Submitted by Blowin on Fri, 06/21/2019 - 08:01
Have it cunts
Hey FR, I'll give the financial reply* to that one:
No, coastal RE won't drop - I'm not seeing it.
Yes, it has dropped as the AUD has dropped (international viewpoint)
No it won't drop, here's my 2c (not advice) on the fundamentals:
The virus has changed widespread perception. All the enduring you have to do in a modern city, the congestion, people, etc - are now tainted with potential virus. A lot of people are being paid (jobkeeper, jobseeker) and are weighing up what they want to do with their lives. It ain't being in the rat race (been there and made that decision myself, but to be fair health forced my hand early).
The regions have been shut down in places, and are protected inasmuch as they are that one further degree separated from the globalism, city, virus. They are clean. So there's been a gravitation toward them, especially coastal.
This is an enormous collective realisation, and builds upon trends I already saw: if modern life is exhausting and stressful, a return to nature can recharge one. After all, we are a part of nature. Strip everything back. I look at people learning to surf, and they get a chance to breathe out there, to pause and cruise (no wonder so many take up logs and gliding). It's a respite from the increasingly tech/surveillance/finance modern world. At the same time, team sports and ball sports are declining (look at the empty stadium seats, the off-field antics, the social programming now incorporated in the games) and people are tuning out, and back to nature. This is a good thing, but a good thing that is manifesting in very crowded breaks and mountain bike trails. So you have the acceleration of this already present trend via the virus.
I'm also noticing so, so many people taking this event as a chance to reset their lives and livelihoods. Most have some form of support, and now some time to consider their lives. Fuck that if I'm working till death for Company X doing soul-less mechanisation Y. I'm going to make a business for myself. I'm going to help people. I'm getting fit. You can check the data points - in the US the most recent rise in the indexes has a huge increase in small trades, and small traders compared to the big professional firms (how it'll end up is probably in tears for the little guys). Nevertheless, they are learning and buying education at huge rates. Homes are being renovated at a large clip. People are launching small businesses. I'm hearing many anecdotes of this. A family member is cleaning up in the US trading baseball and basketball cards! I just finished and made work my next piece of capital equipment today, very stoked!
There is a shift in how things get sold, away from retail premises to home & delivery. So if this is the case, why not leave the city and move to a coastal region, make that start you wanted to? This shift in buying was happening anyway, got madly accelerated by the virus.
I'm quite excited by what I'm seeing: it's as if a mad flowering of free enterprise is the natural default of people, it's just it's been hammered down by high regulation/high land & rent prices/having to work for others/monopolies controlling markets.
So all adds up to people wanting to be in nice areas and be meaningfully creative. I eagerly await the Freeride Nursery chain and Duck and Goose Exchange.
(Now the reality in 6 months time, economically, for all this awakening going on might be quite different, so always important to be fiscally conservative while you dream for the stars!)
*financial blurb always includes a clause such as: past performance is no indicator of future returns especially since we punted the lot on natural gas futures options
& nice work Fraser!
Free ride, where will see a drop?
Can’t see coastal dropping by anything meaningful. As VJ pointed out, the banks happily giving out payment holidays or interest only, this gives them more future profits.
Tenant lost their job and can’t pay the rent? Just extend the mortgage until the situation is over.
There is no ability to wind back the boom.
And if anything, this virus has probably done more to demonstrate working from anywhere is possible.
Forget it Fraser...gotta put up with Joe Rogan crapping on about supplements and shit...his own
Dumb ass. Makes Andy Roy look like Parky.
“The dog leg. That dog had four legs. One you found in my trunk. The other three went out with the information you're thinking about right now. Two people you don't want coming around here if anything bad happens to me.”
Joe Rogan just signed 150Mn deal with Spotify, pulled metaphoric finger to YT & censoring
He's the talk show host of the younger generation
Bit late on the uptake and in being so: is there any room for ideology any more? Media and politics is in a whole new place now? serious question.
Joe Rogan, younger generation??
UFC dweebs and 30 something incel types, now coming 'overground', notwithstanding?
All hail the new alpha Oprah!
Serious question (that's been asked before, with no answer), what is the Liberal party's consumer friendly ideology?
I'll give you points for the incels and alpha Oprah (funny!) but those early 30's incels created a green frog and changed the world.
The Lib's consumer friendly ideology is you're a consumer, be friendly.
Low EiQ amongst the (ironically) true 'snowflake' set changed the world FOR THE BETTER??
As some numpties might shriek:
What is it now? Triple down on the trickle down??
Even the IMF lost faith years ago now.
Never fear, the AFR and the Wall Street Journal haven't.
And of course OUR Liberal Party.
Facto, that whole theatrical LNP vs ALP contest scam hasn’t been relevant for quite a while. They both believe in neoliberalism which is defined by the trickle down mind set.
That’s before you even contemplate the ALP encouragement of hopping into bed with an oppressive totalitarian regime. No point picking on the LNP when the ALP is virtually the same party. Just cause they accessorise a bit differently, there’s no mistaking the fact that they’re both wearing the same outfit.
PS Have you ever watched Joe Rogan ? He’s just a rational , articulate bloke with a curious mind. The reason he connects with people is because it’s unfiltered discussion. There is no MSM dictates on what opinions he should hold. It’s like the Swellnet comments vs the old school surf mag letters section. I really like his shows. Some stuff more interesting than others but that’s just based on how much I relate to the topics.
To think that Joe Rogan is Alt-right or right wing or any thing along those lines is silly. He voted Democrat his whole life. To hear people squealing that he’s right wing shows just how removed they themselves are from the new demarcations of politics.
interesting little admission about scientists, the virus, and their 'objectivity'..
"...Asked why scientists have had this view, Professor Petrovsky said scientists “try not to be political” and do not want their research impacted adversely by tighter laboratory controls.
“We just try to base our findings on facts rather than taking particular political positions but sometimes obviously the alternatives may have unintended consequences,” he said.
“For instance, if it was to turn out that this virus may have come about because of an accidental lab release that would have implications for how we do viral research in laboratories all around the world which could make doing research much harder.
“So I think the inclination of virus researchers would be to presume that it came from an animal until proven otherwise because that would have less ramifications for how we are able to do research in the future. The alternative obviously has quite major implications for science and science on viruses, not just obviously political ramifications which we’re all well aware of.”
Professor Petrovsky said an inquiry needs to start straight away, not when the pandemic is finished.
“The idea of putting it off to the pandemic is over, it would be a mistake,” he said."
"“It was like it was designed to infect humans,” he said."
I suggested this months ago, so yes my 'confirmation bias' is kicking in...
I just find it most interesting that scientists deny that it is pretty much always subjective decisions that determine research, and what counts as 'evidence' warranting more 'research'...
this has been especially the case with this little virus
Yeah I thought the same thing. Reading multiple sources regarding the potential source (lab setting vs. natural setting) seemed like it really could've been either equally, or perhaps even the lab given (1) the type cross-species work the lab was doing with that specific group of viruses and (2) a researcher at another facility elsewhere in China was quite literally sent to jail for selling lab animals to a meat market.
I guess what I'm saying is, seemed like the rationale from the bulk of researchers responding to the source question was "it's extremely likely it came from natural setting because historically that's how it's happened", though many also admitted that too was purely conjecture. So not really a conclusion based on the body of evidence (mix of factual and anecdotal) based but rather....almost, preference?
Regarding the real estate question...I agree with VJ that this will accelerate any already present trend of people (particularly Gen Y and X now) of bailing on high flying corporate jobs in the metro zones and taking up work with smaller outfits in regional areas. Part of why we we've done this has seemed a bit tin-foil hat to some friends, but to me was always logical and I point to our current circumstances as evidence....how many SHTF/apocalyptic movies are set outside major cities/high density areas? What do people in this areas do (in movies and in reality, like we've seen with the Rona) do when the Shit Hits The Fan? They try to flee the cities!!!
Not only is life more chill outside of the cities (except during Easter and Xmas!), but land is cheaper (but not that much cheaper! and salaries often lower), and you can set yourself up to become less reliant upon "the system" so that when shocks occur you're more resilient.
I've seen some RE folk in regional areas (so admittedly there's an incentive for them to hype it) say they're already seeing increase in interest from city folk to have a bolthole somewhere...remember the news reports complaining about the wealthy city folk escaping from the the prospect of an I Am Legend scenario to their country cottages? Now put the ability to work remotely either full time or 2-3 days per week and hey presto....who needs a 4 bedroom house in the city? Just share a unit with a mate/colleague...
In saying all of that....If there is an economic crisis where banks are less keen to lend, and we see more permanent job losses, I'd think it reasonable to assume we will see RE prices fall in those coastal towns for 6 months or so. During the GFC, the biggest falls were in high profile coastal holiday towns like Noosa and Byron and Cenny Coast etc (I think Noosa had the largest fall of any postcode in the country?). Though they were also the fastest to bounce back as people rushed back in to grab a deal and secure their place alongside the rich Slavs and former pro athletes up in Sunshine Beach
“Life is a long lesson in humility.”
definitely preference, I put it down to tds, it's clouded judgement on every single decision of much of the establishment for years now, they just cannot accept he might be right about something
which doesn't mean its a lab disease, but to not look there with the evidence on hand is just blind faith, wishful thinking, fingers in ears I don't wanna hear it tantrum stuff, they disappeared scientists and destroyed vials ffs!
Freeride ....I’ll get back to you regards house prices.
Can’t be rooted right now.
yep no worries.
I wish I could share VJ's optimism but I just see another generation being locked out of where they grew up.
Big city prices and rents to keep a roof over your head, fuck that.
A 925000 house, which is just a wooden family home needs a deposit of $180000 to get in the door.
Plus the student debt they will accumulate.
Thats a hefty hole to have to fill in before you get to sea level.
FR, tell me about it... and 925,000 wouldn't even get you a bit of land where I grew up.
He who hesitates is lost
WA intrastate travel restrictions eased.
It’s going to be PACKED.
“It was like it was designed to infect humans,” he said."
I was surprised to hear this reported on ABC radio today, i was under the understanding from reading numerousreputable sources that we know it couldn't have been created in a lab and looked to be natural, i even saw an ABC TV thing think it was media watch completely writing off others that suggested otherwise.
Please Stunet give me an ignore button for Talking Turkey, Shatners Basoon, Dale Cooper, Factotum, Pupkin, and any new fake profile he decides to create.
"I wish I could share VJ's optimism but I just see another generation being locked out of where they grew up."
Then you'll love this:
In local uni news:
The abandonment of university sector workers by the federal government is criminal. It's like they are intentionally driving people out of academia.
Deakin University has played a very big role in rejuvenating the Geelong economy and the Federal government seem happy to gut the university and ignore the consequences to Victoria's second largest city.
"angry online, smiley in the brine"
8pm Australian Story - in 10 mins on ABC
Patriotic singers of Australian village of Mullingrad become sensation in lockdown Russia by singing patriotic Russian songs!
If COVID never happened the next CT comp would be the newly reinstated G'Land contest. Originally scheduled to start on June 4th. With a six week gap between Margs and G'Land, the pros would've been warming up at Plengkung right now.
Here's the G'Land forecast for the next week and a bit.
Looks alright, hey.
Lot of pushback initially for this comp, but I for one would have loved to see the pros going hard at pumping G'land. I thought the Ulu contest was a little underwhelming (can't even remember who won) but that forecast above would have made for some pretty exciting viewing.
couple of funky wind days but heaps of swell.
really need those trades to blow for Gland.
Scuse my ignorance but what is the best wind direction for G'land?
ESE to SE trades. Can't be too strong or it blows down the point.
All those empty barrels going down the reef. Fuck I’d sell my left nut to be there for that forecast
Well there you go, the weekend through Tuesday looks epic.
Another question, is it heavily tide dependent?
I'm ashamed to say, i've never actually been to Indo. Flown over it many times.
You can surf it on low tide Zen, just not the whole reef. Speedies wants a high tide
Cheers Goof, been invited on trips a number of times but the stars never seem to align.
Looks like a magic wave. I've had a few friends go over the years- reasonably competent to rippers and they all come away stoked.
Get there one day Zen you’ll love it
TBH Zen, if you've never been to Indo, then G Land is probably not the best place to lose your Indonesian virginity.
I've surfed from Timor to Northern Sumatra and G Land is definitely in the top 5 heaviest waves I've surfed over there. It's up there with nokandui, Supersuck, Deserts, and One Palm
My first session was 8-10ft Speedies and it was going underground. Took me 90 minutes to get my first wave and it's still seared in the memory bank. My head was spinning at the end of it, because I can't actually remember breathing after a big breath before taking off. I needed to chill for five minute after flicking off into the channel to get the heart rate down!!
G Land is a place that really exposes limited fitness and dodgy pop ups. If you're not super confident pulling into dredging left hand barrels over shallow reef, best to go somewhere else.
Cheers Vic, i'd like to think i'd ease into it. Kinda like a hot bath.
Rifles- now there's a wave that's got me written all over it. Bucket list wave.
Can multiculturalism survive the new Cold War?
By David Llewellyn-Smith in Australian Economy, Australian Politicsat 9:30 am on May 26, 2020 | 68 comments
The answer is yes but it needs to toughen up.
At heart, Australian multiculturalism is a post-modern phenomenon. It is the ultimate manifestation of global psychology and the death of God. Only in a world in which secularism dominates can such a society exist.
That is, AM is a figment of enlightenment thinking. It is a pure social expression of hundreds of years of rationalist doctrine culminating in a liberal state in which all faiths and identities can co-exist peacefully.
The problem is, it now faces a pre-enlightenment system launching a sustained assault to control it. The Chinese Communist Party is pre-modern and fascist, preaching a rubric of total social control, obedience to a god-like emperor, equipped with cults of personality, technology surveillance and terror.
It is unabashedly pre-enlightenment.
Victoria is the test case today for this clash of post- and pre-modern. It is the most progressive, read post-modern, state in Australia. It has a leader steeped in this value-system such that he is happy to court all comers, via The Australian:
Meet Jean Dong. She is the 33-year-old Chinese-Australian businesswoman who by her own description is on a global “journey of influence”.
A professionally filmed and edited YouTube biography provides an extraordinary insight into the life of the young woman who is emerging as a key player in the unfolding political row over Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews’s controversial decision to sign up to China’s Belt and Road Initiative.
In the short promotional film, Ms Dong claims to have played key roles in bringing about the China-Australia free-trade agreement, and Victoria’s Belt and Road Initiative deal, telling the story of her journey from student journalist in Beijing, to rubbing shoulders with Australian prime ministers and premiers and Chinese President Xi Jinping.
Even his own party can’t hold a candle to the embrace, also at The Australian:
Anthony Albanese says Australia will not join China’s Belt and Road Initiative if he wins the next election, after Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews was criticised for his government’s agreement with the Asian superpower.
It was the first time the Opposition Leader has confirmed a future Labor government under his leadership would not support China’s controversial global infrastructure and trade strategy.
When pressed several times if he supported Mr Andrews’s BRI deal, Mr Albanese said he never backed it and would not support a similar agreement with China if he became prime minister by 2022.
There is nothing intrinsically pre-modern about Australian Chinese. They have taken to, and contributed to, the Australian multicultural phenomenon as well as, if not better, than many ethnicities.
But the community is also claimed by the pre-modern state from which they come. And they are vulnerable to its manipulations and intimidation, if for no other reason than many still have family trapped within the clutches of the fascist state.
This opens up a difficult and perhaps irreconcilable question for AM. Dan Andrews does not mind exploiting the Australian Chinese community, indeed as a pollie, that’s his job, via The Age:
The Victorian Labor Party used the politics of the state’s controversial Belt and Road agreement with China as an electoral weapon to help the Andrews government win votes in three seats with a high number of Chinese-Australians in its 2018 election victory.
As the Labor government continues to shrug off pressure to walk away from its memorandum of understanding with China, a prominent Australian China-watcher has highlighted how Premier Daniel Andrews and his colleagues used the relationship with China to win votes.
A senior manager with Labor’s election campaign told The Age on Monday that the agreement, and the controversy it sparked, helped Labor gain the winning edge in three eastern suburbs seats with high numbers of voters of Chinese descent.
Mr Andrews signed the first Belt and Road MOU in October 2018, just a month before the first-term Labor government faced voters at the election.
In doing so, Victoria became part of the Chinese government’s $1 trillion global infrastructure investment program that its critics say is an attempt by the Communist nation to exert economic and strategic influence around the world.
News of the deal sparked a storm of criticism from the Coalition at state and federal levels, with Victorian Liberals demanding to see what was in the text signed by the Premier. Mr Andrews eventually bowed to pressure and published the document.
A senior Labor operative said the signing of the agreement itself was not a “vote driver” in the Chinese community but that the the opposition’s “vitriolic” response handed Labor the material for a negative campaign against the Liberals in the seats of Box Hill, Burwood and Mount Waverly.
Deputy campaign director Kosmos Samaras said the ALP’s “culturally and linguistically diverse campaign unit” swung into action, deploying Chinese-language media adverts, videos posted on Facebook and the popular messaging app WeChat, all painting the Liberals as hostile to the Chinese community.
Chinese language phone banks were also used to speak directly to voters, spruiking Labor’s messages.
And so we find ourselves at a paradox and impasse. Post-modern AM welcomes all. But the pre-modern CCP abuses that very liberalism to undermine itself with the long term result that freedom itself dies. Yet, if we cut off the flow of Chinese immigrants, the principle upon which AM is based is debased.
Moreover, the Chinese Australian community itself requires protection from this menace.
The obvious and brute answer is to import no more ethnic Chinese. But that is a hypocritical outcome that fundamentally alters the compact of AM: that if you come to Australia then you will be an Australian welcomed to practice whatever notion of divinity or truth that you choose to believe in.
A better solution is to cut all immigration. There’s no need to go to zero. Halving it will take it back to a pace that bulwarks our society against CCP encroachments.
We are not helpless in this fight. We can and are pushing back to protect our marvelous post-modern system. But it needs to be protected from a pre-modern state that would impose its will upon the entirety of our little Nirvana.
It’s now been admitted that Manchurian Dan signed the BRI to keep himself in a job. Yep, he’s undermining Australian national security to wedge the opposition.
The same Manchurian Dan who was going to allow a 300,000 people strong gathering of F1 fans as the Wuflu was threatening to spread exponentially . He was only stopped by the realisation that this would cost him votes.
Manchurian Dan has shown he is willing to jeopardise human lives and national security in order to keep his job.
He needs to go.....now.
Was it really only a few months ago that the real estate Ponzi crowd were still trying to pretend that the whole pyramid didn’t depend on endless immigration ?
The fig leaf is well and truly gone now. Developers screaming for the mass immigration fire hose to be turned back on.
Here’s the bloke responsible for the quote “ If millennials stopped eating crushed avocado toast then they could afford a house “ , demanding that his capitalism be subsidised by Australian society ASAP even if it means they can’t afford a house themselves :
““I am definitely not very optimistic at the moment, the economic shock is coming. It won’t bypass us,” Mr Gurner said as part of a property webinar…
“We didn’t support them [temporary migrants]. We told them to go home. It’s just the most insane thing I’ve ever seen in my career without a doubt”…
“We have treated immigrants [which drive the residential market] like the second cousin, when they have built our economy and built our cities for the last five to 10, even 20 years”…
An exodus of students drove a tripling of residential vacancy rates in the inner city of Melbourne in April, according to new figures published by the Melbourne City Council…
“The rental market had taken a massive hit. It’s my biggest concern,” Mr Gurner said. He said rents had fallen between 10 and 30 per cent, which if sustained would impact residential values.
“We’ve just completed 140 apartments with 100 of them in the letting pool.
“We’d normally lease them all in two hours with one inspection. We’ve leased half of them in six weeks”.“
hopefully we can at least now have some sane conversations.
thats the only place I can see a realistic chance of property prices declining: the inner city apartment market.
I can actually remember pulling into tubes at speedies and breathing like being really aware of breathing while flying through the tubes wildest sensation.
Ah, I see you are back after a short hiatus Blowin, with freshly greased eye-swivels too.
This is murder plain and simple, what the fuck is wrong with USA cops?!
That joint is going to explode one of these days and it’s going to be a bloody, hideous mess when it does.
This is so so wrong. And it keeps happening and happening and happening.
Those cops need the electric chair. Fucking cu#^s
Edit. This is not pleasant viewing. It’s hard to watch
Gees that is sickening hope they get put away for this the world is falling apart at the seams.
Balls of fire
And while we are at it fuck Rio Tinto for destroying those sacred sites over the last weekend bad juju to you.
I saw that on the news goofy and it was bloody disturbing.
In the US the police are trained to believe everyone is a 'threat'.
Fun fact: The Police Executive Research Forum in 2015 found that on average trainees spent 127 hours on training in weapons and fighting, and just 8 hours on conflict with de-escalation. i.e shoot first, ask questions later. And it's ugly head keeps rising again and again and again....
Talk about broken system.
Zen ~ a map for your Indo trip...