Vaccinate or not

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak started the topic in Tuesday, 24 Nov 2020 at 6:20pm

I was a little shocked at Alan Joyce (CEO Qantas) announcement that international travelers will be required to have a covid 19 vaccination in order to travel on Qantas flights . The government wanted to have mandatory vaccination but after the bumbling of its release ( it was painful to watch the delivery of that announcement ) they withdrew the mandatory part but it seems Qantas and other business may demand a vaccination in order to use their services. I’m not anti vaccine by any means I just don’t trust this government or a vaccine that has been rushed through. A jab followed by another jab followed by yearly jabs doesn’t sit well with me as I have never had a flu shot or the flu for more than 20 years. Plus I don’t want to give this shot to my healthy 4 year old daughter. She is up to date with all her vaccinations but this covid vaccine is new and not being around for decades like the others. Tuberculosis remains the number one as far diseases go and you don’t need proof of vaccination to travel so what is going on ?

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 4:46pm

And in other news, Melbourne CBD businesses have been told to prepare their premises and staff for a large anti-lockdown anti vax protest on Saturday.
People should chuck rotten food from a great height at these fuckers.

Roadkill's picture
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Roadkill Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 4:47pm
Vic Local wrote:

"according to the CDC website , raised significantly since I last looked 2 weeks ago . It is now 12% ."
Rubbish Hutchy, you're completely misreading the figures you idiot.
The figure you are quoting isn't 10% of African Americans have been jabbed. It's 10% of jabs have gone into African American arms.
Big difference champ. Do try and get your facts right.

We need facepalm emojis….:)

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 4:55pm

VL -https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/issue-brief/latest-data-on-covi...

Race/Ethnicity of People receiving a Covid Vaccine in the US as of Sept 8 .

VL -"The figure you are quoting isn't 10% of African Americans have been jabbed. It's 10% of jabs have gone into African American arms."

WTF are you and Roadkill trying to say here ? And you call me an idiot ! Are you saying they are getting it in their bums not just arms ?

Parrot said - We need facepalm emojis….:)

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 5:04pm

Go add up all the figures on a CDC vaccination chart based on race and it miraculously comes to 100%. Wow, what a coincidence!!! That's because it doesn't measure the vaccination rates of different races, It shows the percentage of vaccines going into arms based on race. 12.4% of Americans are African Americans. The figure is 10.4%.
Percentage of US citizens are Hispanic / Latino is 17.2%. The vaccination figure on the charts is 17.4%
Percentage of US citizens who are first nations people .8%. 1.1% of vaccines have gone to this category.
You are so hopelessly wrong it's embarrassing. I even told you in good faith you were wrong and you still can't admit it.
You even linked a article that proved my exact point, and proved you were hopelessly wrong.
What a piece of self humiliation.

Hutchy 19's picture
Hutchy 19's picture
Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 5:02pm

Vlocal . "People should chuck rotten food from a great height at these fuckers."

Again you blurt out what you don't know . The windows in the buildings don't open and no one is in them anyway ( especially on a Saturday ) . You will have to go in and chuck food at them from a not so great height .

English test ?

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 5:10pm

VL - from the same page referring to Fig 1 . which has the 12% .

To provide greater insight into who is receiving the vaccine and racial/ethnic disparities in vaccination, KFF is collecting and analyzing state-reported data on COVID-19 vaccinations by race/ethnicity. As of September 7, 2021, 47 states and Washington D.C. were reporting vaccination data by race/ethnicity. This analysis examines how the vaccinations have been distributed by race/ethnicity and the share of the total population vaccinated by race/ethnicity. It also assesses trends in these data since March 1.

It doesn't say what you say -"It shows the percentage of vaccines going into arms based on race. 12.4% of Americans are African Americans. The figure is 10.4%.
Percentage of US citizens are Hispanic / Latino is 17.2%. The vaccination figure on the charts is 17.4%
Percentage of US citizens who are first nations people .8%. 1.1% of vaccines have gone to this category."

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 5:44pm

"KFF is collecting and analyzing state-reported data on COVID-19 vaccinations by race/ethnicity. As of September 7, 2021, 47 states and Washington D.C. were reporting vaccination data by race/ethnicity"
Oh my, this is going to be funny.
Let's drill down on those state figures shall we.
The highest percentages for African American injections (on the website you linked) are in the District of Columbia (44%) Mississippi (39%) Louisiana (31%) Maryland (27%) and Georgia (27%).
The lowest percentages for African American injections (on the website you linked) are all on 1%. Hawaii, Idaho, New Hampshire, Utah, Vermont and South Dakota.
Can you see the trend yet dopey?
If not, I will help you. Fuck all African Americans live in Utah and Hawaii you absolute moron.

shortenism's picture
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shortenism Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 6:26pm

Stunet, good questions but you are talking about two entirely different things.

On the one hand you're talking about actual or potential issues with passive interaction with things vs direct introduction of a substance into your bloodstream.

I don't agree that people are capable of assessing the risks because they don't know what the risks are in the first place..? Surely in the absence of knowledge you don't just push on - hopium? Cane Toads, Carp, DDT, Thalidomide..

At least in the face of COVID you know your chances of catching it.

When has anyone who's forced to do something ended well for the person being forced? Your comment about being fashionable is another attempt to label / discriminate those different to you. But hell if fashionable is taking a stand and thinking about what is going on around you, then i'm in balls and all.

Roadkill's picture
Roadkill's picture
Roadkill Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 6:35pm
shortenism wrote:

Stunet, good questions but you are talking about two entirely different things.

On the one hand you're talking about actual or potential issues with passive interaction with things vs direct introduction of a substance into your bloodstream.

I don't agree that people are capable of assessing the risks because they don't know what the risks are in the first place..? Surely in the absence of knowledge you don't just push on - hopium? Cane Toads, Carp, DDT, Thalidomide..

At least in the face of COVID you know your chances of catching it.

When has anyone who's forced to do something ended well for the person being forced? Your comment about being fashionable is another attempt to label / discriminate those different to you. But hell if fashionable is taking a stand and thinking about what is going on around you, then i'm in balls and all.

Seatbelts, motorbike helmets, childhood vaccinations, health and safety standards in industrial environments, ……..

stunet's picture
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stunet Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 6:58pm

OK Shorty, balls in with it you are.

I'll chalk it up alongside 'Michelle Obama is a guy', 'Biden's ankle bracelet', 'Biden killed SEAL Team Six', 'Hilary paedophile ring', and all the other fashionable nonsense you've been balls in with lately.

You're as predictable as a train timetable.

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 6:58pm

School, compulsory voting.

shoredump's picture
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shoredump Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:00pm

Justice is served

His lawyer was given instructions on how to plead yesterday from ICU

Haha wow

Roadkill's picture
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Roadkill Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:07pm

https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/

The list is updated daily…and it is a very very very very very very long list.

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:10pm

Where's Hutchy 19 gone after claiming that "Blacks in America" are only 10% vaccinated?
He must be having an early night.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:14pm

I didn’t even read the shit and I know it’s blah blah fucken blah

stunet's picture
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stunet Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:31pm

It's fascinating if you appreciate shifting narratives. Especially when so many of the tropes used by the deceased are also used among media I visit.

Strip away the stats and see the lives of people tragically tied to dogma.

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 7:34pm

Busy Vlocal . Alright you tell me the figure and the link . Don't want any drilled down numbers . Just the total of all US .

I was going on Fig 1.as I said which said .

"KFF is collecting and analyzing state-reported data on COVID-19 vaccinations by race/ethnicity. As of September 7, 2021, 47 states and Washington D.C. were reporting vaccination data by race/ethnicity"

I have NFI what you are looking at . The figures I am looking at is 47 states and DC . That sounds like most of the US to me .

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 8:00pm

OK I will explain it to you again Hutchy19.
A few states don't record vaccination statistics based on race. Hence the 47 states and DC.
You were quoting the percentage of vaccines that went into African American arms, not the percentage of African American's who had been vaccinated. Big difference, The 10% figure is low because African Americans only make up 13% of the US population.
Go look at the state breakdown on this very reliable source https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribu...
The lowest percentage of African Americans who are vaccinated is in Iowa with 25%. The highest is Oregon at 75%.
Like I said, you have hopeless misinterpreted the data claiming only 10% of "blacks" are vaccinated. Even in the lowest ranking state, you are out by 250%.
Hutchy19, It's time to put on your big boy pants, raise your hand and say, Yep I was wrong.

bonza's picture
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bonza Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 8:23pm
Roadkill wrote:

https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/

The list is updated daily…and it is a very very very very very very long list.

Natural selection at work.

Snuffy Smith's picture
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Snuffy Smith Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 8:35pm

Blow in Hutch 69

shortenism's picture
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shortenism Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 8:41pm

Yep chalk it

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 9:06pm

VicLocal - I have checked and you are right and I was wrong !!!!!!

Very happy you have showed me that I misread and so misunderstood the chart I was reading . Will try and be much more careful when trying to interpret such important data in the future . I have proved Maths is not a strong point of mine . Sometimes easily mislead .

As I said I appreciate you showing me that the correct rate is around 30% ( don't quote me on this . It was the rate in an article I read and I didn't check the date ) and ensuring I don't give out misinformation .

I just got out of a meeting and made it a priority to check .

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 9:11pm

Well done Hutchy,
You're a bigger man than blowin who never corrects the record.
BTW, I haven't crunched the numbers but I'd suggest the actual figure is a fair bit higher than 30%. around 45-50%.

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 9:23pm

I will be very careful next time I question your maths VLocal . I wish someone else would have crunched the numbers and made it easy to get the right information .

How is your English ?

shortenism's picture
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shortenism Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 9:37pm

Another one for the chalk board - Dr Janet Young’s Husband & Pfizer
https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/r...

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 9:57pm

"How is your English ?"
A bit clumsy.
I'm more of a maths nerd with a penchant for stats, trend analysis, and multivariate analysis. It's scary how much I'm into covid trends. I could see NSW was in a pile of shit when new cases where in the single digits in mid June. There were so many warning signs missed by Gladys. It was painfully obvious to me that her lockdown settings were woefully inadequate and there was a significant number of undiscovered cases in Sydney's East and West.
So yeah, English is not so good, but I do have "on the spectrum" maths skills.

bonza's picture
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bonza Wednesday, 15 Sep 2021 at 10:28pm

There are 5 syllables in longitudinal hutch.

tubeshooter's picture
tubeshooter's picture
tubeshooter Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 5:33am

Hmmm number crunching is not my thing but lets give this a crack while I wait for my wettie to dry out a little in front of the heater before the dawn patrol . Forgot to bring it in before it rained. bummer.
a = x / y / z*100
Here x is the total first doses in the US (approx 210 million} , y is the % of the vax given to the black population {10%} and z the number of black citizens currently in the US {approx 46.8 million} according to most recent stats. {15 seconds on google)
therefore ,
a = 210,000,000 / 10 / 46,800,00 X 100
a = 44.87%
Very close Vic.

Cacadajy's picture
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Cacadajy Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 6:29am

Has been fun to ignore this subject for a week or so.

Came back, read previous 6 pages and, well, as things evolve with Covid so does this conversation.... kinda.

Anyway post on, I might even keep score today. Shorty you start on -5 because you are so committed to pulling in such random stuff from those dimly lit corners of the internet and mixing it with today's anti whatever gotcha headline that it's only fair to give others a head start.

And VL, double points today if you don't call someone the C word, triple if you don't use [email protected]#%, faaark etc. in any post.

Keyboards ready, Go!

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 7:23am

Very much appreciated Tuby . I will check with you and VL before using my own maths and will quote graphs with caution and a disclaimer .

Always admit when I have made a mistake . That way I can be right when I am wrong .

san Guine's picture
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san Guine Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 7:52am
Supafreak wrote:

@TBB , very interesting in the comments section, hard to believe that nurses that have had covid and recovered are losing their jobs now if refusing vaccine . What a shambles.

Hey Supafreak and tbb,
That sounds really bad. For the record, our hospital is redeploying any nurse who is refusing the vaccination (regardless of the reason).

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 8:00am

Lawyers will be the only winners , again . Will be the same in Oz .

President Joe Biden last week said that he will direct the Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) to mandate that employees at companies with 100 or more workers will have to either submit to weekly testing or get the COVID-19 vaccine. White House officials have said that fines will be handed down to those who don’t comply with the rule, which will impact about 80 million private-sector employees.

“No. 1, is this something the federal government can do as compared to the states?” Dershowitz told Newsmax.

“The states have police power. The federal government doesn’t have police power. The federal government’s powers have to derive from the text of the Constitution.”

It’s likely that courts will say that the government can enforce vaccine mandates but will argue that it is only Congress that can order punishments and fines, he said.

“I think the courts will say the federal government does have the power because this is a national issue across the state lines. It’s not limited to states. It’s contagious,” Dershowitz said.

“I think they will say that in the event that science supports it, there can be mandated vaccinations with exceptions.”

But such mandates are “generally relegated to the legislature in our system of government, so I think the courts will focus on that issue first and say that the president may not have the authority to do this without congressional authorization,” Dershowitz said.

“You can’t say it’s an emergency,” he continued.

“This problem has existed since the first day of the Biden administration, and it will continue to exist on the last day of the Biden administration because we’re not going to see an end of COVID.”

Dershowitz added:

“We’re going to see COVID become like the flu. Seasonal different variations, different vaccinations, so it shouldn’t be done under the rubric of emergency. It should be done under the rubric of ordinary congressional power.”

When the mandates are handed down to companies under Biden’s order, Dershowitz said that it will be a “big payday for lawyers” who will likely file numerous lawsuits on behalf of businesses and other entities.

“There will be individuals who will be fired, and they’ll sue immediately,” he also remarked. “There will be companies—and I know there are some already who said we refuse to obey this mandate—and we’ve had companies and states indicate they’re going to file suit.”

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 9:49am
san Guine wrote:
Supafreak wrote:

@TBB , very interesting in the comments section, hard to believe that nurses that have had covid and recovered are losing their jobs now if refusing vaccine . What a shambles.

Hey Supafreak and tbb,
That sounds really bad. For the record, our hospital is redeploying any nurse who is refusing the vaccination (regardless of the reason).

@san Guine , I was speaking to a friend ( male nurse in Newcastle ) he said fellow nurses were retiring early or just walking away. Not good.

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 12:22pm

Hesitants will only Vax once faith in Health & trust in Science is restored..
Each day that gap of Truth & Justice is tested more to the point of hopelessness.
NSW are callin' the shots on our Covid Freedoms...Exactly! (Worst example in history!)

NSW Ramped Vax Rollout has infected 15x more suffering & killed 6x more than No Vax.
Every single Time any Nation Ramped Vax duriing a VOC it resulted in an instant bloodbath.
Every single time any backpeddled their VOC Vax > resulted in fastest best ever covid cure.
More Hesitant Oz States all caught Delta but never bumped up their pre Rollout stats.
Any one of them are clearly more trusted & capable of opening up Australia than our Covid Queen.

NSW 2 week old data..
Vaccinated increasingly spreading covid at 5% more case loads / each week.
Unvaccinated are least infectious shedding 10% less case loads / week (currently under 50%)
If Rollout was left to run it's course then by today Vaxerz would be #1 NSW spreaderz.

Gladys pulled the plug & walked out...cowardly wiping her hands @ Axis of Evil flash point.

NSW report their Vaccinated Health & carers weekly test as highest Covid Frontline infections
So they ban unvaxed from frontline Health for bringing weekly covid rates down...Like that makes sense?

But hang on tbb!
Experts say : "Vaxerz make the best pets...They've had 2 shotz & Hospital Trained & will live forever!"
And who employs these experts...doh!

NSW (2 week old Health Stats) are now already 5% x 2 weeks behind today's NSW Covid reality.
Meaning stats are heavily weighted by (10-20%) in favour of Vaxerz.
Here's NSW Health 2 week old stats
20% of Full Vaxerz require Hospitalization of which 10% will die
14% of One Doserz require Hospitalization of which 5% will die.
13.7% of Non Vaxerz require Hospitization of which 3% will die

Again! tbb will salute NSW for sharing the Covid Crisis Stats.
https://www.health.nsw.gov.au/Infectious/covid-19/Documents/covid-survei...

Clearly as of now NSW Vaxerz represent highest % cost on NSW Health System & deaths.
As said Vaxerz Covid Health care is rising by 5% each week
Over 55, Overweight even Sleep Apnea patients were born that way & all dumped from Oz Health care.
Vax Rollout has bumped Outpatients from care... & reduced Health care to Phone calls.
Vaxerz then take well suss mostly banned recreational drugz & now queue for prime Oz Hospital beds.
So we sick & dying Hesitants are supposed to applaud Greed & self preservation as new Health model?

Stop & Ask! These Drug Scammerz sold us Less Covid + Less Illness + less Hospital + Less Death...
NSW Health Data proves beyond doubt, Vax Scammerz lied on all fronts & Drug problem is worsening.
TGA must man up...strip them of [P][L] Vax Licence & ban them from peddling Drugz in Oz forever.
...& why is ACA not kicking down the doors of these Drug Peddlin' Pandemic Fraudsterz!
(Dutto! Please Deport them!)

(Pause)
All read the same Oz #1 Covid Stats that drive Oz Govt / Health / Science / Business Policy..
Here's how Oz Experts read those #1 Stats....

Lock up any Aussies not prepared to Vax & spread their fair share of Covid to blow out Hospital Crisis.
Give 100% freedom to fastest Covid spreading Vaxerz in Oz to keep increasing the Covid spread.

Hesitants are rightfully fearful of Lying cheating Anti Science Anti Health Bullies spreading Herd Virus...
Apex Vaxed Virus spreaderz storm over innocents that cower from their ramped Covid virus.

Please show & share this miracle Vax data of reduced Covid, suffering & death anywhere in Oz / World.
If Govt's / Health / Science could lead with that...just the once! Pretty sure we'd all swallow their poison.
Either they can't, they won't or they refuse... so instead they lock up any that question their Vaxpertise.

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 12:18pm

Thanks TrueBlue . Great post !!! LicLocal - can you please check the maths for me .

When will the truth be revealed ?

san Guine's picture
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san Guine Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 12:23pm
Supafreak wrote:
san Guine wrote:
Supafreak wrote:

@TBB , very interesting in the comments section, hard to believe that nurses that have had covid and recovered are losing their jobs now if refusing vaccine . What a shambles.

Hey Supafreak and tbb,
That sounds really bad. For the record, our hospital is redeploying any nurse who is refusing the vaccination (regardless of the reason).

@san Guine , I was speaking to a friend ( male nurse in Newcastle ) he said fellow nurses were retiring early or just walking away. Not good.

Yeah Supa,
Can totally vouch for the retiring early/walking away position, same where I am.
Morale is very low.

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak's picture
Supafreak Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 12:45pm

@san Guine , I can only imagine the stress and mental health strain this puts on all involved. Takes a special type of person to perform these duties , which largely go unrewarded. My mate in Newcastle has a yacht and seriously thinking of just sailing away.

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 1:04pm

@san Guine , actually the medical staff will probably be rewarded this year , front row seats to watch 6-7 million $ of fireworks go up in smoke on NYE .

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 1:23pm

I really can’t understand why the US and Australian governments don’t take natural immunity into consideration. https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n2101

batfink's picture
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batfink Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 2:06pm

I reckon we will get to 90% vaxxed in NSW. Some suburbs of Sydney are already there for first dose. We’re clearing 80% first dose already on a State wide basis.

As we approach 90%, those who were hesitant become less so. The numbers of people who “are definitely not getting a vax” have been dropping over the last 6 weeks, as have the number who consider themselves “vaccine hesitant”. (A number of different polls have shown the same phenomena)

There is an effect studied in behavioural psychology, I can’t remember the scientific term but I remember it as ‘the bandwagon effect’. It refers to the subtle reconsiderations that people make about issues as they see more and more people jump on the bandwagon, so they go from “I’m never getting vaxxed” to “I’m vaccine hesitant” to “ I just haven’t had the time/there aren’t any clinics nearby” etc. As problems with distribution get sorted and we receive more vaccines the numbers left unvaxxed will reduce. I suspect we will nudge 95% vaxxed in the end, overall, with of course some areas showing much lower rates and some higher, just like now with all the other vaccines. You can guess where the least vaccinated parts of NSW are.

That isn’t a scientific fact, that’s just my opinion.

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Johknee Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 3:15pm
batfink wrote:

There is an effect studied in behavioural psychology......

As opposed to non-behavioural psychology?

Sorry, couldn't resist! ;)

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saltyone Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 3:56pm

Super freak - good peer reviewed article thank you for sharing . I agree- Why is natural immunity being overlooked ? Why do more harm when it’s unnecessary?
It’s just insanity. Absolute insanity.
All I can think of is greed from those who are already billionaires but just can’t stop?

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 4:57pm

France considers natural immunity.

bonza's picture
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bonza Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 5:03pm
Supafreak wrote:

I really can’t understand why the US and Australian governments don’t take natural immunity into consideration. https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n2101

a quick scan but that's a good article supa and I think provides nuanced reasoning behind their decisions in using a blunt instrument of all or nothing re covid vax. no doubt they would have touched on the risk and challenge of implementing alternative policy (natural or vax immunity allowances in the workplace etc) and how the vulnerable and or naive could misinterpret (naively or deceivingly) such policy and messaging by choosing to get covid instead of getting vaccinated..... with serious consequences.

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 5:36pm

@bonza , with an estimated 100 million in the US already having natural immunity, some of which are doctors and nurses , being forced to have a vaccine doesn’t seem right to me as there are still risks associated with the vaccine. They are considered small in the risk assessment when you compare vaccine to covid , however if you already have recovered and have proven antibodies in your system, what’s the risk and benefit equation look like ? The biggest problem is not all scientists and doctors agree as the article had various opinions.

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bonza Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 5:59pm

I have problems with it too supa. But as I said I think the article outlines how it’s complex. And I think the reasoning behind the decisions are logical not necessary correct.
Perhaps if we were r living in the disinformation age such decisions would be more straightforward?

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Roadkill Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 7:34pm
batfink wrote:

I reckon we will get to 90% vaxxed in NSW. Some suburbs of Sydney are already there for first dose. We’re clearing 80% first dose already on a State wide basis.

As we approach 90%, those who were hesitant become less so. The numbers of people who “are definitely not getting a vax” have been dropping over the last 6 weeks, as have the number who consider themselves “vaccine hesitant”. (A number of different polls have shown the same phenomena)

There is an effect studied in behavioural psychology, I can’t remember the scientific term but I remember it as ‘the bandwagon effect’. It refers to the subtle reconsiderations that people make about issues as they see more and more people jump on the bandwagon, so they go from “I’m never getting vaxxed” to “I’m vaccine hesitant” to “ I just haven’t had the time/there aren’t any clinics nearby” etc. As problems with distribution get sorted and we receive more vaccines the numbers left unvaxxed will reduce. I suspect we will nudge 95% vaxxed in the end, overall, with of course some areas showing much lower rates and some higher, just like now with all the other vaccines. You can guess where the least vaccinated parts of NSW are.

That isn’t a scientific fact, that’s just my opinion.

90% would be fantastic, 95% even better.

I think we will get to between 80% - 90% and the rollout will face real difficulties keeping momentum going. Hopefully, I am wrong.

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 8:43pm

"I think we will get to between 80% - 90% and the rollout will face real difficulties keeping momentum going. Hopefully, I am wrong."
According to a recent study in the Lancet, 5% of Australian adults are hard core anti-vaxxers. Another study in June had the figure at 7.5%. This study also had 16.7% of the population in the "vaccine hesitant" category.
Looks like the outbreak has resulted in fewer people in the never ever group and fewer vaccine procrastinators (especially in NSW and Vic)
I'd be very surprised if we got to 90% across the country by early 2022. Maybe for NSW and Vic, but the states without major outbreaks will drag the numbers down.
Vaccine passports and outbreaks are the two "best" ways to get the vaccine rates up.

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etarip Thursday, 16 Sep 2021 at 8:55pm

How do you prove natural immunity? Is there an antibody test?

Does it go on your health record like a vaccine?