Australia - you're standing in it

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Sheepdog started the topic in Friday, 18 Sep 2020 at 11:51am

The "I can't believe it's not politics" thread.

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mattlock Sunday, 31 Jan 2021 at 10:11pm

Batman. Melbourne"s "founder". Syphilitic rogue and murderer.

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factotum Sunday, 31 Jan 2021 at 11:36pm

"Let me repeat: It is government policy, lobbied for and applauded by those at the top of the heap, rationalised and gaslit by the “useful idiots” on their payroll."

And the numpties on here of course...

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Michael Bourne Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 12:49am

Likewise bluediamond.

And exactly mattlock. There is absolutely no doubt that the 'colonists' were here, cloaked in a pack of lies, for one reason. And no one was getting in their way. Facto comprehensively, beyond any doubt, covered the whole sordid, dishonest saga in his link not long ago.

Batman was scum of the earth.

As for Buckley, ahh yes, how convenient. What a story!!!

'Well researched and a fairly good account of the whole episode of colonial impact and aboriginal way of life before white settlement.'

Hahahahaha!!! FFS, stuff like this? When scientifical blokes 'seen' shite... again... well, sorta... well...maybe... again...

At the risk of repeating myself, (even though we've already established what a beautiful, a truly helpful thing that certain repetition is) and at the even greatest ever risk of daring to enter, and enrage and awaken the infamous swillnut, hallowed, protected, sheltered chosen ones of the swillnut hall of shame... mayyyyyteeess that weren't but are but were but... fuck who knows!!!

'Does anyone actually believe this racist propaganda parading as 'science'!!?'

"Four `bucks' hold one on to each limb, while another presses on her stomach so as to compel her to draw her legs up: her thighs are now drawn apart and her eyes covered as to prevent her seeing the individual, probably a very old man, who is beckoned up from some hiding place to come and operate directly everything is ready.'

No wonder it was so easy for adolph to get psychopathic numbskulls, cretins, to feed kids into blast furnaces.

What a link dellab, wow, deadly accurate, down to the minute details, 'scientific, 'anthropological', on the spot eye witness reporting (fluent in all the dialects too). And wow again, 'they' witnessed the 'bucks' doing everything everywhere didn't 'they'! Yet, suddenly, the on the spot, eye witness, deadly accurate 'anthropological science' couldn't be sure if this man who came up from (probably), 'some hiding place' was very old or not... probably aye... but!!!

Who cares we seen him aaaye... but!!!

Invites were handed out everywhere! Yet, the stumbletons, burke and wills missed out!

They love using buckley for evidence when it suits, but he must have forgot!

That historical propaganda, that, 'see its ok, the 'science' wuz right after all, they weren't human, we done good after all', has been dealt with many, many times.

'Sexual assault, particularly child sexual assault, forms no part of Indigenous culture and a multitude of authoritative national reports have shown this to be a myth.'

'As the title suggests, Liz Connor focuses particularly on print representations of Aboriginal women from the first instances of European exploration and settlement.

'Skin Deep argues that these representations were based on unfounded hearsay, yet they were circulated and reiterated until they became accepted as truth. In titling this review I took inspiration from one of the books opening lines (27):

[This] is a print history of settler impressions of Aboriginal women situated at that most potent juncture of racism and misogyny. This is a book of lies.'

'Dr Liz Conor is an ARC Future Fellow at La Trobe University, author of The Spectacular Modern Woman: Feminine Visibility in the 1920s (2004) and editor of the journal Aboriginal History. It took Conor over a decade to write Skin Deep, and this is evident in the wide-ranging subject matter, which spans hundreds of years and the entire Australian continent. In doing so, she hoped to stimulate non-Indigenous readers into reflecting on the insidious history of Europeans in Australia and how pervasive these manufactured “truths” have become.'

'This book was painstakingly researched over many years, and Conor’s deep engagement with the source material is a testament to this. Skin Deep continually highlights the ongoing relevance of the dark history Conor seeks to illuminate. This, I believe, is an important yet often forgotten element to writing history, particularly Australia’s colonial history.'

And from another angle.

'Aboriginal people have lived in Australia for a minimum of 65,000 years, a team of archaeologists has established - 18,000 years longer than had been proved previously and at least 5000 years longer than had been speculated by the most optimistic researchers.

The world-first finding, which follows years of archaeological digging in an ancient camp-site beneath a sandstone rock shelter within the Jabiluka mining lease in Kakadu, Northern Territory, drastically alters the known history of the trek out of Africa by modern humans, according to the leader of the international team of archaeologists, associate professor Chris Clarkson of the University of Queensland.

The findings, which are already causing intense interest in archaeological circles across the world, have been peer reviewed by internationally recognised scientists and are published this week in the world's most prestigious science journal, Nature.

Among the trove of discoveries are the world's oldest stone axes with polished and sharpened edges, proving that the earliest Australians were among the most sophisticated tool-makers of their time: no other culture had such axes for another 20,000 years.

The team had also found the oldest known seed-grinding tools in Australia, a large buried midden of sea shells and animal bones, and evidence of finely made stone spear tips.

Professor Clarkson said one of the most striking finds was the huge quantity of ground ochre, right from the oldest layers. This suggested the first humans to populate Australia were already enthusiastic artists, and had continued to be so through their continuing culture in an area known for its spectacular rock art.

"Now we know humans were living in northern Australia a minimum of 65,000 years ago, the search will be on to discover each of the steps they took on the way," Professor Clarkson said.

The discovery also confirms that Australian Aborigines undertook the first major maritime migration in the world - they had to sail a minimum of 90 kilometres across open sea to reach their destination whatever route they took in their long journey out of Africa.

No other humans had undertaken such a journey 65,000 years ago. However, after crossing between islands, they could have walked the last stretch between Papua New Guinea and northern Australia because sea levels were so low at that time, Professor Clarkson said.'

'We found evidence for the mixing of ochre with reflective powders made from ground mica to make a vibrant paint. Currently, the oldest known rock art in the world is dated to 40,000 years ago in Sulawesi (a possible stepping stone to Australia). But the abundant ground ochre and use of mica indicates that artistic expression took place in the region much earlier.

Our new ages suggest that Australia was settled well before modern humans entered Europe about 45,000 years ago. This means that the earliest art and symbolism in Europe is of limited relevance to understanding modern technology and symbolic expression in South and Southeast Asia and Oceania. '

“Australians are truly one of the world’s great human populations and a very ancient one at that, with deep connections to the Australian continent and broader Asian region. About this now there can be no dispute.”

The greatest human voyage of exploration ever. Surely we, as Australians can all celebrate, and honour and applaud that monumentous achievement. And its worth repeating, that these people, beyond any doubt truly outstanding, have never declared war on any other nation, in all that time. What a stellar example of advanced humanity.

This passage is very telling.

'“This story has been missing for a long time in science,” Eske Willerslev, an evolutionary geneticist at the University of Copenhagen, tells Hannah Devlin for The Guardian. “Now we know their relatives are the guys who were the first real human explorers. Our ancestors were sitting being kind of scared of the world while they set out on this exceptional journey across Asia and across the sea.”'

'Our ancestors were sitting being kind of scared of the world while they set out on this exceptional journey across Asia and across the sea.”'

As it highlights the greatest lesson that we could learn from the first Australians. To love, to truly love our Earth, our Planet, our 'Mother', just as we love ourselves, and our wives, children, and parents. To view our Earth truly the same, so that like our Indigenous brothers and sisters were, before we brought our love of war, and fear of nature with us, to be totally at home with, connected to, reverent to, appreciative of, honouring and truly loving of this Planet. Our 'Mother'. Instead, our culture has and to this day does see the Earth, and nature, as a thing to conquer, to fear, seek comfort against, to be shielded from, separate from, and to exploit. Two totally opposite ideologies.

Again, the first Australians were outstanding, truly outstanding. Leaders. Visionaries. And what an unmatched to this day, vision they created. We know that genius exists. We know the power of conditioning. We see a certain type of genius on display in the likes of the Grand Chess Masters, conditioned by our culture's ideology. The ability to see whole scenarios played out, taking into account all possibilities, to the desired outcome. Genius levels of foresight, the ability to see the very biggest picture, shaped, conditioned to love the Earth, their 'Mother'. I believe that is the gift that Indigenous Australians, with their unmatched, magnificent achievement are trying to share.

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adam12 Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 1:38am

"The journey of the first humans to Australia is one of the most important events in history, at least as important as Columbus' journey to America or the Apollo11 expedition...It was the first time any human had managed to leave the Afro-Asian ecological system-indeed, the first time any large terrestrial mammal had managed to cross from Afro-Asia to Australia. Of greater importance was what the human pioneers did in this new world. The moment the first hunter-gatherer set foot on an Australian beach was the moment that Homo Sapiens climbed to the top rung in the food chain on a particular landmass and thereafter became the deadliest species on planet Earth.
Up until then humans had displayed some innovative adaptations and behaviours, but their effect on the environment had been negligible. They had demonstrated remarkable success in moving into and adjusting to various habitats, but they did so without dramatically changing those habitats. The settlers of Australia, or more accurately, its conquerors, didn't just adapt, they transformed the Australian ecosystem beyond recognition.....when the invaders advanced inland...they encountered a strange universe of unknown creatures including a 200 kilogram, two-metre kangaroo, a marsupial lion as massive as a modern tiger, that was the continents largest predator. Koalas far too big to be cuddly...fightless birds twice the size of ostriches...dragon-like lizards and snakes five metres long...the giant diprotodon, a two and a half ton wombat roamed the forests...
...Within a few thousand years, virtually all of those giants vanished. Of the twenty-four Australian animal species weighing fifty kilograms or more, twenty-three became extinct. A large number of smaller species also disappeared. Food chains throughout the entire Australian ecosystem were broken and rearranged. It was the most important transformation of the Australian ecosystem for millions of years."
Yuval Harari/Sapiens

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Optimist Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 6:44am

I didn't know we had a population of Australian pygmies.
Some researchers have linked them to Andamanese...
Andamanese peoples - Wikipedia › wiki › Andamanese_peoples
The Andamanese are the various indigenous peoples of the Andaman Islands, part of India's Andaman and Nicobar Islands union territory in the southeastern part of the Bay of Bengal in Southeast Asia. The Andamanese peoples are among the various groups considered Negrito, owing to their dark skin and diminutive stature.
‎ andamanese+people pics

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Fliplid Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 7:33am

Off on a tangent again MB

The book I mentioned takes a balanced view. The reason for the “Bounty Hunter” in the title is because the author elaborates on Batmans part in the rounding up and in some cases shooting blacks when he was in Tasmania. “Syphilitic rogue and murderer” also gets a run Mattlock. No way does it leave you with the idea he was an enlightened citizen.

Not sure what you are getting at about MB

"Four `bucks' hold one on to each limb, while another presses on her stomach so as to compel her to draw her legs up: her thighs are now drawn apart and her eyes covered as to prevent her seeing the individual, probably a very old man, who is beckoned up from some hiding place to come and operate directly everything is ready.”

Where the fuck did that come from? definitely not in the book I was referencing.

Like I said (AAAGGAAIINNN!!!!) it gives a good account of traditional indigenous life, ( from a range of sources not only Buckley) what they had and what they lost after contact. Also how the colonialists dealt with them after contact is laid out as well and it’s not a pretty picture.

He reasons that some of Buckleys account in his second biography was spiced up by the editor with the aim to increasing sales but even so his account is valuable

It’s a story about Buckley and Batman NOT by Buckley and Batman

Doesn't sound like have you read it?

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Michael Bourne Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 8:09am

I formally studied (with flying colours too... I might add... again...) 'Buckley' in depth flipid, the 'tangent' is to show how powerful propaganda is, and how 'balanced' 'balance' really is, how 'accurate'(sic) hallowed western accounts are found to be, when researched from a different point of view. From one not concerned with explaining away and hiding crimes. We have a foundational history of well, unaddressed to this day, lies.

Adam 12, couldn't sleep a... wink, wink, nudge, nudge! In keeping with the 'latest research, bringing to light in good will, science theme', adam...

'“This new study, based on hard evidence, makes it clear that changes in late Pleistocene climate had a major impact on the late Pleistocene megafauna of Australia, adding even more evidence to challenge the imaginative a priori assumption that ‘blitzkrieg’ by early humans caused the extinction of this
continent’s lost megafauna,” says UNSW palaeontologist Professor Mike Archer.',A%20study%20of%20the%20fossil%20teeth%20of%20megafauna%20from%20Cuddie,primary%20factor%20in%20their%20extinction.

Imagine that adam!!!

'The new research upends decades-old estimates about the human colonisation of the continent, their interaction with megafauna, and the dispersal of modern humans from Africa and across south Asia.

“People got here much earlier than we thought, which means of course they must also have left Africa much earlier to have traveled on their long journey through Asia and south-east Asia to Australia,” said the lead author, Associate Prof Chris Clarkson, from the University of Queensland.

“It also means the time of overlap with the megafauna, for instance, is much longer than originally thought – maybe as much as 20,000 or 25,000 years. It puts to rest the idea that Aboriginal people wiped out the megafauna very quickly.”'

'Whodunnit? The evidence points to environmental change
Why did these megafauna become extinct? It has been argued that the extinctions were due to over-hunting by humans, and occurred shortly after people arrived in Australia.

However, this theory is not supported by our finding that a diverse collection of these ancient giants still survived 40,000 years ago, after humans had spread around the continent.

The extinctions of these tropical megafauna occurred some time after our youngest fossil site formed, around 40,000 years ago. The time frame of their disappearance coincided with sustained regional changes in available water and vegetation, as well as increased fire frequency. This combination of factors may have proven fatal to the giant land and aquatic species.

The megafauna extinction debate will no doubt continue for years to come. New discoveries will plug up the key gaps in the record. With the gaps in the north of the continent the greatest yet to fill.

With an overlap between people and megafauna of 15,000 to 20,000 years, new questions arise about cohabitation. How did people live with these giants during a period of such drastic environmental change?'

The first Australians, celebrated by ever more astounded scientists from all over the globe! Back to the celebrations boyz!!! Yet, a certain portion of the well, as the science says, second Australians, if you like, won't go near the, to this day, unaddressed lies, and broken laws. The inhumanity. And, they just can't stand being second, their main aim, is to fight tooth and nail to the top of the heap of the infamous swillnut boyz club, hall of shame!!! That hallowed, sheltered, special place!!!

There is so much to honour, marvel at and celebrate about the first Australians in the biggest ways possible. Yet, not a whole lot of that happens, fuck all in fact.

I gotta go and do workouts... again...

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etarip Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 9:24am


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mattlock Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 9:49am

Thanks for the posts MB. I hadn't heard of the newer evidence/theories regarding the extinction of Australian megafauna. Flannery may have to re-write his book.

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Optimist Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 10:02am

I still can't get my head around where all the people went. There are currently about 850,000 genuine indigenous Australians and this is apparently roughly the same number (750,000) as when the first settlers arrived. They were misunderstood, killed, diseased and misplaced so lots died in the last 250 years. Now if they were really here living a pretty good life for 65,000 years where are they all?...there should have been billions of people when Cook arrived...I don't know but I'm thinking that the same problems our experts have had many times before, there are issues with their dating systems.

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bonza Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 10:08am


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derra83 Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 10:20am

Yep, issues with the "dating systems", and it's all Labor's fault.

Carry on Optimist.

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goofyfoot Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 10:50am

Hahaha farken hell optimist.

This thread is one of the best around

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Supafreak Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 10:54am

@factoum , good article , I’ve heard that if we abolished income tax and gst and just had a charge of 0.75% on every transaction , then this would be more than enough to run our economy . I’m not up on these things but could this realistically work ? We are the highest taxed country in the world I’ve also heard so if this system would work then surely the rich would be forced to pay their share . Again I don’t know much about these things so go easy guys lol

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Rabbits68 Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 4:19pm

The Collingwood Football Club found guilty of systemic racism by an independent review commissioned by the club. Gee whiz, that is a surprise*, given Eddie McGuire has been at the helm for so many years.....

Edit: *sarcasm

Fish rots from the head down etc. The bigger the fish the bigger stench. Eddie has been on the nose for a long time that’s for sure.

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brutus Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 2:57pm

hmm systemic racism at an AFL club.......Eddie time to go ASAP.....Collingwood will be much better of without you....Adam Goodes might feel a better today knowing that Eddie has presided over the club and ultimately is responsible!!!

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Pops Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 3:00pm
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brutus Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 3:03pm

Optimist , thank you for the link ...yeah known about the first inhabitants in Australia , race of hobbit article I have read is the one you posted.......also in Hawaii there was a pigmy race , of very small people , so when the was canoes arrived from Tahiti , they found Hawaii had small peaceful race which are called Menehunes and still today kids are called Menehunes!

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Fliplid Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 6:37pm

Fair enough MB.

The author has taken those biases you mention into account and highlights the inaccuracies and hypocrisies of what was recorded. Plenty of accounts in journals claiming admiration for the indigenous followed up with a remark that they will of course have to be shown and to acknowledge the superiority of white civilisation.

My take on it, by what is said in this book, is that in the end Buckley was saddened and distressed to see what was happening to the people who were like family and with whom he had lived with for all those years and felt powerless to do anything about it.

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Michael Bourne Monday, 1 Feb 2021 at 8:44pm

No worries flipid. Its just that 'Buckley' has been the ultimate propaganda tool, and has been portrayed in every possible light, depending on the 'evidence' needed. Here's a thorough examination, including links to many detailed works regarding Buckley.

As Traditional Indigenous Australians didn't use writing books as a tool for storing and passing information, it is very difficult to examine their take on anything Buckley supposedly experienced or said, or that was said for him. Although the authors touch on work in that area.

Extremely enlightening and timely news, as noted by Rabs, that Collinwood have been shamed, and found guilty of carrying out and supporting 'Systemic Racism'. No longer a safe, supported place for racists. I'm not from Victoria, where is Collingwood exactly, in relation to say... Dandenong... for instance? Naturally scomo made his usual scumbag comment along the lines of, 'I'm juz assumin' iz all good aaayyee mmmmaaayyte'.

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 2:45am

This may have been covered already and if so I'd appreciate the links back to where it was .... Some years ago I saw a program that put forward the notion around the growth/expansion of the eucalyptus forests at the expense of the great rainforests throughout the continent and how Aboriginal burning practices were thought to be responsible. Further, because of the decline of the rainforest the annual big wets where as once they travelled much further south causing heavy rain throughout the major inland waterways and permanent fresh water in the rivers and Lake Eyre all changed to the climate roughly we know of today. So basically, the program was proffering the view that Aboriginal burning practices changed the continent's inland climate/rainfall patterns/permanent water ..... this may possibly link into your earlier comment about climate being responsible for the decline of much of the continent's megafauna.

Hoping I'm making sense at this hour, anyway, would appreciate your comments on this topic. Thanks.

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Distracted Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 6:34am

Optimist and Brutus, Keith Windschuttle is the author of the article on pygmies in Australia but is also the editor of the website the article is published on, so there is no third party review undertaken. Not saying there weren’t pygmies in Australia at some point but not sure how reliable the evidence presented in the article is.

Windschuttle is also a pretty controversial author, he has made some strange claims about the stolen generation and disputes there was much violence against aboriginals in Tasmania in colonial times.

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brutus Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 8:33am

Flip, in the end Buckley betrayed the aboriginal people he lived with and went back to the white side!

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brutus Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 8:41am

windshuttle is a bit of a hoax as he never really provides proof....from personal experiences I can tell you the stolen generation was real....Yvonne Goolagong remembers having to hide under the bed to escape being taken from her family by social workers , there was an attempt to make all the indigenous kids , white and try and there was abuse on a ,massive scale.
As far as his claims on Tasmania come there's no aborigines in Tassie??

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brutus Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 9:00am

interested to hear opinions on Eddie and the Collingwood football clubs report that there is and has been systemic racism at the club under Eddies rule as CEO?

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Rabbits68 Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 10:23am

"We're not a mean-spirited club. We're not a racist club.“ so says Eddie.

The articles on the ABC website sum it up pretty well. Basically Eddie & the CFC still can’t see what everyone else can see. That’s no surprise given Eddie has been at the helm for so long. He has had a massive influence on the club & he himself at best is extremely ignorant on the issue of racism.

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Hiccups Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 9:31am

I don't think the findings were a surprise to anyone, and they give everyone more reason to hate The CFC and Eddie Fkn Mcguire.

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brutus Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 9:53am Winmar.....

spoke to a couple of Koori mates who's families play AFL , yeah Collingwood is the club no indigenous player wants to got.......and that's why Collingwood has no indigenous players ....

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bluediamond Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 4:49pm

Kinda seemed like Eddie and Collingwood were bizarrely patting themselves on the back in their presser, instead of standing up and taking some actual responsibility. Seemed the same in the Goodesy saga too....deflected blame for as long as possible anyway. Black and white army? How ironic.

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Michael Bourne Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 5:25pm

Gidday Guy

Yeh, I have raised all of this before, with some 'learned' swillnuts as well, even those frequenting the Dandenong area.

'Ok, lets say those of you using fire as evidence of Traditional Indigenous Australians causing mega-fauna extinction are right then. That means, according to your doubt free stance, that you believe that Traditional Indigenous Australians have been in Australia, as continual, unbroken Cultures, for at least 120,000 years as has been asserted, using fire activity as evidence. An absolutely ridiculously amazing achievement, which doubles the already not even remotely matched 60,000 year at least record. Western history looks even more feeble in that light, if that is possible! That 120,000 years is just too confronting for most though.

'The first to propose such an early arrival for Aborigines was Gurdip Singh from the Australian National University, who found evidence in his pollen cores from Lake George indicating that Aborigines began burning in the lake catchment around 120,000 years ago (Singh and Geisler, 1985).'


'It seems likely that the introduction of the intensive use of fire as a tool did indeed follow, but was not directly a consequence of, the extinction of the megafauna. If, as has been suggested, the megafauna remained in some areas until the Holocene, then we should be looking for evidence within the last 10,000 years for changes induced by new Aboriginal burning patterns (Wright, 1986).'

Again, blinder highlights facts. Natural fire, combined with the type of plants, played a huge role in changing environment. Lightning fires still impact dramatically changed, but isolated regions.'

Interesting though, 120,000 years... not out of Africa. There are other theories around, that like, and fit that idea.

So at the risk of being forced, submitted if you like, into repeating myself... again, as a benefit to others... again... as well as shouldering the load for swillnuts as well, so to speak... again... I'll repost this link.

Our culture gets another mention, like its domination of those war and nuclear weapons catastrophic timeline models. Not the greatest performance... again... perhaps a few more advanced fire bombers... or a few million or so more... simultaneously to get the fiscal shite fiscalling... so to speak...

'The problem for conservationists is whether to burn or not to burn. Regular low intensity burning will promote certain species and vegetation associations at the expense of others. Perhaps the last word should come from Rhys Jones (1969), who recognised the problem almost a quarter of a century ago, when he said:

"What do we want to conserve, the environment as it was in 1788, or do we yearn for an environment without man, as it might have been 30,000 or more years ago? If the former, then we must do what the Aborigines did and burn at regular intervals under controlled conditions".'

Not a lot of focus on, as highlighted in facto's excellent link, the proven, beyond all doubt, to this day unaddressed lies, thieving, butchery, and attempted genocide is there.

And perhaps even less focus on the latest guilt, and shame of the racist collingwood expose. Interesting read, its as if you've seen the whole scenario before!!! Rabs sums it up well.

'The articles on the ABC website sum it up pretty well. Basically Eddie & the CFC still can’t see what everyone else can see.'

No doubt the swillnuts are holed up in the clubrooms, joined at the glowing necks, temperature rising... 'yyyyyeeerrrr... nnnnnaaaarrrr... I wuz juzz lyfe exppeeriencin aaayyeee butttt...'

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Westofthelake Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 6:07pm

Good stuff MB.

Thanks for posting the link. Again.

Crickets rock.

Time for a workout.

E/NE swell is on the way.

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Fliplid Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 6:36pm

Yeah Brutus I thought they deserved more loyalty from him after all they basically saved his life

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indo-dreaming Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 12:09am

@ Brutus

"spoke to a couple of Koori mates who's families play AFL , yeah Collingwood is the club no indigenous player wants to got.......and that's why Collingwood has no indigenous players ...."

I heard that too, but i don't think thats the reason why in recent times pies havent had many indigenous players as in reality is if they get drafted they have no choice and when Mick Malthouse was coach the pies had quite a few indigenous players.

Under Mick pretty much all in the same era there was, Leon Davis, Brad Dick, Andrew Krakouer, Sharrod Wellingham, Kirk Ugle, Anthony Corrie, possibly others that never made it out of VFL team, then although not indigenous Harry O

Under Buckley there has been less indigenous players, some of those from above played on and then Travis Varcoe was traded (he just retired) but pies have only drafted a few indigenous players since buckley took over in 2012.

I think there has been four indigenous players other than varcoe drafted or traded in but none really amounted to much, although one Kayle Kirby would have been a total ripper but he had to retire due to heart issues.

Plus Buckley has drafted at least two other players of colour African heritage and Pacific Island heritage in recent years.

I think Buckley is much more conservative than Mick though under Buckley pies tend to draft or trade Victorian or SA players i guess to avoid losing them in a few years to the go home factor.

Plus indigenous players from regional areas outside of Victoria like NT or WA often have a hard time transitioning to the complete change of environment and culture and away from family. (even Kayle Kirby is Victorian)

But Mick seemed more willing to take that risk for instance he even gave Andrew Krakouer a go from WA after he had been dislisted by the Tigers and went to prison for a year or two, but Mick pretty much signed him up the day he got out (might have even been before) and he was an amazing player too, pure X factor. (Buckley would never do something like that)

Edit: Forgot another indigenous player Daniel Wells, traded to Pies from North Melb the Buckley was there....hmmm actually more indigenous players under Buckley than i thought. BTW he he retired I think 2019 but actually now works a CFC in an off field role

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D-Rex Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 7:22pm

Lumumba is a fruitcake, nothing more nothing less. Dressing as an ISIS member for his TV interview tonite says it all.

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Michael Bourne Tuesday, 2 Feb 2021 at 11:58pm

'Good stuff MB.

'Thanks for posting the link. Again.

Crickets rock.

Time for a workout.'

Gidday Westofthelake, no problem. Despite being an innocent party in the unaddressed to this day, invasion, attempted genocide ,and war declared on them, cunningly cloaked as 'colonisation', Indigenous Australians have and are dealing with a long proven, but swept under the rug bombardment of lies and misrepresentation. So, its important to have some light shine on the truth, to do your best to support them. As the latest, 'expert' panel, appointed to investigate and expose systemic racism implored and advised:

'It also advised setting up a "truth-telling" process,'

(My post hasn't been disappeared has it? Everyone knows its an infamous tactic on here, deleting, disappearing, or totally changing previous posts and their context , to hide, or make things look better. Not the sort of thing I'm into at all, no thanks! Each to their own but...)

I did a workout too, another one. gotta luv 'em.

Haha, crickets roll over too!

The main thing is, the truth is out there.

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brutus Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 8:27am

Indo , I have a mate who is a Noongar Elder , he is related thru marriage to the Rioli's...his sister married Maurice......all the Blackfella mob from WA and Melville Island , do not want to play for Collingwood since the Adam Goodes/Eddie's the last destination club of choice.....why because of the systemic racism that has and does exist at Collingwood....just like there is systemic racism in Australia....
Sad that our premier Andrews came out and supported Eddie , then Eddie apologizes last I have said before Vic has a bad record with indigenous aborigines......Andrews just proved that again by backing Eddie......Eddie should exit Collingwood and retire from being a commentator....but his ego is probably too big as he see's himself as some kinda blue collar guy from Broadmeadows....LOL

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brutus Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 8:35am

Flip..."Yeah Brutus I thought they deserved more loyalty from him after all they basically saved his life"
It actually goes to show the locals welcomed him , looked after him , were inclusive of him into their culture ....he writes a great story about them and then betrays them....and here we are still trying to reconcile a tale of 2 cultures , one barely a baby and the other a very old culture.....but time is on our side ....

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GuySmiley Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 8:55am

Thanks MB, will read thoroughly your post/ links later cheers

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indo-dreaming Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 9:10am


I do agree there is a bad reputation there, obviously im a pies man and it really does suck as i love the indigenous players, as not sure why but so many seem to have this X factor especially around goals.

Interestingly i did see something on when each team got their first indigenous player and Collingwood was last and it was a very very long time after the first team drafted a indigenous player.

From memory first team was Fitzroy but Tigers i think have drafted the most indigenous players.

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adam12 Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 9:23am

All this talk about Eddie is a distraction from what Collingwood really stand for which is losing Grand Finals.

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san Guine Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 9:44am

Meanwhile, I wonder what the obligate mouth breathers are up to?

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memo... Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 3:07pm

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JQ Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 6:18pm

Betoota hitting the bullseye again:

I suspect there's much more truth to this than anyone suspects...

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Blowin Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 6:56pm

Here’s a Beetoota headline you won’t see :

“ Satirical website mentions irrelevant skin colour of yellow and brown men in order to a increase ridicule of dim witted characters. . Editor claiming “ I just think that white stuff gets so many extra yucks we know the comedy will go through the roof when we start lambasting stupid people and emphasising that they are black . That’s some high brow wit ! “.

JQ's picture
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JQ Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 7:07pm

Ah, angry white man, right on cue!

memo...'s picture
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memo... Wednesday, 3 Feb 2021 at 7:48pm

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Westofthelake Thursday, 4 Feb 2021 at 4:23pm

The two men running the Australian economy are completely at odds, fighting each other while saying they’re not.

The one who is right is powerless, and the one with the power is wrong.

Philip Lowe is an economist with a doctorate from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology who has been at the Reserve Bank for 40 years; Scott Morrison is a politician with a background in tourism marketing.

Philip Lowe, the Governor of the Reserve Bank, is trying to get wages up, but he can’t. Prime Minister Scott Morrison could get wages up but he is so deep in the habit of suppressing them that it’s an addiction.

In fact, the RBA should buy all of the $800 billion Government debt, rising to $1 trillion this year, and cancel it. Just write it off.

Nothing would happen. That’s because, as Dr Lowe said on Tuesday: “The economy is expected to operate with considerable spare capacity for some time to come.”

As has been said many times, the Australian economy is nothing like running the Household budget. One day the pollies will get it, but it wont be the current mob of twats.

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JQ Thursday, 4 Feb 2021 at 5:03pm

Westof, they completely understand that the Australian economy is nothing like a household. They just exploit it for cheap vote winning.

Some excellent work, again, from the guys at

The cretins at the IPA display this behaviour in regards to government debt like a monkey displaying its arse.

They've prepared a report titled: “The Fair Go – Going, Gone: The Decline of the Australian Way of Life, 2000 to 2020"

'The authors analysed 25 aspects of Australian life that they believe give a representative account of the quality of life of individual Australians, across five major categories: home, work, enterprise, governance and lifestyle. Each measure is tracked across the past two decades in comparison to 2000 standards.'

One of these aspects they've analysed is of course, government debt. But they've applied the same weighting to this aspect as to others like “home-ownership”, “commute time”, “underutilisation”. This is clearly a ridiculous method, but exemplifies the attitude.

I'd encourage people to go and read the excellent work over at

They sum it up and analyse it much much better than I can.

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming Thursday, 4 Feb 2021 at 6:15pm

It's interesting that Australian wage growth has been low since the 90s but we still have the highest minimum wage in the world (might be back to second highest now, but was the highest 2019-2020)

Surely if wage growth hadn't been slowed down since the 90s and our min wage had been allowed to be even higher that this would only fuel more jobs going offshore.

Not only that with wage growth increasing our buying power increases making imports seem even cheaper, while any local made products that escape going offshore get more expensive as an effect of wage growth.

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Westofthelake Thursday, 4 Feb 2021 at 7:37pm

With ya there JQ.

MW shines a light on the shite.

At least they increased their credibility by hiring Tony Abbott to herald a new movement for “saving the Australian way of life”...

The IPA - Inverse Progressive Asshats