Interesting stuff

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Blowin started the topic in Friday, 21 Jun 2019 at 8:01am

Have it cunts

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Friday, 16 Jul 2021 at 3:46pm

indo-dreaming wrote:
bonza wrote: "...higher quality of life than previous generations.."
plenty of data that states the opposite to that indo for the newer / younger generations.
for the 1st time in a long time these generations will be worse off then their parents.

Housing is really the only area, but thats a housing thread discussion,

I think it's important to look a bit more broadly than just material wealth, which I'm assuming you two are referring to.
It's already not particularly difficult to argue that for many, material standards are dropping.
And if you put factors such as a degrading environment and social cohesion into the mix, it becomes even more arguable that quality of life is dropping.

This CSIRO doc from a couple of years ago is worth a browse.

https://www.csiro.au/en/work-with-us/services/consultancy-strategic-advi...

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bonza Friday, 16 Jul 2021 at 4:19pm

agreed.

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indo-dreaming Friday, 16 Jul 2021 at 4:56pm

AndyM wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
bonza wrote: "...higher quality of life than previous generations.."
plenty of data that states the opposite to that indo for the newer / younger generations.
for the 1st time in a long time these generations will be worse off then their parents.

Housing is really the only area, but thats a housing thread discussion,

I think it's important to look a bit more broadly than just material wealth, which I'm assuming you two are referring to.

It's already not particularly difficult to argue that for many, material standards are dropping.
And if you put factors such as a degrading environment and social cohesion into the mix, it becomes even more arguable that quality of life is dropping.

This CSIRO doc from a couple of years ago is worth a browse.

https://www.csiro.au/en/work-with-us/services/consultancy-strategic-advi...

What bits of the report should i look at?

Im curious what areas you think has got worse?

On the past page, I've already shown evidence that many non wealth aspects of life have improved greatly worldwide over the last 50 years, some increased greatly over the last 20 years..

And i completely disagree that material wealth standards are dropping, days gone by people drove old cars, kids had hardly any toys etc, people really appreciated possessions and didn't turn their noses up at hand me downs, half the time as kids we didnt even have the things we wanted so had to make them.

These days it's all new cars, people cant even have a phone longer than a year or two because they need the new model, kids including mine are completely spoilt with way more toys than i ever had, you only have to see the stuff that goes out on the nature strips on hard rubbish day things that are almost new like bikes etc and people dont even bother grabbing them half the time.

In the 80s even the 90s that stuff wouldn't last 5 minutes.

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Westofthelake Friday, 16 Jul 2021 at 6:52pm

"Yet you went on a weird stat grab about crime in America like some binary code bot bereft of all nuance."

Now I wish I could write diplomatic 'observations' like that! Had a good chuckle, thanks.

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AndyM Friday, 16 Jul 2021 at 8:36pm

“And i completely disagree that material wealth standards are dropping”

What, like a whole generation not being able to afford a roof over their heads isn’t a sign?

And if you lived somewhere like Melbourne, Sydney or south-east Queensland, then it’s not unreasonable for a lot of people to say that their standard of living has dropped.

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Blowin Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 6:59am

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Blowin Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 7:00am

Here we go, here we go, here we gooooo……https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1416104577364017153

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indo-dreaming Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 9:14am

AndyM wrote: “And i completely disagree that material wealth standards are dropping”

What, like a whole generation not being able to afford a roof over their heads isn’t a sign?

And if you lived somewhere like Melbourne, Sydney or south-east Queensland, then it’s not unreasonable for a lot of people to say that their standard of living has dropped.

Has your standard of living dropped though if you rent a house instead of buy one?

I dont think so, they often live in better locations and nicer houses than if they did buy a house and have more disposable income because its not locked up paying a loan off or all the other associated cost with owning a house, insurance, rates etc (not top mention the sacrifices you generally need to save a deposit)

BTW. Although its true its getting harder to get into the real estate market, and im sure the percentage of people in their twenties for example is getting into the market falling, many people in their twenties still do get into the market.

And for any young person reading this that cant get into the market where they live, go buy yourself a house or land somewhere where its still very cheap, you will never ever regret it.

Thats what i did i bought on Russel Island QLD (still dirt cheap) sold that for a little profit to help buy my current house, but there is other places outside of the east coast near good waves that are still very affordable or buy a place inland to rent out.

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AndyM Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 9:10pm

Then we move back to quality of life.

Russell Island has been an infamous shithole for decades.
If wealth inequality and rising house prices force you to live in somewhere like that, your quality of life is most likely heading south.

You've just helped me prove my point Indo.

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Westofthelake Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 10:22pm

I never bought my house to 'get into the market'.
I bought a house so I could have a place to live, and so I wasn't paying off someone else's house.
Years ago I got to work with an aspiring developer and it was all paper wealth and appearances.
He eventually went bankrupt getting ahead of himself financially, becoming nothing more than a product of the great ponzi scheme in broad daylight.

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sypkan Saturday, 17 Jul 2021 at 11:08pm

Id like to do that funky meme inbed thingy, and really cash in on blowin's mussolini '...facism is a the merger of state and corporate power...' quote theme... but I can't be fucked...

Pelosi... corporations...

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/nancy-and-paul-pelosi-making-millions

these are the same people that rattled on and on about facism and corruption for years and years...

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Island Bay Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 5:45am

“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or communist,, but people for whom the distinction between right and wrong or between true or false no longer exists.”
Hannah Arendt on Totalitarianism

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Island Bay Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 6:18am

Jesus Christ!

I know it’s facile to evoke ‘1984’ at every turn of events - and I have been guilty of that - but this is truly alarming.

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Blowin Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 6:59am

And here’s what’s happening in France:
People in France who enter a bar or restaurant without a COVID pass face 6 months in jail, while business owners who fail to check their status face a 1 year prison sentence and a €45,000 fine

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brutus Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 10:20am

Blowin wrote: And here’s what’s happening in France:
People in France who enter a bar or restaurant without a COVID pass face 6 months in jail, while business owners who fail to check their status face a 1 year prison sentence and a €45,000 fine

Bring it on , wish we had the same in Vic , and NSW are learning the hard way about trusting people to do the right thing, as it just doesn't happen .

3 removalists come to Victoria on a Red permit , don't follow the permit rules, lied to tracers and were not forth coming with their information on their trip , as they knowingly broke so many of their permit requirements and risk a total of about $5500 in fines . What is the cost of lockdown , in $'s and mental health ?
A group of Melbourne supa Rich, rent a super yacht to go to the Rugby in Brisbane for $70 K for the week, get busted lying to officials in Brisbane and get a $4000 fine each . When the Qld premier was asked ," do you think $4000 was appropriate , she says thats a lot of money for some people!" Really?
In WA last week , a guy was supposed to be self quarantining , let tradesman into his house , had people stopping by to pick up online parcels...15 counts of breaking his quarantine conditions....sentenced to 7 mths jail , 5 mths suspended sentence , he is currently serving a 2 mth sentence!
So which solution would everybody choose, if you are on the receiving end of a lockdown , because of a couple of individuals bad behaviour .....especially those who can afford to flaunt the rules because they have money to pay the fines...??
I think there should be jail terms for the Rich and blameless , or in fact anyone who knowingly breaks the rules......if the people on the super yacht were jailed for a week.....well end of breaking the rules!

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Blowin Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 10:52am

Going to gaol because you don’t have a vaccine passport? Not going to goal because you’re spreading Covid -which over 99 percent of people survive- but merely because you don’t have a vaccine passport. Despite people who are vaccinated, and may carry a vaccine passport, still being capable of spreading Covid.

I’d have thought that someone who’s already been on the wrong end of criminalising histrionics resulting in goal time would understand the problem with extreme government overreach such as this. Remember that it was another variety hysterical clowns with their disproportionate fear of something who put you in gaol,

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brutus Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 11:43am

Going to jail if you don't obey the rules around having a vaccine passport , and what you can a can't do with or without one depending on the rules......in France like here, if you break the rules , there are serious consequences......just as we are suffering the rotten consequences of a couple of people's bad behaviour.......
looking at the Global data , more vaccinations the better it is for everyone .
yeah people are still dying and getting infected , but the numbers show less likely of getting sick and using the Health system, less people dying , but the vaccines have never said they were 100% , and we know with the Delta variant that it's about 60%.....
Will be interesting to see how the UK goes compared to France......the scientists/doctors say the UK is taking an enormous risk in dropping all the social distancing/mask rules and opening the economy , with 50% of full vaccinations.....55,000 new cases today in the UK!
As far as the system goes yeah it's rotten to the core , but I see this as a medical problem and not a political one , where the Pollies and the big Pharma's will make it about money and power....so I stick to the scientists..........fark you wouldn't want to be in NSW now, they blew it , and now everyone pays in one way or another...........
Just for the record Liberals/labor/greens/Nationals ...all just the same thing , politicians are one of the least respected professions in the world , yet we let them run out lives.....what does that say about us sheep , or not?

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bluediamond Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 1:03pm

The scary thing is what other information they're including on this vaccine passport. Alleged criminal behavior? Your entire health history. That sounds a little over reaching for what in essence is a flu vaccine.

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velocityjohnno Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 1:39pm

brutus wrote:
Will be interesting to see how the UK goes compared to France......the scientists/doctors say the UK is taking an enormous risk in dropping all the social distancing/mask rules and opening the economy , with 50% of full vaccinations.....55,000 new cases today in the UK!
As far as the system goes yeah it's rotten to the core , but I see this as a medical problem and not a political one , where the Pollies and the big Pharma's will make it about money and power....so I stick to the scientists..........fark you wouldn't want to be in NSW now, they blew it , and now everyone pays in one way or another...........
Just for the record Liberals/labor/greens/Nationals ...all just the same thing , politicians are one of the least respected professions in the world , yet we let them run out lives.....what does that say about us sheep , or not?

Brutus, agree with last parts of what you wrote. As far as UK and what will happen, we can already see in the Netherlands:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/netherlands-sees-covid-case...

So 55,000 x 5, per day is my guesstimate. NHS are already in trouble.

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brutus Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 4:26pm

bluediamond wrote: The scary thing is what other information they're including on this vaccine passport. Alleged criminal behavior? Your entire health history. That sounds a little over reaching for what in essence is a flu vaccine.

I don't have to worry about that , as anybody who has a modern smart phone has already surrendered all their information ...well I guess it depends what you use your phone for, but if you do a lot of personal business on your phone , such as banking /My Gov Id/etc...."they already have everything they need..........as everything get's harvested off your phone, so all the conspiracy theories about your personal ifo went out with smart phones!

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brutus Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 4:30pm

VJ we will see what happens between the UK and France......looking at all the relevant data from the Dr's and scientists ,who are horrified in what the UK is doing !
well so far the the politicians who try and water down the science end up blowing it , by considering short term economic gains , and we eat shit!

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bluediamond Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 5:07pm

Haha. True that @brutus. And not to mention social media profiles, cameras on every corner, drones....etc etc. Tin foil hat off.

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I focus Sunday, 18 Jul 2021 at 8:04pm

Brutus not to mention where you have been, what your routines are how long you spent there all available.

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brutus Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 10:50am

conspiracy theories......that's all they are....theories and stories of non-qualified people........

I just found out that France does not recognize the AZ from India or Australia .....only the UK .

I have to try and get a Pfizer shot to be let into France as I want to leave Australia in early Oct.....so the real conspiracy theories should be the political/Pharma wars going on betweenUSA/ UK and Europe ?

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indo-dreaming Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 1:05pm

AndyM wrote: Then we move back to quality of life.

Russell Island has been an infamous shithole for decades.
If wealth inequality and rising house prices force you to live in somewhere like that, your quality of life is most likely heading south.

You've just helped me prove my point Indo.

Have you been there?

You honestly think it's a shit hole?

To me its a beautiful little Island as are the other islands around it, i love everything about it, the ferry ride out there, bush down to the coast, lots of greenery, completely undeveloped, true local community vibe, (less than 3K pop) sure its not sandy white beaches, but there is water all around, fishing and crabbing is awesome.

Only downside is no waves, if i wasn't a surfer i could easily and quite happily live there. potter around the garden & get a good veggie garden happening, do some art, bit of boating and fishing, get involved in the local community etc, still be connected to the outside world by TV & internet. (100 times better than living in a unit in a city)

I'm surprised the prices are not much higher, if you lived in Brisbane or Gold Coast, it would be an awesome little place to have a little house to get away too. (especially if you were renting your main house out airbnb style at peak periods)

BTW. It's only one example of places still out there that are super affordable, there is other areas with waves, but im not going to piss people off listing those.

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AndyM Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 1:12pm

Indo I used to live adjacent to Russell for years, used to go and help my mate do real estate valuation jobs over there on a regular basis.

It's cheap for a reason, has been for decades.
Some serious social issues, heaps of substance abuse.
The cheap blocks are small and generally swampy.

Again, for the younger generation to be pushed/forced into living in places like that (as much as it has some physical assets) is not a step forward in my books.

So if

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Blowin Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 3:22pm

Anyone know which thread has the photo of the boat prop bitten by the shark recently thanks ?

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Craig Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 3:56pm
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indo-dreaming Monday, 19 Jul 2021 at 4:36pm

@Andy replied in housing thread

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AndyM Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 9:27am

It's about time Chaucer was cancelled, fella was a rapist, racist and anti-semite.

Allegedly.

https://theconversation.com/calls-to-cancel-chaucer-ignore-his-defense-o...

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stunet Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 2:01pm

Sandon, 1946.

The jetty was decommissioned three years earlier. Highly unlikely anyone had ever surfed the point at that stage as it was still ten years till Noll, Zahn and co. brought their malibus to Australia, plus Sandon Point Surf Club hadn't been built so if anyone did ride it they would have had to paddle from Thirroul or Bulli, then naviagate the wave on finless 16ft toothpicks risking a splintered mess if they lost it on the rocks.

Old jetty, dumped car, great photo.

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freeride76 Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 2:22pm

epic shot.

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Blowin Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 2:24pm

Epic photo, Stu.

I’ve been doing a bit of historical research for around here today. Turns out that there’s a high likelihood of there being an old shipwreck in the dunes out the front of my place. Stolen from Sydney by escaping convicts in the early 1800’s, lost up the coast and all hands never seen again.

Also that several gold mining operations were attempted around my neighbourhood. Time to break out the mattock!

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H2O Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 4:49pm

Cancelling Chaucer - not very enlightened Next stop burning books and back to the dark ages we go .

Great picture Stu.

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AndyM Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 5:33pm

Sky's the limit H2O.

Aristotle?
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/21/opinion/should-we-cancel-aristotle.html

Plato?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/2017/01/08/university-students-dem...

"An academic says classics should be cut from university syllabi as it’s so “entangled with white supremacy as to be inseparable from it.”"
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/515179-white-supremacy-classics-university/

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tubeshooter Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 7:18pm

Sidenote ..
There's a gruesome story behind that dumped car in Stu's post. It wasn't just dumped .
"The beast of Bulli " ,,,Mervyn 'Skulls' Garvie attacked the cars occupants killing one man and repeatedly raping a woman before trying to push it over the edge, then setting the car on fire.

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thermalben Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 7:34pm

Well, that just changed the mood of the photo.

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tubeshooter Wednesday, 21 Jul 2021 at 8:26pm

Sorry about spoiling the mood , but history is history.
A link to what happened ... https://forgottenillawarra.wordpress.com/2013/07/06/rape-and-murder-in-s...

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stunet Thursday, 22 Jul 2021 at 8:36am

Nowt to be sorry about. I'd heard of that case but didn't realise it was conected to this photo, which I see pop up now and again.

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Blowin Thursday, 22 Jul 2021 at 8:42am

I do remember stories of cars being burnt out on the point. Though the narrator never failed to claim it was retribution directed at tourists who dared surf out there.

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stunet Thursday, 22 Jul 2021 at 9:04am

Plenty of stories about those, some including surfers who are very prominent out there now but were on the receiving end.

Even got told one story about a news reporter from Prime who came up to do a story on the rowdy crew at the point, and while gathering their visuals and soundgrabs took their eyes off the news van. When they returned, the van was sitting six inches lower - all four tyres flat.

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sypkan Thursday, 22 Jul 2021 at 10:24pm

russell brand...

seems to have gone a bit rogue

seems a bit leftist too... collectivist... socialist even...

but I think I like him, a lot, and I never really followed him as a comedian

https://m.

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AndyM Thursday, 22 Jul 2021 at 11:53pm

“The media are cooperating in the creation of a dangerous myth”

I guess that’s very much part of what they do Syppo, whether it’s dismantling any talk of an alternative to neoliberalism, or pushing the “big Australia” angle or glorifying tax dodgers like Richard Branson.

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Patrick Friday, 23 Jul 2021 at 4:27am

Trailer for Dune - 1.1 million views in 5 hours.