Interesting things too

factotum's picture
factotum started the topic in Thursday, 21 Nov 2019 at 2:21pm

For when one interesting things thread isn't enough.

zenagain's picture
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zenagain Wednesday, 23 Sep 2020 at 10:44pm

Btw, cheers Vic for at least having the wantons to admit it.

I mentioned nothing about scale and I didn't dispute anything said above. My sole point was that both sides of politics are open to and engage in corrupt practices. At least Vic can admit that. Good onya mate.

views from the cockpit's picture
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views from the ... Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 6:34am

Reading these forums makes you wish there were assassins out there everywhere with no other motive than to "keep the bastards honest".

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 6:44am

Only one side of politics wants a fully funded and empowered Federal ICAC and the other has been blocking it for close on 8 years .... do you need a colour coded spreadsheet to determine which is which here?

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 8:34am

"Dirty money is just that, it's non-partisan."

zen, I post a list of COALition abuses. You respond saying you can't be arsed finding the evidence to support your contention that both sides are as bad as each other, then post the same claim again. This is beyond evasive mate it is a disinformation campaign to support your political views. If you want to post bullshit and not be challenged you need to find other forums.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 8:41am

"disinformation campaign"

Hahahahahah!! You really are a hysterical bed-wetter Blowfly.

Look out everyone, Zen's in with the Russians.

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 8:44am

Just another bullshit false equivalence argument.

Sure power corrupts but it’s been my observation over many years the right are the fiercest defenders of the rule of law and convention right up to the nano second it doesn’t suit them.

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 9:18am

Screen-Shot-2020-09-24-at-9-16-22-am

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 9:47am

"I couldn't agree more Vic, this mob are quite likely the biggest bunch of scumbags ever seen in Australian politics, the sheer brazen arrogance is quite shocking.

But my point is, blind faith in any alternative is ill-advised."

AndyM: Governments are like nappies mate. Unless you change them, the stench just gets worse. In 2019, the federal LNP was already seriously corrupt, Then Australia gave them the keys for another 3 years.
Only a complete idiot would have thought these crooks would clean up their act after the voters gave them a mandate for more of the same.
The reality is, most governments start out with a cleanish sheet. Unless there's consequences to political careers for corrupt behaviour, that sheet gets stained very quickly. We've seen 7 years of consequence free corruption. Is anyone shocked by the shit show we have in Australia?

D-Rex's picture
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D-Rex Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 9:52am

On the basis of your argument VL, Labor in Victoria will be out on it's arse at the next election.

Vic Local's picture
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Vic Local Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 10:03am

"On the basis of your argument VL, Labor in Victoria will be out on it's arse at the next election."
Were you not paying attention to the two branch stacking episodes in Victoria? The ALP sacked three MPs, the Libs just pretended nothing was wrong. I think voters know that all politicians are capable of corruption. They are also smart enough to realise that covering up, rather than punishing, corruption requires a voter backlash.
Labor will win again in Victoria because the LNP opposition is a pathetic joke who justifiably got smashed last election, and have only got worse since then.

zenagain's picture
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zenagain Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 10:15am

No mate, I didn't say both sides are as bad as each other, you're putting words into my mouth. I said when there's an easy dollar to be made dirty money is non-partisan. I didn't mention the scale or which side is more predisposed to act corruptly- you did. So if we are going to infer, I'm guessing you're saying there is absolutely no corruption, greed, graft, backroom deals, nepotism, cronyism, jobs for the boys, skimming off the top, pork barrelling, lurks and perks, handshake deals what have you in Labor, the Greens, Independants, One Nation? It's the SOLE domain of the COALalition is it?

Point out where I said one side is equally as bad and I'll apologise to you,

If you can't, well I think that's more of a reflection on you than me.

And as for your stupid picture above- I thought you were above that. Guess I'm wrong again.

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 10:25am

"I didn't say both sides are as bad as each other,"

No? Well what does this mean

"They're all as slimy as each other."

Are you really going to claim that "slimy" does not, in this context, mean "bad". Keep dodging mate, it's good for a laugh.

zenagain's picture
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zenagain Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 10:30am

And in breaking news, Maya G rode the biggest wave male or female this year at Nazare breaking her own record in the process.

Well done her.

https://coupler.foxsports.com.au/api/v1/article/amp/surfing/meet-the-bra...

zenagain's picture
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zenagain Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 10:31am

Glad you're amused.

Sounds like there's not much laughter in your life.

Happy to help.

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:05am

Lots of laughter, lots of music, 50 surf spots within half an hour, non-stop swell for the last six months. Never been happier.

zenagain's picture
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zenagain Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:10am

So why are you sitting there arguing on a computer and composing childish pictures?

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:24am

"So why are you sitting there arguing on a computer and composing childish pictures?"

Well the computer is in my music room so it's right there. If I'm not in the water I am usually playing around here with my guitars or cameras. Recording, editing video and photos, whatever The endless battle against bullshit is easy to fit in amongst more meaningful things. There is usually plenty of it here, though since Dude moved over to the editorial team things have been a bit quieter, just you and Indo mainly. Just my little contribution to keeping things factual and maybe making people a bit more cautious about posting crap. The childish picture is for Andy. He likes that kind of infantile stuff so sometimes I just respond in kind.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:56am

Your hilarious tanties are by far the most infantile things ever seen on this site Blowfly.

"NO! Labor is the saviour!
Don't contradict me!
I shan't!
I WON'T!"

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:58am

Stunning day outside mate, hope you've been in the water.

factotum's picture
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factotum Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:10pm

Wait up...wait up...Sweetie's on the editorial team? Here??

Wha??

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:30pm

I get Blowfly’s frustration, when it comes to the environment and climate it’s been decades of hollow promises, weasel words, lies, corruption and greed. After a lifetime of lived experience the bullshit can be spotted miles away so when people come to the argument with ill informed puerile comments, motivated by what precisely, it can very hard to stay calm.

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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:34pm

"The childish picture is for Andy. He likes that kind of infantile stuff"

Ha ha didn't have to wait long for that point to be proven.

"Sweetie's on the editorial team?"

Rumour has it he wrote "A Dive Into The Food Chain", which was actually very good. Unsubstantiated, but believable, particularly since he has been so well behaved lately.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:41pm

I'll say it again.

The Libs are repulsive, crooked to the core.

But holding Labor up as somehow being beyond reproach is ridiculous.
Labor is preferable but are a long, long way from being the messiahs.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:44pm

When you can control your dummy spits and tanties Blowfly, maybe you can think about calling what I post infantile.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 12:46pm

Guy, a "lifetime of lived experience" says not to trust any of these fuckers.
Easy starting point.

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:00pm

Agreed Andy, but more chance of change for the better from the left as I’ve previously suggested it will take many terms of incremental change in the right direction to be meaningful - from the right there’s no chance, they are fucked. The irony is the environment ought not be political at all just about the science

velocityjohnno's picture
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velocityjohnno Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:17pm

Kleptocracy on one side, gender/race wars (edit: and working class jobs/climate wars) on the other. Can I choose not to choose between those two?

factotum's picture
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factotum Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 11:04pm

FFS

Corporate media on one side, and....that's it.

Accounts for frankly ridiculous statements like the immediately above.

Jeezus wept...

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:32pm

Guy, Labor are not "the Left", I actually thought we'd pretty much reached a consensus on that on this site.

Even Blowfly stated it.

But agree, at least with Labor there's a slight chance.

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garyg1412 Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:38pm
stunet's picture
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stunet Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:47pm

@Andy,

Every time you write that my internal monologue goes to war.

I agree, but not wholeheartedly, so my pragmatic side says 'it's better to back the lesser of two evils', while the radical bays for political revolution, but the pragmatist says it's never gonna happen - two party system always and always with the same values, etc etc etc.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 1:59pm

I've said again and again that I would much prefer Labor, but to back them blindly and credulously would be so silly.

And thank christ you're having an internal discussion Stu, it's the ideologues who aren't capable of it that are a huge part of the overall problem.

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:00pm

Agreed Andy, I have written several times here that the political spectrum is to the right and that the ALP are now a centre right party but they are way way left of the far right religious zealots and ideological reactionaries that most make up the numbers in the once centre right LNP political parties.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:02pm

And sure, getting the LNP thrown out is the number one concern but flipping the bird to Labor at the same time is crucial.

For mine, Labor have actually picked up on this, so leading to an apparent change of tack leading into the last federal election.

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:03pm

Thumbs up Guy.

blowfly's picture
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blowfly Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:10pm

Labor is a centre right party and will remain that way as long as it is in opposition. Once in power it will be able to move to the left on social and environmental policies. There is no hope of any progress on the COALition side. Apart from their incompetence and corruption, they are moving further to the right on social policy and deeper into the brown on environmental policy. They are are also moving towards a much more authoritarian state. The only practical way forward then is to support Labor either directly or by preferencing them. If that makes me "rusted on Labor" so be it. Better rusted on to them than being unable to see the difference between the parties, being attached to the COALition or pretending that there is some other way forward..

DudeSweetDudeSweet's picture
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DudeSweetDudeSweet Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:16pm

So you think it’ll be ALP vs LNP till the end of time and we should just suck it up and keep chowing down on the ALP shit sandwich starring Albotross the Empty Chair like it’s the best thing on the menu ?

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:17pm

"Once in power it will be able to move to the left on social and environmental policies"

The word "will" bothers me Blowfly.

This belief that, if elected, Labor will change from a centre-right party to a left of centre party is just so optimistic.

The idea that Labor won't be hamstrung by its masters is almost unfathomable.

What about, at the very least, qualifying the statement with an "ideally" or a "hopefully"??

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 2:37pm

the shift to the left if it is to occur has to happen incrementally over 3-4 terms so as to bring the voters/country with you. voters need to be relaxed not worried and that is why the prime marketer won the last election, shorten the goose scared people more than, you know .....

stunet's picture
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stunet Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 3:08pm

I'd go so far as to say a shift away from the current neoliberal model cannot happen without some large, disruptive event .

Show me a party that's bold enough to go to an election saying they're going to raise taxes for public health, services, and education, and maybe I could change my mind.

Hiccups's picture
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Hiccups Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 3:36pm

"I'd go so far as to say a shift away from the current neoliberal model cannot happen without some large, disruptive event ."

A pandemic perhaps?

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 3:39pm

That event?
No one would wish it but maybe the poor management of the economic consequences of Covid that will continue to wash through the world for years, nothing we are hearing from the western leaders (oxymoron) should fill us with confidence, just more neoliberal tax cuts tripe FFS

D-Rex's picture
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D-Rex Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 5:17pm

You knuckleheads dreaming of a Labor victory are a very sad, deluded and pathetic bunch. But keep patting each other on the back and directing all criticism at the Libs and I'm sure you'll get your way.

stunet's picture
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stunet Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 5:18pm

@Hiccups,

You catch who Josh cited as his economic heroes a few weeks back, who he's channeling for his COVID response strategy?

Thatcher and Reagan.

Adam and Eve to the whole neoliberal disaster.

No, I'm thinking world war or climate collapse.

GuySmiley's picture
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GuySmiley Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 5:23pm

Hopefully I’m dead and don’t see that stu ....

velocityjohnno's picture
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velocityjohnno Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 6:29pm

Reckon ALP is more at risk of splintering as different interests' views diverge, eg:

https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/cfmeu-withdraws-sup...

Have a look at the most recent Federal votes in those QLD regional seats and Fitzgibbons Hunter seat nearly going ON and there's the undercurrent... a working class revolt.

JQ's picture
JQ's picture
JQ Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 6:38pm

More likely than the coalition in NSW VJ?

Hiccups's picture
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Hiccups Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 6:57pm

Yeah Stu. Sorry. My tongue was in my cheek a bit there. I know Covid won't be enough. *sighs*

D-Rex's picture
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D-Rex Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 7:35pm

Newsflash: Climate collapse currently happening in Victoria. Murdoch press (Ch 7) has just given the weather report for Victoria - record cold temps, snow and rain for next few months, resulting from cold Antarctic air pushing over the State. Murdoch again, the bastard (Rupert not Gra)! Murdoch probably hired the hotel guards in Vicco too! But wait, the ABC has just reported the same! And, what's this? It's just repeated 7's report that the entire Labor Govt ministry and it's appointed Health and Police officials knew nothing about who appointed hotel security! The Health Workers Union want Mikakos' head! Say it isn't so - Murdoch has infiltrated the ABC! At least we can still turn to The Age/Guardian for material which has only positive Labor news.

velocityjohnno's picture
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velocityjohnno Thursday, 24 Sep 2020 at 7:48pm

Hey JQ, I dunno, but stuff like this doesn't help (published today):

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/dreyfus-labels-frontbench-col...

Last time we went through the Hunter (backroads way in, north of Bathurst) it was going absolutely gangbusters, new mines, utes and tradies everywhere, hotels booked out. Graffitti on the road coming down from the mountains: "Jobs not Greens". This is the kind of schism I'm seeing.

D-Rex don't tempt me, I love winter...