Vaccinate or not

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak started the topic in Tuesday, 24 Nov 2020 at 6:20pm

I was a little shocked at Alan Joyce (CEO Qantas) announcement that international travelers will be required to have a covid 19 vaccination in order to travel on Qantas flights . The government wanted to have mandatory vaccination but after the bumbling of its release ( it was painful to watch the delivery of that announcement ) they withdrew the mandatory part but it seems Qantas and other business may demand a vaccination in order to use their services. I’m not anti vaccine by any means I just don’t trust this government or a vaccine that has been rushed through. A jab followed by another jab followed by yearly jabs doesn’t sit well with me as I have never had a flu shot or the flu for more than 20 years. Plus I don’t want to give this shot to my healthy 4 year old daughter. She is up to date with all her vaccinations but this covid vaccine is new and not being around for decades like the others. Tuberculosis remains the number one as far diseases go and you don’t need proof of vaccination to travel so what is going on ?

I focus's picture
I focus's picture
I focus commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 10:37am

I am still worried about the micro chip being planted up my nose if I get tested... anyone had bad side effects from this?

Pops's picture
Pops's picture
Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 10:46am

Found myself building an idol of Bill Gates out of transistors and switching my default search engine to Bing, which was a little odd in hindsight...

He who hesitates is lost

shortenism's picture
shortenism's picture
shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 11:11am

Found myself in training for when I meet Indo in the hunger games.

bonza's picture
bonza's picture
bonza commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 11:13am

chemtrails suddenly appear to be contrails.

san Guine's picture
san Guine's picture
san Guine commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 11:35am

I'd rather have a bottle in front of me, than a frontal lobotomy

troppo dichotomy's picture
troppo dichotomy's picture
troppo dichotomy commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 12:43pm

If the vaccine is so good,why would anyone be threatened by anti-vaxxers?

Pops's picture
Pops's picture
Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 12:58pm

A small fraction of the population (immuno-compromised people etc - who also happen to be a higher risk of severe illness) can't have most vaccines. Protecting them requires a sizeable proportion of the population to be immunised. Thankfully Australia has a really good track record of vaccine uptake, but if the anti-vax bs gained traction, they'd be the ones to suffer. (my sister is in the immuno-compromised group; hence why the anti-vax/conspiracy stuff tends to push my buttons a bit).

Another point is that if vaccine uptake is low, we're less likely to see things open up.

He who hesitates is lost

shortenism's picture
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shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 1:26pm

Always a good question troppo and a typical answer from Pops. Of course Pops you are looking after your own and full credit to that!! Believe it or not, the ant-vaxxers (as you put them) are also trying to look after you and everyone by pushing the point of 'pro-choice'. We all know its a slippery slope once a precedent has been set and shit gets forced against ones human right. We should all be behind that 100% and not stand for anything less.

Buts its Pops last line, which is the interesting one. Along with Indo you can see the success of this campaign. Maximise disruption! Wear ppl down! They will just be begging for a way out... That's when you roll out this absurd program of the new normal... Under normal conditions, there's no way in hell ppl would sign up to it..

The only way out your told is a vaccine....

Ppl like me then get identified as a barrier to people in reaching the new normal! You know the one which is a bit like the old normal with a few more contractual obligations with the state thrown in.

But its emotional and we all know emotion trumps logic (at least initially) in a sales and marketing campaign. Its like signing up for a fast cash high interest loan... Just do it! The purchase is exactly what you need, you will feel great and satisfied and lifted from your slumber... When in reality and usually reflection we all know how long that feeling from those decisions last...

So in summary Pops, if you're pinning you're euphoria on an outcome of vaccine roll-out uptake, i'd be having a hard think about who's really threatening your freedom.

Pops's picture
Pops's picture
Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 1:41pm

Shorto, the second point isn't the main concern for me, hence why I didn't spend many words on it. I'm dealing pretty well with "covid-normal" tbh. One of the lucky ones.

As for pro-choice - absolutely people should be allowed to make a choice. That choice ought to be properly informed (particularly by medical experts; full understanding of all ethical issues is important too), and as with all choices, the chooser ought to be aware of the consequences of their choice.
I don't think anyone has been arguing that people ought to be forced to be vaccinated "against ones human right".

He who hesitates is lost

Sheepdog's picture
Sheepdog's picture
Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 2:56pm

If you take the vaccine, then you wont have to worry about me not taking the vaccine. Don't have to be a rocket appliantistssss

Sheepdog

shortenism's picture
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shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 2:57pm

Got it Pops. Thanks, agree 100%.

I can't speak for everyone but for what it is worth I would suggest the majority of 'anti-vax' labelled peeps would happily be re-branded to 'pro-choice' on such matters.

Sheepdog's picture
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Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:02pm

Pops, where do you stand on religious freedom? As in , if the vaccine was developed in labs using cell lines grown from abortions, and a person is strongly pro life due to their religious beliefs, are u allowing them NOT to take the vaccine? And if yes, will you then religously discriminate against them as they try to eg' cross a border without a vaccine cert?

Sheepdog

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:05pm

Sheepdog, see my post above. Sure, I wouldn't have to worry about you not getting a vaccine because I can get one - but if enough people chose not to get vaccinated, people like my sister who cannot be vaccinated (as much as they'd like to) due to having a compromised immune system basically have to stay locked down. So I'm arguing that as part of evaluating whether you will get vaccinated or not, you ought to consider the effect on those who can't be vaccinated (as well as considering all the myriad other medical & ethical considerations).

Edit: didn't see your second post. response coming below...

He who hesitates is lost

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:15pm

Sheepdog, dunno if you've followed the "all things religion" thread - if so you'd be aware that I am a Christian of an evangelical bent.
So yes, the abortion material issue is one of the ethical issues that merits careful thought.
My current thoughts on it:
- Not all of the developed vaccines contain/are developed using abortion materials. E.g. the astra zeneca one does, but the pfizer one doesn't. So I'd be in favour of allowing people to elect the pfizer over the astra zeneca on ethical grounds. That doesn't seem likely to happen unfortunately since I don't think we have enough doses of the pfizer one ordered.
- If my only choice was between the astra zeneca or no vaccine, I think I would choose the astra zeneca, for the following reasons:
1. There is a pretty good biblical precedent that seems to tell us that it is not morally wrong for benefit from good ends that arise from evil means. My benefit from Jesus death is not immoral even though his death was. Dunno if I've worded that too well, so let me know if that makes sense. So (at risk of opening a can of worms), even though I think abortions are immoral (due to my belief that human life begins at conception - others disagree on that point & I respect that), benefitting from a vaccine is not necessarily so. Bit of a grey area at least.
2. It is a moral imperative to "love my neighbour" - which means doing what I can to protect those who cannot be vaccinated.

He who hesitates is lost

Sheepdog's picture
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Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:18pm

" but if enough people chose not to get vaccinated, people like my sister who cannot be vaccinated (as much as they'd like to) due to having a compromised immune system basically have to stay locked down"................... So the regular flu could kill her? Should we make everyone get a flu vaccine AND a flu vaccine cert as well? Where do we draw the line?
This vaccine has even been long term tested. Vaccines are tested over a 7 year period to enusre no long term ramifications. This vaccine was NOT tested on the elderly, those most risk of covid. It was not tested on pregnant women. But you want everyone to trust corporations?
I see these corporations will be supplying the vaccine not in individual doses, but in viles of 10 doses, to save money. Once a vial is opened, one must use all 10 doses within 6 hours. What sort of joke is this? This isn't good medical science. This is capitalism 101. This has NOTHING to do with your sister or sick people. This is to do with the "sick" economy. Ethics are out the door.
I'll take my chances NOT having this rushed dodgy vaccine that is already showing signs of failure in South Africa, and where folk have died taking it.
But YOU do whats best for you

Sheepdog

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:28pm

Regular 'flu is dangerous for her, yes.
Thankfully uptake of the 'flu vaccine is high enough that she's fairly safe from it - with the proviso that if a local outbreak of 'flu occurs, she stays home until it blows over.
Again, I'm not arguing for forcing anyone to do anything, just throwing out another consideration to take into account.

As for the lack of testing time, part of the reason for that is that so much money was thrown at developing these vaccines that multiple steps of the process could be done simultaneously (normally, you'd get enough funding to do one small step, then have to apply for another grant etc). Lack of monitoring of long-term effects is something to think about though, sure.

And as for the vials of 10 doses, yeah that's not ideal, but that's got nothing to do with the vaccine itself, rather the logistics of distributing it.

And for things like not being tested on pregnant women, as far as I'm aware no-one's forcing pregnant women to be vaccinated?

He who hesitates is lost

Sheepdog's picture
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Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:28pm

" it is not morally wrong for benefit from good ends that arise from evil means. "
Classic Christian hypocrisy. So you will inject yourself with a vaccine that only exists thanks to abortions, just so your immune compromised sister can go to maccas? Sweet.
Unlike you, some fundamental Christians are very strict on the abortion thing, as are many muslims, and hindus. Will you discriminate against them if they excercise their religious rights?

btw re' Pfizer. How long is a piece of string? They have used MILLIONS of foetal cells https://www.pfizer.com/science/clinical-trials/integrity-transparency/st...

Sheepdog

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Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:31pm

And don't get me wrong. I'm all for safe tested vaccines over the traditional 15 year period it takes to make sure they are long term safe. I've even had a few vaccines in the past. But this old buddy, this is a joke

Sheepdog

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:41pm

Sheepdog, note that I started my argument by saying it's an issue that merits careful thought, and that these are my thoughts... I don't think I ever said "everyone must do what I say"?
To be clear, I would like people to have the right to refuse a given vaccine on valid ethical grounds. Ideally, there'd be some ability to choose between different vaccine technologies on that basis too.

He who hesitates is lost

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 3:50pm

""" it is not morally wrong for benefit from good ends that arise from evil means. "
Classic Christian hypocrisy"

I'll try to explain my thoughts... being the agent of the evil act is absolutely morally wrong. Benefiting from some good ends that arises as a consequence seems to be no worse than morally neutral - the beneficiary didn't have a hand in the earlier death; what have they done that is wrong?

Having said that, no way would I ask someone to go against their conscience on this!

He who hesitates is lost

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 4:12pm

"If the vaccine is so good, why would anyone be threatened by anti-vaxxers?"

Threatened is not the right word

But i do worry that the take up of the vaccine will not be what it could or should be.

The more people that take the vaccine the more chance we all have of traveling again, plus hopefully all the vaccines have a degree of preventing the spread so obviously the more people that take it up the less spread.

We all gain if as many people taking the vaccine asa possible and the uptake is high, but we all lose if uptake is low.

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 4:17pm

@shortenism

You are obviously anti vaxer so what solution would you like instead for the world to deal with Covid????

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 5:46pm

It’s a good question indo is asking , I would also like to hear people’s views , I also understand that not everyone that doesn’t want a covid vaccine isn’t necessarily anti vax ( don’t really like that term ) just very cautious about a vaccine that is very new .

shortenism's picture
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shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 6:13pm

As per earlier post Indo, I'm 'pro-choice', not anti-vax.

If its a manufactured problem, to get a reaction and roll out a solution, then I guess you have to get to the root cause of the problem causation. Career politicians, political donations, information censorship, polarised media, global NGOs, fraternal organisations and all that sits behind them. If you deal with all this you deal with COVID.

If you believe COVID popped up so easy, then how hard is it for another style of thing to pop up.. Then another and another and another.. More lockdowns, more vaccines in your arm, more stress, anxiety, fear. I mean man where does it end before your system redlines if it hasnt already...

Whatever the WHO is advocating for hasnt ever worked. More ppl are sicker and dying of starvation than ever, while fewer have absorbed the majority of the worlds wealth. For an organisation with so much political and financial power its mind boggling that here we are. They are failing US.

Its a systemic change that's needed to the whole of society and its doable and achievable in a really empowering way i'm sure.

Groups trying to get things going peace-meal so hard slog but we'll get there possibly sooner rather than later.

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 6:21pm

pandemics have been with humanity since the dawn of agriculture.

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 6:25pm

So how should we be dealing with covid shortenism ?

shortenism's picture
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shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 6:26pm

So there u go, start growing your own organic vegies for a start.

Supafreak's picture
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Supafreak commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 6:36pm

Professor Clancy on the history of diseases in Australia, how the government and media react, indigenous deaths. life expectancy , covid 19 information and more , 1 hour video about 6 months old , I’ve posted it before. https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=xOm2JE3hGMs

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 7:06pm

Seriously shortenism you are a complete fruit cake.

The virus might have popped up through natural means or might have come from a lab (in which case it was obviously made to appear natural,)

But either way it is real it's here, if it wasn't an issue, many countries would just say, sorry we are not playing the game, and get on with life and not have their economies tank, but countries that have done this to even a slight extent or acted slowly have been hit hard, Indonesia was originally in denial and acted slowly and its now a mess.

While country's that have acted and even taken strict lockdowns like Australia economy are actually fairing better.

As for eating organic veggies, yeah sure its always a good thing but im afraid thats not the magic cure, if you are a high risk group especially older you could eat the healthiest diet ever and you still might get hit hard by Covid, occasionally even very fit and healthy people in mid age range get very sick from Covid.

And yes more viruses will pop up in the future, just like viruses have popped up in the past.

The WHO are far from perfect they didnt recommend countries close borders soon enough and even said not to close borders to China, obviously not being as cautious as they should have been because they didn't want to upset China, but many things they have advocated for like lockdowns have worked, just look at Aust and NZ compared to many other countries

shortenism's picture
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shortenism commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 7:19pm

How about a round table of different representatives to work through a series of options.. Not hand picked big mining and big banking CEOs.

Sheepdog's picture
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Sheepdog commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 7:21pm

Calling people who question one rushed vaccine thats never been tested on people over 60, pregnant women, and never tested over several years for long term effects "ANTI VAXXERS" is as pathetic as calling those who query aspects of climate science "DENIALISTS".

Sheepdog

san Guine's picture
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san Guine commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 8:49pm

I totally get that there are a myriad of valid arguments (as Sheepdog rightfully points out) to be suspicious of the vaccine..

However, the harsh reality is that we need high uptake of the vax for it to be effective, and it will be a yearly thing as this thing mutates, and so on it goes.

As a 1a frontline health care worker (as I've previously posted), I'll be one of the first in line to get it.

The benefits from having the vax, not just for myself (ie. I will again get to surf exotic locations) but to the society as a whole (business, arts, community projects etc.), far outweigh the risks.

So in my mind, although not without some reservations, the safest option is to have the vax.

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 2:53pm

Not sure if tbb shared that CSL are moving next door to the Tulla Wave Pool.
Can pipe Urbnsurf with AstraZeneca cordial & surf with the Mutants.

SA said the UK brew couldn't knock over their weakest Mutants, take it back thanx.
https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-africa-south-africa-oxfo...

WHO built up 3rd world Vax stocks with AZ... these revolve Africa region.
Meaning these goodwill packages will redirect to far flung isolate societies

Astra Zeneca Covid-20/21 Batch is rapidly being withdrawn from rollouts.

Restricted 18-64 - Norway / Sweden / Denmark / Netherlands / Germany / Austria / France / Greece
Restricted 18-60 - Poland
Restricted 18-55 - Belgium / Spain / Italy > (Teachers Union are Boycotting AZ 2020 lite brew)
Refused Approval - US / Switzerland
Rollout suspended - South Africa (Today!)
Approval under review - Canada are taking their Time.
Approval drags on & on & on - Australia (Was or is set for a tick this week?)

OZ CMO Paul Kelly : "SA strain is becoming the most prevalent in the World."
Oz is a major supplier of worlds most ineffective Vax against most prevalent strain.
Australia brags it's the #1 toughest regulator ...now it's time to eat those words.
World is chucking it in the bin...will Oz dismiss poor efficacy & swallow their pride!

If US refuse AstraZeneca outright then Oz will likely bin their home brew.
Not much support for denying Aussies travel to US.
Oz vax is useless against SA strain in 40 countries (Oz surfari options are fading.)
Aussies will need to import or pay Joycey for dodgy mutant Vaxes to surf abroad.

Boris made our Oz PM look stupid & we all know that's Smoko's job!
Calls for an Ozxit Mutant uprising...
Joycey! Go fetch T2 & load up 54m needles + A Squadron of Oz Tennis Mutants.
We'll give them smug Poms a dose of their own Mutant medicine.

Ok! So we gotta give the Poms a stay of execution!
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/astrazenecaoxford-vaccine-is-being-twe...
Maybe if they give us Aussies a free SA chaser...who's gonna say no to that!

Vax back on Trax for a minute or two...tbb is battling to polish a turd...it's still good!

PS: Scomo hired Pacific Solution zero Tax Lib Aspen to roll out 1st Nation Vax.
https://www.aspenmedical.com/news/news/aspen-medical-chosen-supplement-e...
Oz Foreigners not answerable to Oz Law...(No questions, like Detention Centres!)

I focus's picture
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I focus commented Monday, 8 Feb 2021 at 10:49pm

Current crop of vaccines have been tested on populations of 30K to 40K people.

The annual flu vaccine gets tested on 10K people. (told the other day by some one in the business.)

Delays in deploying the vaccine allows for the virus to mutate and possibly retender the current vaccines ineffective.

On the issue of testing it is currently been administered to 10s of millions soon 100's of millions keeping any problems supressed would be impossible.

None of us can say for certain that we would survive or not have serious long term health issue if we were to contract COVID.

I still have problems from getting Ross River years ago talk to anyone who has had Dengue. I know that they are different but implications are the same.

I would happily be 1st inline for the jab, there are consequences getting COVID and I suspect we all will eventually but without the disease.

philosurphizingkerching's picture
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philosurphizing... commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 12:57pm

This article explains how the latest mutant strains of the virus came about.
From people with compromised immune systems.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/02/05/964447070/where-did...

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 3:46pm

philosurphizing reveals the Mutant Lab hideout...great digging.

(Immune deficient) HIV, Malaria & Cancer Labs use coronaviruses as a portal.
This was the first step in GOF experiments for incurable diseases.
The spike was essential for experiments to deliver cures...only it got outta the lab.
The case you refer to would have been very similar to Evil Daszak's GOF Mutants.

What's of concern is the person with weakest immune brews most powerful strain.
Do we need Isolated Islands for HIV / Cancer wards?
Is it possible this was the reason for Island Quarantine in past pandemics.
States are already looking to move Quarantine out of cities...A lot to weigh up here!

Win the Nobel Prize if you post pack their everchanging freak back to the Bat Lab
Easier said than Done!

troppo dichotomy's picture
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troppo dichotomy commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 5:39pm

I've had both the vivax and falciparum malaria.should i be concerned about any complications from the covid vax?

I focus's picture
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I focus commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 7:19pm

TD I would certainly be speaking to a quack about it.

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velocityjohnno commented Tuesday, 9 Feb 2021 at 7:23pm

"Do we need Isolated Islands for HIV / Cancer wards?"

tbb that would depend, would their nurses catch the virus at their fav restaurant out in the community, and then go to work, or are we talking proper isolation?

OK update, that link was very good, I am on one of the treatments the poor patient was on. His experience did not look like fun at all. From what I can gather 2nd hand from those who look after my condition in Oz, the UK has decent research and infrastructure for it, and they have anecdotal evidence but not enough data/cases to determine anything concrete. Most with my condition that get the kung flu go OK, they get over it. There's one death that I know of, in an older patient. Also, there seems no definite big reactions to the vaccines beyond a bit of irritation/soreness.
Very interesting the Regeneron monoclonal antibodies were used (also on Greg N??), if they work anything like monoclonal inhibitors as I understand them, they might coat the cells and slow/stop the spike protein doing its thing? Usually they stop someone's own immune system this way - that's all said with my very layman's idea of it!

Given it's thought the mutations are making current vaccines less effective, we really are in a good place here in Oz compared to UK or US/Europe.

batfink's picture
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batfink commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 12:10am

A lot of emotion in this debate, fair enough.

Heard the Professor Clancy podcast Supafreak. All good, but Prof Clancy, by his own admission is not an epidemiologist, and has been retired for some years. He is nowhere near the cutting edge, and readily admits to that.

Re vaccine, nobody in Oz is going to be forced to take it, and many will be advised against it, pregnant women, immune-compromised, anaphylaxis inclined, etc. . Don’t stress, if you don’t want to take it, you won’t have to.

As for using Ivermectin, that’s fine, but it’s a drug that is used used to treat parasite infections in animals. If you think that this is comparable to using a vaccine that has been used in 10’s of millions of human beings overseas, with the results of vaccination being studied relentlessly by honest medical practitioners, then you are free to think this through for yourself.

Vaccination that has substantial human trials and real life actual human beings in countries such as UK and the US, all of Europe and other parts, versus Ivermectin which is a drug used to treat horses with parasites, and is not approved by the WHO for human use (your links Supafreak, I checked ‘em) and almost certainly has no real effect (how Cana parasite drug cure a virus, ffs) then it is entirely within your prerogative to choose Ivermectin over a vaccine, provided Ivermectin can get through the human trials to show that it’s safe. Remember also that hydroxychloroquine also is used for humans, but has some serious side effects which are researched and accepted.

So if you think Ivermectin is a better bet than a vaccine, you go for it. I think your risk analysis methodology is somewhat flawed, but there you go.

I will be happy to get either vaccine, whether it is astra Zeneca or Pfizer, but there is no way I will take a horse anti-parasitic drug. If, Ivermectin gets through all the testing that the vaccines have (for human use to combat Covid) I’ll be happy to take that too, but it hasn’t, it’s a horse drug, it’s an anti-parasitic (tapeworms, ring worms) and the likelihood that an anti-parasitic drug is effective against a virus is a million to one.

But it’s not impossible, fuck, anyone who buys a lotto ticket is taking odds that make that look very attractive.

But again, are they saying it’s a vaccine or a treatment? It’s important, because a treatment is about shutting the door after the horse has bolted. A vaccine bolts the door before the horse gets out, affected by parasites or not.

Can you guys please post any links that aren’t from Fox News, trial news or the fllccc. It just invites people like me to think you aren’t really taking this seriously.

Basically, anything from the Murdoch stable is seriously compromised, it isn’t credible.

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Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 4:57am

Batfink yes ivermectin is used in animals it’s also been used on 3.5 billion people over 40 odd years to treat river blindness and other things like scabies , batfink look at how and why ivermectin is used in the treatment of covid , it’s one of many early treatment drugs and look how many countries have adopted it , it’s also successful against the new strains so please mate do your research.

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Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 5:25am

Batfink can you please show where I have said ivermectin is better than a vaccine , your all over the shop , can you also tell me how many icu patients with covid your experts have treated . Then can you explain why the UK and Japan are now doing trials for ivermectin ? Mate you are ignoring what’s going on in the real world . It’s a treatment that has great success if used early and still has a significant efficiency in later treatment but not as good as early treatment. Do you think the FLCCC are up to speed ?

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Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 5:43am

You speak total crap when you say ivermectin is not approved for human use by WHO , it’s on their list of essential medicines , wow I don’t know where you get your information ( rum bottle maybe ) but your peddling misinformation. https://www.who.int/selection_medicines/committees/expert/20/EML_2015_FI... Scroll down and look at page 6

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Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 5:46am

How about some links to support your claims batfink

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Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 10:21am

Don’t you think rather than look at who’s broadcasting the news you should look at the credentials of the doctors who are speaking on the channel ? The professor from Yale university who was part of a team of 50 doctors that did the study on hydroxy is no idiot , a smear campaign was set up because you can’t rollout a new trialed vaccine in emergency response if there is a known treatment in the US . For the last time batfink ivermectin is a treatment and a preventive it’s not a vaccine and by the way batfink a vaccine doesn’t prevent you from getting the disease it is helps your immune system to respond to it , ivermectin and the other drugs used in the formula as treatment stop the replication of the disease so that it doesn’t go full blown covid 19 , read up mate .

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 1:51pm

supafreak has reported many times that Ivermectin is approved in Oz.

Ivermectin is approved in Australia as Covid preventative & treatment medication.
As the world knows...Australia is the toughest drug regulator & they approved it!
FDA / TGA approved Off Label Tri-Pack is legally prescribed through your GP.
Off Labels make up 60% of all Oz scripts...more normal than not.
It is not Govt promoted & nor will they Stamp a non donor's { VIP Vax Certificate }
https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/ivermectin-triple-therapy-protocol-cov...

AstraZeneca is an emergency experimental Vax that is still under Trial thru rollout.
AstraZeneca is not approved for use in Australia or US & is not world accepted.
AZ vax would not get you entry into Australia or US & certainly not South Africa.

Aussies don't give a fuck & will queue for non approved experimental drug that kills.
Nothing too sciency about that...Aussies always queue for fucked up Drugz.

What does Australian Chief Medical Officer Paul Kelly have to say:
"South Africa Covid strain is becoming the most prevalent in the World!"

What then does South Africa Health say :
"AstraZeneca is least effective against our Covid Strain!"

Pause: tbb expects 99.9% to argue against both claims & we're all fine with that.

So now more Aussies queue for now useless, unapproved, experimental Vax.
Admittedly tbb has had days where he thought what's the point.
But in deepest depression would never dream of joining such a mental queue!

Read our Mental NEWS

OZ Media hex a ban on our only Oz approved Ivermectin Covid Medicare Script.
Not that anyone even knows or cares...still they'll out you as #1 World criminal.

Scovid's Phase 4 Rolling Covid Cloud Vaccination fogs out another CBD.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9242931/Melbourne-Holiday-Inn-h...

23 Young-Middle aged Indian Doctors have died after AstraZeneca Vax.
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/india-deaths-post-vaccine-raise-al...
Oz reply : Just pop into yer local Chem Warehouse for your Astra Nitschke brew.

WHO Mission Control : "Dirty disgusting Aussie Frozen Market Beef is the origin of Covid."
https://eminetra.co.nz/who-investigators-back-chinas-claim-australian-be...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9240903/WHO-investigators-China...

WHO are Batshit crazy...
Ignore their ransom & do the opposite to what they demand if you wanna live.

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak's picture
Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 2:58pm

TBB , I must have it wrong then , when I looked on Australian government website for treatment , the recommendations were against ivermectin but ok for remdesivir ? And I’ve heard doctors can be fined for prescribing HCQ for covid treatment ? ? Has this recently changed ? Plus when I say ivermectin is a treatment and preventive , the preventive doesn’t stop you getting it ( virus ) it stops you getting sick with it . This has been trialled in India with 800 frontline healthcare workers , 100% in the ivermectin group did not get sick , from memory I think it was 52% in the placebo group did get sick , this is a observation trial so it doesn’t count and Dr Hill only used randomised trails in his assessment to NIH in the US and to his findings to WHO . But what does our media say ? Best we get our advice from the today show , what do ya reckon ?

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak's picture
Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 1:29pm

Batfink if you have any questions here is FAQ from the FLCCC on ivermectin, math + and I MASK , if you don’t like FLCCC have a quick google of (individualy )who these doctors are and what have they achieved in their careers , all the doctors I have spoken about Borody , FLCCC , Hill , Clancy stand to gain nothing from promoting ivermectin and put their credibility and careers on the line , Borody in particular must be a multi millionaire with his 4 patterns and his practice . His advice on different areas is sought from around the world . https://covid19criticalcare.com/i-mask-prophylaxis-treatment-protocol/fa...

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak's picture
Supafreak commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 2:56pm

TBB , that 2nd to last link was a bewdy , Australian beef hey , can’t blame them for banning our products but I bet the billionaires are still eating our crayfish

truebluebasher's picture
truebluebasher's picture
truebluebasher commented Wednesday, 10 Feb 2021 at 3:55pm

Supafreak...here's a 2020 swellnet link to Medicare Ivermectin in Craig's Ward
https://www.swellnet.com/comment/707663
18th Dec 2020 tbb posted exactly the same...only in greater detail.
Sorry! If tbb misled that we discussed or posted this on Supafreak's vax site.

tbb thought all knew that Ivermectin Covid treatment was on Medicare. (Sorry!)
8th Sept 2020 - Melbourne GP says Ivermectin treatment is very effective
https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6188680157001
This is why tbb was outraged that "Craig Kelly" was bullied over GP Medicare cure.
Seriously thought that Labor + Libs + Media had crossed the line & they have.

Pause! tbb has not read of any cancellation of Medicare Ivermectin Treatment.
If this has occurred then please share & tbb will ad a Caution to these posts!

Anyhow! We're all on the same page in verifying that Ivermectin is approved in Oz.
Again! Ivermectin does not win you a { VIP Vax Pass }

Said too much...{buzzer} Hypno *Mutant TV*...One of Us One of Us One of Us.
Think that's Funny! Today Victoria just declared tbb a Mutant...(Again! Not Funny!)

tbb travels with a CPAP unit...Don't Tell me : "tbb is one of those!" Yep! A Borg!
Dan says tbb is confined to 14 days in the Mutant Ward before an Urbnsurf sesh!
Was Mental but now Victoria just certified tbb as a Superspreading Mental Mutant.
About time! Waited 10 years for Qld Health to diagnose that!

So couldn't they just open the Window or something.... "Are YOU fucking Insane!"
Just evacuate the CBD & tear down the buildings & outcast the losers...'Good Plan!'