weekly trainings to address particular skills. In contrast, surfers usually just surf for the fun of it, not focusing on any one movement or technique

100percent you can improve. There's always room for improvement.
I've been tuning into alot of the OMBE stuff with Clayton Neinaber over the last couple of years. I've found his approach of really breaking down the body mechanics and how you need to become aware of what you're body is doing (the thing you can control) has had profound benefits on my surfing.
I'd say in the last 2 years there's been a 200percent improvement in my surfing (although many may beg to differ) but comparing footage from before this type of analysis and after it shows huge changes, especially in the bottom turn. So either i was a really big kook before this and now i'm a reasonable kook, or the instructions and tips have had the effect i suspect hey have had. I'd definitely recommend giving him a go.

All comes back to time in the water I think. The more time you spend when you are younger the stronger a foundation you have to run off. Even the best surfer will be surfing pretty average if they only surf every few months, for fitness reasons alone. Also comes back to how good the surf is, everyone surfs better in Indo don’t they?

I don’t think I’ve improved since I was about 25 as far as doing turns and “tricks” etc.
But I reckon I can read and surf barrels better (forehand only) and I’m a lot more comfortable in bigger waves now than I was when I was 30. (Nearly 10 years ago)
I probably don’t surf them better than I would of then but I also wouldn’t of paddled out in some situations then that I would now.
I still can’t backhand tube ride to save my life except for easy ones and I’ve pretty much given up on setting my sights on travelling for hollow rights. I like surfing my backhand I just can’t make technical tubes.
If I can spend the rest of my life surfing around home and time in Indo going left every year that’ll do me.

I see local guys my age doing surf coaching and taking the heats in the local board riders club so seriously and think what’s the point? But good on em I guess if that’s what they’re into.

Every day is a new day. It is better to be lucky. But I would rather be exact. Then when luck comes you are ready.
Ernest Hemingway, The Old Man and the Sea

Really good dispatch, so many valid points, starting young and regular surfing key to enjoying waves which is what its all about though without stuffing up some other persons surf. Gets harder as you get older so stay loose and fit anyway possible. The variety of equipment has also allowed enjoyment at all levels without having to pull off airs.

Bottom line more time in the water means better results
Plenty of 50 plus guys from the surfcoast charge and some are getting better
Like fine wine my friend

Can you keep getting 'better',
can you improve your skill set as an adult?

YEP.... enjoying each moment is a skill we can all improve upon....
many a surfer has fallen & gone to sit on the bench, bemoaning the better days, waves & ways.

Maybe an injury or work or a holiday away from the waves can reset expectations & savour surfing ...again
thrills maybe just being in the ocean,
paddling over the first wave of the set, rainbow spray, to see what may be coming my way....
&
making the drop

"my most memorable rides over the last decade..... I could have done more, but ...
could those waves have felt any better?
Been more memorable?
What was amazing, was that I rode them,.....not how good I rode them."

Compare yourself to who you were yesterday, not to some other person today

Really good topic. One I’ve pondered a lot.

I reckon you can improve with sheer consistent time in water. I know I feel much more in sync if I’m surfing 3-4+ times / week. …….but I guess doesn’t mean I’m getting better perse.

I believe you can improve on your bigger wave surfing and barrel riding during your years 30-50 through experience as long as you keep your fitness up.

As for the good wave theory, I agree to a point, some reps at an uncrowded point or Indo can do wonders for the bog rail backhand bottom turn or forehand cutback. However anyone witnessed those middle aged mouthy heros out at snapper/dbah everyday? Surf absolute perfection more than most and apart from good positioning surf like total muppets.

Anyone learnt to do an air over the age of 30?

I'm improving ATM but here's what it takes:

I've been retired for a year now, age 36, and given up skateboarding to only surf. Not drinking or smoking weed. Eating healthy. I travelled around the east coast of of oz, two months in Bali and now I'm in Latin America, all this year. I wasn't improving in oz much at all. Too fickle and crowded. In Bali, despite the perfect waves and daily surf, only a little bit. The food was lacking in protein which was also a holdback. The only time it was uncrowded was when it was big(!) or if I was surfing a C grade spot. Now I'm surfing average but consistent uncrowded point surf everyday. Some hollow rocky barrel point surf and another point wave that's good for turns mostly. Actually a half dozen uncrowded waves that are all slightly different AND uncrowded. I'll surf a couple of hours and catch heaps of good waves. I eat well and sleep well.

It's like that shark thing I read here regarding attacks. If you're surfing with one person, your odds drop to 50%, 10 people, 10%. Same thing with waves all things equal. You do the math at Bali where it's quite lully and you're rarely going to get your fill, unless you're in g land or somewhere.

Father time is my only concern at the moment and there's going to be a point where no matter what, I'm going to be sliding backwards. At that point I might consider giving it up, depends on where I am in the world. I don't want to be one of those angry, unfit old men on the latest trendy twin mini mal trying to relive glory days.

Good article and I agree with it, despite being an exception. Also, I can't do airs so I have a lot of space to improve!

You forgot to mention Surf Hacks where you can learn not to be a hack.

The best surfer is always going to be the one having the most fun.

Surfing has been by far the hardest thing ive learnt, i grew up on the boog and probably been on the stand up for like 10 years now, and my gawd the progression has been minimal haha.

You can get better for sure, I’d say it’s mostly mental. The mountain bike analogy is interesting, I raced downhill mtb for over 10 years and started in my mid teens. I saw lots of people start at different ages and become more competent and fewer rapidly improve. Whilst trails are always there, they do change with weather conditions. So while not as diverse as waves, things aren’t totally predictable.

Coming to surfing in my later twenties, I noticed the progression curve started out quite steeply, and then begins to flatten out as you get better.

I think you’ve got to have a mindset that is focussed on progressing and finding fulfilment and joy in improving your skill level. Every time I jump on the bike or paddle out I’m trying to improve, which is something that keeps me engaged and very satisfied. Some people are more satisfied with just being engaged with the activity.

Most of my mates I surf with are also exceptionally good and love chasing heavy/challenging waves. Aside from watching/learning from them, a little bit of friendly persuasion to throw yourself over the edge and out of your comfort zone/ability level definitely lends itself to progressing your surf skills quicker if you prefer not to get smoked in heavy conditions all the time.

Interesting topic for sure. If defining progressive surfing, like airs and moves like pros might do as improvement, then I have not improved for a long time. But, in my mid 60's, like goofyfoot and Solitude noted, my barrel riding has improved over the years, I think. A lot of improvement comes from experience. You generally get better at reading waves and lineups and wave choice. Is this counted as improvement? Maybe.

As others have stated, starting in your early teens has such a huge advantage compared to later.

I started in my late teens and it's taken years but feel like I'm at a good but far from ripping level. In perfect waves I'll do quite well and love grovelling in the rip bowls in and around Manly which gives you a high wave count to time surfing ratio.

I think the main advantage with time and years of surfing is reading the ocean (like Goofy pointed out). This gives you the biggest advantage to be on the better waves or better bank across the beach, thus giving you more opportunity to try and improve your surfing.

I wish I could pull off an air or two, just a simple air-reverse, they look super fun, but copping a fin to the arse or arm while trying doesn't sound too appealing in my late 30's.

As long as you're still having fun and not missing/bogging waves that's the main point.

I also agree Steve that the free-surfing clips showcase and push progression much more than competition surfing does where a slightly more safety approach is taken. So you're right that the QS/CT could lead to a degradation of surfing level/improvisation.

1. Kids and young adults surf in anything these days and for hours v me I only surf if glassy or offshore and for probably half the time. Example: daughter surfed with boyfriend and mates for 3 hours late yesterday arvo onshore SE here, then at 7am back again with a girlfriend, me having a red and coffee lol.
2. So many average surfers now that are just good enough to take waves off you, so less waves.
3. I don't think surfer who have surfed all their life will improve much over 50, not in todays conditions.

Pfft - you can always get better. I started surfing in mid 20s after bodyboarding, I went from starting on a mini-mal to surfing Puerto, Gland and Ments in about 5 years. I’m still average but I can throw myself over a ledge and get pitted which was the main goal.
1) Get on a surf trainer skateboard - helps so much with being able to repeat turns and get your body shape right.
2) since COVID and WFH and job change I have been lucky to go from one surf a week to 3 for an extended period and its helped my surfing so much. Just in terms of consistency,
3) Surfer bigger waves is a realistic target at any age which is a form of improvement.
4) don’t measure your surfing against pros - set realistic targets.

I find I'm not over surfing waves as much as I used to. I don't flap around nearly as much. In fact I'm under surfing them. If going in a straight line with better style counts then I'm so much better than I used to be.

Great article Steve and as always carefully thought through and well articulated. Pushing 63 now and just trying to keep fit is almost a full time job when every organ in your body is on the slow way out. Still love surfing and nowadays making sure every turn counts and not a series of check turns. Also my tube riding is a little better than it was. Started surfing sub teens, stop start to late teens, lots of surf in 20's, backed way off in 30's (career and kids), some time in my 40's amongst mid life crisis, 50's lots more surf (more time), 60's even more time shifted permanently down the beach (thank you Dan and Covid which made it legitimate to work from home), and still going OS to surf. Still enjoying it with expectations lowered to a painfully realistic level. I think what has saved me is my surfing mates are now my son's mates (late 20's) who have invited me to a Mentawis boat trip next year. They still have that youthful enthusiasm that my mates the same age have lost (just about all have given up).

I find it hard to quantify improvement in surf skills. I might be falling on waves I would of made once upon a time and feel that my best surfing is behind me. But every dog has its day and every couple of years we all have that rare session when all of the elements align and the set of the day rolls through and your in the spot…. Muscle memory takes over and we somehow execute something truly special. It’s been a good couple of years since I have experienced one of those peak breakthrough moments but I like to think I’ve still got it in me.

As others said having that ability to read the micro-sensibilities of approaching waves and positioning yourself in accordance before you even get to your feet is perhaps the most useful skill as a surfer. That’s something you can only learn yourself and most commonly through absolute dedication in the formative years when you conveniently have no other responsibilities.
Curious to hear everyone else’s opinions.

I'll say one thing about Ben Cathro showing Joe Average how to get new skill sets on two wheels, and that is he probably doesn't go into the broken bones factor in too much detail. I think I'll stick to trying to improve my waning surf skills in the twilight of my career unlike some of my mates who regularly injure themselves flying down dirt tracks on two wheels.

I will also say that the improvements in board shapes for the average surfer has helped massively. I spent way too long on under volume performance boards because 20 yrs ago the choices and my knowledge were limited.
That first time you get on a lower rocker and well volumed average Joe board and suddenly wave count goes up, speed goes up and boom you are away

You're Shearing too close to the bone Steve

What is 'better'? Is it subjective or objective? If you feel like you are surfing better are you surfing better? Or.. If you look better is that better? Is the standard based on the WSL performances ? Who sets the bar? Too hard.

About 4 years ago at 59, I started to have takeoff issues, definitely slower and as it went on it became a lack of confidence issue too. So, it was either do something about it or just let it fade into the sunset.
First up new lighter, more flexible wetties, then in winter the lightest boots I could find which were Ripcurl 2mm Rubber Soul jobs, not a long-lasting boot but you don't know they're on. Some popup training and serious focusing in the water helped. At the same time, I began to experiment away from thrusters towards higher volumed short twinnies, that helped too.
Then last year I saw a 7' Chili Mid Strength in my local and as I was already thinking along those lines, especially as where I surf there are soooo many beginners and people on mals etc. and they're gliding into the fat ones with ease, I pulled the trigger and bought it.
That was surprisingly a really good move, as the middy was more work to wrangle in the water which equated to a better workout. caught way more waves so more exercise and my takeoffs were back again to normal. I had to put it away after months on the thing as although the surfing was based on longer lines with less abrupt turns, which was surprisingly enjoyable, I was having too much fun and was beginning to part company with my shorter boards. It only comes out for the days where it's literally impossible to catch waves on a small board, and I can enjoy actually catching and riding those frustrating waves.
What I found was the ease of mid length takeoffs had renewed my takeoff confidence and I was enjoying getting acquainted with shorter twins, now that I was popping fine. It was a long experiment, but I think one that has paid off and if your 20 - 30 something you've got this to come, but it's a long way off.
I don't know if anyone else has found this, but on my last two boards I haven't put tail pads on and I find that there's no kick pad for my back foot to drag on, which is something I've always done. Apart from not dragging the back foot I now find the deck is an open deck scape and move around on it with a new sort of freedom.

Where’s old mate uplift when we need him?

Good work once again, Steve. Food for thought.

I have decided you may not be able to 'get better at surfing', but you can definitely become a better surfer.

Steve, as an experiment, I think you should try a couple of sessions with a good surf coach, for example Jenny Boggis.

Reflecting on my youth years I reckon I pulled back on progressive skills when the waves are so beaut I wouldn’t want to mess it trying to hack that top tier manoeuvre. So loving the feel of a great wave and be tragic to lose it.
Looking at breaking down manoeuvres Luke a skate boarder or mountain bike you gotta practice practice practice. Surf is more vibe more fun more endorphins than that

A person can almost get better at anything given the right environment and a willingness to learn. The environment consists of many, many variables. As such, there are a myriad of reasons people do not get better at surfing. I have to laugh at surf coaches who try to delve into the psychology of surfing when they clearly do not have an thorough undertsanding of it.

It is very important not to let others dictate / influence what you might or might not be capable of.
There are so many "older riders" in surfing and skating that have maybe adapted their riding but are still progressing, it is epic to see.

I just wish i could go back to being a grommet and do it all again, my understanding of how to improve now is so much better, but once you pass 40 i think its close to impossible and i find i only surf as good as the waves allow and sometimes surf ten times worst than my best, getting older is depressing.

Currently at age 45, simply due to not being able to get to my feet any more, maybe due to a minor stroke i had about 8 years ago, possibly due to antipshychotic meds i was on and then immediately taken off of and put on something worse..Anyway since around hitting 40 years old being treated as a severely schizoid patient by doctors and put on heavy meds that make most people sleep for 18 hours a day if they are not used to them..as well as injections which caused tardive diskenesia, a muscle spasm like reaction where you struggle to breath and end up going to hospital every time it happens..Anyway all these things such as meds and gaining 25kg in weight,some episodes of binge daily drinking, going fit freak back to 70kg again then gaining it again....Stopped the injections a few months ago and am losing weight fast..Even so these days i can still bodyboard the nice hollow tubey waves around here but cant get to my feet on the good waves here any more...Also most locals hate bodyboarders here..But i cant get to my feet on a surfboard any more ..but living near two of WA's best two lefthanders, as a goofyfoot who could surf ok on a standup- hp shortboards, twin keel fish designed for indo and NW aus, and mini mals and longboards and sometimes get pitted on longboards all day if the wind stayed good..I didnt start standing up until i hit 17 while being a decent bodyboarder started when i was 11 and then at 17 (on average surf condition days) found a few 80's surfboards under my mates nans house and i got alright and capable at riding single fins, then thrusters then later on -fish the way they should be ridden, highlines drivey long drawn out bottom turns drawn out long highline drives down from the lip down into the bowl for drivey speed into a pit or around a long closeout section...shortboards dont do that without a few thrusts and pumps around a long shutdown closeout section.. and had a 4wd i could sleep in so went to waves fish and shortboards and bodyboards suit like many in indo, many on south coast nsw and had a great knowledge of south coast nsw reefs and beachies from my bodyboarding experiences and travels and friends..

I didnt even learn to bend my knees properly until i was 26-28 sometime- when a fellow surf forum friend took me on a surf trip on a good swell and he pointed out my faults i was doing every time i pulled into a pit or did a carve..Or even a bottom turn..I wasnt bending my knees properly and then boom worked on that and got ok and had many standup barrels longer than 10 seconds up to around 18 seconds at some spots..Simply by going on a surf trip with a better surfer than me who knew my faults...

watching Surf movies such as castles in the sky and seeing the ever stylish surfer Rasta in an Indian island, somewhere near the Maldives but not that close..Seeing his stylish layback cutties- i sat in my room visualized doing them at the age of 35-38 in a stage of my life where i was running through the bush regularly, doing 500 situps every second day and surfed my fave breaks on the margies coast whenever i thought they would be good..And had some people say nice things to me about my laybacks i started off with by in my bedroom visualizing the movements Rasta does at around 36-38 years old.

I never did an air on a surfboard until i was about 23 at the earliest, on a pretty powerful wedging wave sometimes STEALTHILY renamed as "A frames" in magazines... airs were piss easy there...Just paddle into a side wash, hit a set wave coming in from the right direction - when planets and sand, swell and winds align- then get a 2-4 second wide pit and there is a perfect launch ramp on the end..Its unavoidable to do an air off the section..maybe no grabs or spinny winnies or flips or rodeo clowns but a solid 2 foot plus air and landing..
Maybe the late learning was possible due to me having a good few managers and bosses in electrical trades, (and also choose your own shifts each week- servo jobs later on) who understood i had a passion for waves on bodyboards and surfboards and let me take hours off for lunch breaks if the swell and wind was good...And work it off later in the week when the conditions are bad..Awesome people i worked for and people stuck in a career where you need to go home and think about work and study and spend time in a study room at home or whatever invades your surf time, ambition to surf and ability too imo.
Many manage their lives with a good career where work is priority number 1 yet still surf well, but most good bodyboarders and surfers i know were committed to surfing and chose careers around surfing, where they could take off and work in any country with their skillset and awareness and have plenty of time to go on extended surf trips or have a surf at lunch time at work.

Matt Percy, one of the underground true chargers originally grew up bodyboarding shark island and other slabs started standing at 17-18 designing and shaping his first own fish, single fins, shortboards and continues today to make bonzers his latest passion.
He is just one of those guys that is gifted at anything he does and is still charging waves you need an 8'6 plus for in Chile and south American spots and margs coast...
The last time he rode a lid was at speedies with me on a 2-4 foot perfectly fun and empty of crowd day, not sure why, maybe money trees looked less slow or maybe some dont want the critical knife straight into the tube approach on a shortboard you need on smaller speedies days where its very sucky takeoff like lids need to perform at their best.Most standups dont seem to surf speedies until its 4 foot plus and not slow at all.Big enough for launchpads to peak up and roll you into the pit or big enough to stand tall and raise your arms to the lip to drag some speed from your board and wave..I dont know why exactly but any time i surfed speedies at below 4 foot it was empty and slow.To myself or with perce.

He later i heard him say, "that's enough bodyboarding for me for another ten years"..As he enjoys standing up so much more now and i do too but can not function the ninja to your feet on a surfboard any more..even on burger waves.Maybe i can at green island or medewi.

One bodyboarder commented on facebook one of the perce standup photos of him at shark island saying how disappointed he is perce started standing up when he was already charging and ripping on a bodyboard.
That is just a stupid comment, like "stick to your strengths" with sticking to your strengths i wouldnt have learnt how to ride a refined fish at 27 years old, learnt how to dance to breakbeats and other dance genres, learnt how to grow chilies..anything worth doing to make life fun and enjoyable..

Anyway i think you can improve get pretty much better than intermediate, learn how to get long tubes after 20 years old,do airs -"without tricks" and continue to improve and keep fit dedicated and surfing well enough for people to say nice things about your surfing if you are not a dickhead or typical old fried grouch sitting on the couch, bagging out alternative surf crafts in the lineup every time yet never go out that spot when its bigger than 3 foot..(some cronulla point first reef locals do this)...and think the whole of Indonesia is called Bali sort of types.
Anyway i think its possible if you eat your veggies exercise, have a job that is flexible, dont get married too young, if at all...Unless you meet a women of your life, soul mate, who doesnt want kids early on and your life to be dedicated to family life away from the ocean sort of thing, or be all about doing what she wants in life.Most of my gf's have been about what they want you to do in life, not what you want in life.
"What? you want to get married? Is this where i line up to lose half my stuff?"

Epic read as usual groundy, hope you get back to stand up surfing soon

I believe you can progress more with mental practice than most people realize. I was only able to visit the beach on weekends as a kid yet I practiced surfing every day in my mind by reliving every moment of every single wave I caught, over and over again. Not just thinking about each wave but trying to tap into what was happening on a physical level. It's not easy at first but with practice you can almost feel the physical movements as you practice in your head. This strengthens the neural pathways as is scientifically proven to improve performance.
Although I understand how important ocean-time is to improving, I feel it's wasted without doing the mental training alongside it.

Interestingly timely topic.

As I've found my interest in surfing wane, the surf fitness and enjoyment have progressively disappeared such that boards with more volume provide no fun, so the spiral continues.

Precipitation by ongoing lower back issues, creeping age and the ensuing decline in surf fitness along with its nasty cousin extra weight, the downward spiral is hard to stop.

So, I posit the question from my less than average view that should I return and improve from this state of kookdom to some level of mediocre competence, is that considered improvement? Or merely a marginal return to the baseline?

How does one measure improvement? Especially in the non competitive free surf average Joe surfer sphere? No points, no judging, no subjective metric for measurement? Is it purely about fun and enjoyment as the metric? Or are there other "improvement" nuances?

The GOAT gives some interesting bits away in this just dropped "interview". Talks about what he gets out of ongoing competitive surfing, how golf helped him win world titles, concept of neutral position when surfing and where he sees his future:

Forget about whether you can improve or not. Can you still enjoy it without worrying about improving? Can you be comfortable in your mediocrity? Surfing has so many more benefits than worrying about if you're at your peak. You'll have good days and bad days, but can you still come out of the water stoked? I had a session with a mate a few weeks back. Two of us in the water, millpond flat apart from the odd 2 foot runner. Both on Mals. Late evening stillness - Huey even threw down a double rainbow. All we were missing were dolphins. Speed runs on a 9"3' log. I didn't set performance highs that's for sure. But I came in stoked as fuck. That's why I'll always keep going back to the Ocean. It's also why I try to keep up some level of fitness.

The problem seems to me to be 'performance' surfing. Why are you performing? What level of performance are you looking for? You will always be measuring your performance against someone else. And it will never be enough. Just go and have a bloody surf. It was meant to be fun remember. Also, get onto a bigger board in your 40s and you can continue to get better. Too many old blokes sitting up to their necks in the water not getting nearly enough opportunity to practice new things on the handful of waves they get a session.

Ah always worth a watch - we have all had one of these moments

Crowds must play a big factor when trying to improve your surfing. I now live on a part of the east coast where the surf is relatively uncrowded, but when I tune into a cam and see hundreds out at Snapper, D'bah etc, & watch surfers weaving and dodging others in the lineup, surely that has to be an impediment to improving. That plus the lower wave count & when you finally get a wave you don't want to blow it. I guess the opposite is true as well, I lived and surfed at NN for many years, the high quality of surfing in the water certainly pushed you to improve.

Steps for maintaining or improving:
1. Fitness and flexibility - paddle fitness is obvious - lower back and hip flexibility is essential for your "pop up" which is where older blokes start to go backwards. Do stretches every day and watch your blown take off rate plummet.

2. Lots of waves - we all know about this one

3. Get the right boards, Mid -length for wave count when you're out of shape and a hybrid shorty that paddles is stable in take off and allows you to do the turns you want to do. Plus specialist boards for certain waves.

4. Focus on your hands. Getting lots of waves and doing the same wrong stuff will create neural pathways that will lock you into kookiness. As soon as you take off your brain has a template to follow and its impossible to change it once engaged. You need to kick off a new pathway. Your hands are the most amenable to manual control and they have a mechanical effect on the rest of your body. Thinking about touching the water with your trailing hand when bottom turning forehand is a good one - your hand positioning actually forces mechanical changes on your whole body - like you have to get low to touch the water this creates a new neural path. Backhand - turning your palm of your leading hand toward the wave has a similar effect.

5. Over 45 you need to ditch drinking, smoking and late nights. You should also start replacing the stuff your body stops making. Creatine + Hydrolysed Collagen + Magnesium L - threonate + vitamin D3 + zinc, seem to be what most docs reccommend.

"Improve" and "get better" are two terms that really are difficult to define in relation to surfing. I guess I was lucky and got started as a late teenager and after stepping off a skatey and onto a board it seemed I had the motor skills and sense of COG issues already sorted without any real effort. i.e I picked it up very quickly. I remember as a teenager seeing guys get progressively better over time, but for some, for whatever reason, they never really got much better no matter how much time they spent in the water.

To me it appears that like many sports there are 3 types of people. Those who are naturally gifted and without much effort do learn quickly and excel. Then there are those who through dedication and commitment and practice do progress and improve and eventually excel. The third type of people are those that no matter how hard they try, they never really get any better.

I don't get to surf enough to know if I am improving, nor do I have any real way of measuring this. It's more like I am having a good day and ripping the top of a few, or for some reason on the day, am having a bit of shocker and should have stayed at home. What I can attest to is that any advancement in ability achieved at a younger age is carried forward into later years. Even after many years out of the surf you do have the ability to kinda take off where you left off, to somehow innately draw upon the skills you developed many years ago.

Most of the guys u see in the bay just get more and more kookier... I of course just keep getting better.

Can you get better? Of course you can, and that applies to anything in life.

Are you willing to pay the price to do so? That’s a much bigger question, and as you get older the price for improvement or just staying adequate goes up, and the return on investment reduces.

All of us know where our sweet spot is, where we are getting more than our share of waves and doing as much as we want to on each wave. Who really needs more than that?

As for Malcolm Gladwell and his 10,000 hours, what complete rubbish that was. Have read a number of his books and the thinking behind them is a bit better than puddle deep.

The other question that people here have asked is who is the judge here? And how do you judge it, assuming you aren’t having yourself videoed regularly, and even then wave quality may dictate more than your performance.

Golf is a bit easier to quantify, you have a scorecard after every game.

I think you can get a lot more stylish. Is that an improvement? I think so.

A common theme in some replies is the right board as you age. Interested to hear what boards have been a revelation for folks as they aged... Assume there must be a forum thread somewhere on this….

I reckon you should ride a board that is the same as your body shape.

I do know one thing. The older I get the better I was.

As I stand Guinness in hand a bit dizzy at a bar in Ireland following being scared witless by some heft Autumn swell I have decided I am now ripping more than ever before. So, there we have it. Steve's thesis is false. The Guinness says so.

Can You Get Better At Surfing?

Of course you can so many areas to focus on surfboard development over the years alone will do that to a point.

Personally I go with and work at, "can you reach your full potential at your given age?"

Depends on your starting point doesn't it? And the waves you're trying to surf.

At 26 I spent a season in Indo and went from a competent weekend warrior to a much higher level. Now at 56 I'm back to weekend warrior and the annual surf trip away again. If I had the time and desire, I'm sure another full season in Indo would improve my surfing greatly again. But trying to eke out a tiny bit of improvement while surfing average Sydney surf ain't gonna happen?

Dont take onboard the 'Cos your over 45 now you need a Minimal' or you must go at least 10-12 inches longer than your usual Shortboard
Who started that Shit....Yeh get Fcked
https://vero.co/proctor_surfboards/MzNG-GVpCR6DkXmffnG51PGt

6"9 is a mini mal lol ^^

Improvement to me means having the confidence and experience to ride bigger and better waves. I don’t care if I go straight. That’s good surfing, being able to put yourself in the spot repeatedly to get memorable rides.
That’s what I teach my kids who don’t have the luxury of being fully fledged groms.
Turns are only a means to put yourself in the most intense section of the wave, or make use of it for fun. Doesn’t need to be the most critical turn to do so.
On that score, anyone can get better.
Of course, having the right (volume and length) board, staying strong enough to pop up with confidence and fit enough to paddle are essential pre requisites for this, but semi attainable in the gym.
Being a gun surfer is not.
Of course, a good surfer would probably look at me and laugh and say I’m wasting half of the sections.
But I’m on the wave. That’s all that matters

Have defo improved since I started surfing at 19 (now turning 30). Improved the most when I moved to Costa Rica where it was way more constistent (and warm) then East coast NSW. Then after moving back improved more when I started filming myself. Thats the only way to really know if your improving in skill.

Everyone reading: switch your stance. Then watch yourself improve greatly, and quickly; and learn some things to take back to your original stance.

My best adult improvement began when I started drawing stick figures (fairly detailed) surfing waves and broke down the biomechanics, then went out and did it.

I think i need to Surf Backdoor with Pops Ho
and Sunset with Allen Sarlo........Island Bay you coming

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I think you can improve if you want to learn, you really have to want to learn to improve and to pay the price.. for most of us, that will never transpire beyond what we can afford financially and physically. I started to skateboard at about 5 or 6 years old and street skated for 20 years, started to surf at 10 or 11, on and off, mostly skateboarding and body surfing, to get better at turns, i watched clips in slow motion, where are the arms, the feet, where is the centre of gravity positioned through the turn. I wanted to figure it out and i wrote it all down so i could do different variations of the same turn. I trained my body to handle the waves, the board, the gravitational forces.. i had a passion for improving. But it wasnt easy riding the worst surfboards money could buy, half sanded and waterlogged duds that were passed on at a much lower price.
I went to snowboarding a few times, back to skateboarding, and then back to surfing after recovering from several fractures and broken bones. I've had some serious surfing injuries both in water with flying out of control boards and out of the water on the shoreline and on reefs and rocks etc.. ive never had a surf lesson, i taught myself but ive only wanted to ride waves how they feel they should be ridden so mostly i learnt enough to know how to ride a wave in a few different waves given the chance, but ... most of us these days will never even get to ride a decent wave. The surf has become so crowded that you're better off going for a skate and imagining you're on a wave. Most of us will never even aquire a surfboard that will be refined enough to improve your wave riding ability they are made so quickly these days, and built so durable that most boards will last a long time and thats about all. They will probably outlast your body due to hips, pelvis, knee, back and ankle injuries sustained trying to perform on a non performance sled made quickly in bulk in a large factory..you will want to turn left and the board will not like it thus causing you to fall and the next wave you will trim frantically on every single wave you drop in on someone on, in between physio and doctor, and surgeon appointments..
I'm not saying improving is impossible, but for most people, they will always be a learner even after 25 years of surfing every day.

Unless..they ..really.. want to improve.
And even then, you may only get to a level where you can surf pretty good, but you'll probably never get any waves to yourself unless you surf some remote spot in a jungle somewhere on a year long surf trip.
If by improving its meant to be more of an acceptance thing of limitations in improving then most will improve and be known in the water as the talkative surf enthusiast who knows only one turn and therefore can ride sideways blindfolded and imagining a combination of turns to do on a wave is the furthest thing from the mind, they'd rather talk about improving than actually think about it. This is still probably classed as improving in surfing and is becoming the accepted norm in most surfing circles.
But yeah, i've travelled the world surfing different waves, made my own boards and figured out why boards work and why they dont even when they look like they should.
I'm not saying this to sell myself out or make anything known or unknown, all i am saying is it is close to impossible to become really good at anything close to resembling high performance surfing for most of us, as most dont have the money, the time, the patience, the obsessive compulsion, the drive, the intrinsic motivation, the support, the belief, the determination, the strength, the creativity, the flexibility, the freedom, or the desire to improve at surfing.
And even if we tried hard to change that for 20 years and then focused really hard on surfing only. Even then, you would probably need to be super connected in the surf industry and have an elite coach to get to a competent semi pro level of surfing in a short period of time, and then you might still be stuck with the cant find a magic board dilemma unless you can learn to shape and refine something that works to figure out how micro subtleties can affect your surfing in different types of surf.
My hope is that we can all keep learning and somehow get some decent waves in amongst the busy traffic jammed waves..
Or pick up a cruiser skateboard and chill out to some tunes.. who knows, might even figure out a new type of surf manouvre or style that makes it even more fun for the rider and everyone in the water..

I did my best under the lip slip into the tube takeoffs in my mid 50s at a right in the Ments. Warm water. Fit. Predictable wave. It just clicked.

Back home, I get flashes of that new skill occasionally but mostly it faded away as my fitness level is just a few notches lower and the opportunities to try it are rare.

Improve till about 20 years of age.
Then short term improvements for most are drawn back by mean reversion. Especially if access to quality uncrowded waves is limited.

51 now, started surfing at 17 on Goldie/Straddie area til about 26, shit happened and off and on til 48 and back into it full on since then. Took a solid year to get back to where I was. Living permanently in Philippines now, surf season on from about September to March/April. Heaps of good waves in Philippines if you know where to go. Biggest problem I find is if you go away from the "tourist breaks" there's no one else out. And when it's solid 6'+ reef or point and there's no emergency services and locals can't even swim, well..have to keep your wits about you, but that's how it is. Some days I see it big and perfect at some secret spot, but no one around for miles, no one out, and I take a pass, cos if I DO get into trouble I am well and truly screwed. Ride a 36L 6'4" off the shelf T&C Flux and a 34L 6'3" T&C custom Sidewinder with super light and strong blank and glassing, one of those "magic boards". Easy to lose surf fitness in off season, so I build it back up on the Flux and then bring out the Sidewinder and the fun really begins. I don't ride a mid length thing or boards "to make things easier". I make myself able to surf my high performance boards. Every time I go out I make a conscious effort and focus on trying something new, refine what I already know, get those fins digging harder at higher speed, throwing more spray. Still got many many years of this to go, no thoughts of slowing down, just going harder, haha. Lucky to have always been strong and fit, that won't change for many years yet either. Getting back into surfing fulltime is like finding that amazing woman you lost in your foolish younger years because you took her for granted, then you find her again and she's more beautiful than ever haha. The stoke for surfing is more fierce than ever, maybe cos one day it WILL end , so I just go full tilt while I am able. And yeah, I'm a better surfer now than I ever was, and in 5 years time will be even better. Fully focus on each wave to improve, and you will. Nailing moves never gets old :) Each time I go out I just want to smash it, not piss around "trimming the nose" or whatever.......explosive surfing is the way to go.

Be open minded to surfboard choice and riding a surf skate, get a lesson or two from a coach, in my mid 40s the difference was noticeable.

I think there is a lot of room for us punters to improve, if you’re awesome at 20 it’s harder, lucky I’m a punter,

There's been discussions about it before, but money will increasingly factor into how well you end up surfing. Living near the coast, going on surf trips to better waves - some people can only dream of such things, whereas some groms are living that life from the day they were born thanks to the huge wealth of their parents. I didn't start surfing until I was old enough to drive, and had saved up enough money working at Maccas to buy a car, a board, and finally a wetsuit. Being raised inland by a single mum, the idea that she could buy me all those things and drive me down the coast was completely unimaginable.

When it comes to my own surfing, it's much like you've said: the right board, a good level of fitness, and time in the water will see my surfing improve to a point. It's less the honing of new skills, but the sharpening of an existing fluency. Things that I might need to occasionally think about when I'm surfing poorly just seem to happen naturally. Floaters, deep turns that shoot you around sections, delayed bottom turns, unexpected cover ups, elegantly flicking off the back with my eyes set on the horizon looking for the next wave - there's a range of things that will feel forced and rushed when I'm out of rhythm, and will feel like a natural extension of myself when I'm surfing well. It's that feeling I'm most interested in.

Even someone over 50 could improve if they had one coaching lesson per month for a year,provided they didn't have any major injuries and reasonable fitness level.
It would help weed out any bad habits and introduce a better way of doing things.

I should also mention that while it is necessary to have some great boards in your quiver,always updating when the latest model comes out is too expensive and nowhere near effective as having a good coach you could talk things over with and get feedback from.

I believe it’s spelt ‘smivvy.’
UTFS

https://kalebrock.com.au/product/wave-pool/

Richie West once said to me “I surf every day just so i can get worse slower”

I don’t remember him getting any worse when there were pits around.