What's what?

Shatner'sBassoon's picture
Shatner'sBassoon started the topic in Friday, 6 Nov 2015 at 7:48pm

AN ALL-ENCOMPASSING KALEIDOSCOPIC JOIN-THE-DOTS/ADULT COLOURING BOOK EXPERIMENTAL PROJECT IN NARCISSISTIC/ONANISTIC BIG PICTURE PARASITIC FORUM BLEEDING.

LIKE POLITICAL LIFE, PARTICIPATION IS WELCOME, ENCOURAGED EVEN, BUT NOT NECESSARY.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:46am

I’ll attest to this development , having recently met many young individuals, couples and families who are traveling the country looking for somewhere new to live after seeing the dramatic changes to their hometowns and realising that things will only get worse.

https://theconversation.com/meet-the-new-seachangers-now-its-younger-aus...

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:04am

"...looking for somewhere new to live after seeing the dramatic changes to their hometowns"

And in turn dramatically changing the new towns they move to.

It's going on everywhere.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:14am

For sure , Stu.

But , as with anything , personal history starts the minute you’ve connected with something and anything before is abstract noise.

Just ask the crew from Beijing who now call Sydney home because they think it’s so uncrowded.

I know people who are throwing their hands in the air and leaving Margies because it’s now too busy and heading for Denmark . And I also know crew who are leaving Denmark for spots further East because they think Denmark has gotten too busy .

Domino effect.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:26am

Exactly what I'm seeing. Young crew who are moving south 'cause this coast is too expensive and crowded, while a good friend of mine, who lives in the favoured town of young seachangers, is watching the character of his town change due to influx from the north. Real estate going up, crowds in the surf too.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 9:05am

Obviously with the endless, ever advancing, prolific problems constantly highlighted, (‘its advanced’), it doesn’t work, never has. The seperatist, westminster, capitalism, ‘queen of the world’, ‘God’s chosen ones’ psychopathic shit is an emphatically proven ticket to relentless disaster. Bullets, brute force, bloodshed and environmental disaster wrapped up in gold tinsel. The addiction rules. Or else... ‘you don’t want to know what we are capable of and will do to you’.

80,000 years, and not one of the reams upon reams of ‘advanced’ disasters that endlessly do the rounds here. Traditional Indigenous Australian’s had some proven, remarkable ‘politics’.

Dump the shit, go with something better. New conditioning welcomed. Or be the ever more obese fool that just won’t stop eating and guzzling shit, ‘it’s all too hard... there’s no way out... (I just lurv fuckin’ eating), science proved its nothing to do with eating too much’, and invents and saturates themselves in a ludicrous world designed to enable eating themselves to death.

Jonnies galore!!!

‘We love you lil’ johhnie... we’ll never leave ya johhnie come back!!!’

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 1:04pm

Lookout gang, the Proud Boys are on the march!

https://www.vox.com/2018/10/15/17978358/proud-boys-gavin-mcinnes-manhattan-gop-violence

"The basic tenet of the group is that they are “€œWestern chauvinists who refuse to apologize for creating the modern world.”€ They long for the days when “€œgirls were girls and men were men.”€ This wasn’€™t controversial even twenty years ago, but being proud of Western culture today is like being a crippled, black, lesbian communist in 1953."

So the big question is will Sypkan denounce the movement as yet more Identity Politics?

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 1:15pm

Or even give this its due?

https://indigenousx.com.au/pauline-hanson-and-the-origins-of-its-ok-to-b...

And this (tweet from journalist Matthew Doran):

"Let's step this through:

1) The govt saw the motion from Hanson about white racism in Sept

2) The govt forgot what it was about

3) The govt allowed their senators to vote for it

4) Ministers cheered for it on on Twitter

5) Then the govt read it properly and apologised"

Who's a believer?

sypkan's picture
sypkan's picture
sypkan commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 1:44pm

Yeh I will.

It doesn't matter who's doing it. Its still divisive and sad. But I will say I reckon they are just over reacting to an overreactive overzealous left movement.

And, I reckon identity politics is just how people talk now, left or right. We've all been whipped into line by the nice middle class lefty social engineers to conform to their polite ideals. Publicly anyway.

However now the right has also learnt to use it to their advantage as well.

For the left, a classic case of winning the battle, but losing the war.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 1:45pm

The 'proud boyz' 'manifesto' has been around the block for a while. Including the anti immigrant, anti Muslim, nationalism, and racism 'manifesto' some klan boyz on here cherish so much.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/jul/27/breivik-anti-feminism

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2015/aug/28/norway-has-learned-nothing...

Exactly trubes.

'The real threat here is that which is intended by trolls and white supremacists alike, that it will attract and recruit more white people into white extremists beliefs and groups.

'The faux-victimisation of whiteness; the idea that the ‘white race’ is under threat from immigration to the point where it might soon die out (hence, ‘white genocide’), was a campaign once only attractive to white supremacist movements. The basic idea was that openly saying you want to kill all the other races wasn’t the best recruitment strategy, so instead it was better to say that they were acting on the defensive, out of self-preservation.'

Yes, believe it or not... in a nutshell... again... and...

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:10pm

I’m a Proud Yolngu man = acceptable

I’m a Proud Australian = unacceptable

Over 200 First Nations = acceptable

Australian Nation = unacceptable

We got to keep our culture alive . Mob got to stick together = acceptable

It’d be good to keep the Aussie culture alive = unacceptable

They’re just Angry white men = acceptable

They’re just Angry black men = unacceptable

And please , before any one jumps on their white steed to avenge the minorities , nothing I’ve said is racist. That’s just the way things are.

I’m going to have to add this caveat from now on : I , Blowin , believe in the equality amongst humanity. People are no better or worse due to race . People are good and bad regardless of hue , religion , culture or nationality Different cultures are...different. The world is a beautiful place with lots to love.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:06pm

To this day, unaddressed smarmy, conniving, churchy, white supremacist, mass murder, lies and thievery, disguised as 'colonisation' = unacceptable.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:08pm

It’s just greed and fear , Lifty.

Same as it’s always been .

Sad but true.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:11pm

Greed and fear, like anything, can be expressed in many ways. Some work much better than others though.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:22pm

Talking about greed and fear.....anyone get in on BIT : ASX after I posted it on Friday ?

Holy fuck.....crazy ride.

Regardless of share prices shenanigans, I hope the science is sound. The world needs as many good news stories as it can get . Hope for HIV sufferers is never a bad thing , it’d have to be the loneliest affliction one could endure.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 2:57pm

Then, there is the always present conditioning. 'Greed and fear'. You can be conditioned to fear what another is conditioned to love. You can be conditioned to desire what another rejects. Again, some conditioning works much better than others. The beauty is, we can choose to condition thoughts. It is the only thing we can truly control. Some conditioning produces much better results than others. 80,000 years is a long time.

The argument is often raised but look, the Traditional Indigenous Australians got smashed. They should have a had an ideology that made them better at war.

That line of thinking is getting heavily criticized now, and rightly so. The 'modern', 'advanced' version of the argument is that women need to adapt to them being raped and beaten. To learn to protect themselves. That primitive, evading truth and placing the blame elswhere argument is a road to more failure. No, the more intelligent, better conditioning and so result is that men need to learn to stop raping and abusing mainly women and girls, but men and boys too. For the good of all. Including the planet.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/nov/08/rate-of-sexual-vi...

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/sexual-assault-on-the-rise-in-sydney...

I have to go and train people. Again. Including a pregnant lady. So good for her baby too. Conditioning from so early on. Its a pleasure.

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Friday, 1 Feb 2019 at 11:49am

"I’m a Proud Yolngu man = acceptable

I’m a Proud Australian = unacceptable"

Krist-on-a-bike, let's have a run at this kinda stuff...again

The "proud Yolgnu man" and his wider people have survived for the last couple of hundred years - after being here for tens of thousands of years! - despite ACTIVELY being pursued, ignored, shunned, denigrated, degraded, and literally exterminated within an inch of their lives. By your "proud Australians". Us, "proud Australians". Directly, indirectly, implicit, complicit.

What is a "proud Australian"? Greater minds than ours have tried to come up with what "Australia" is and what it means to be "Australian", let alone scouting around for something to be proud of.

And even worse minds have exploited the worst of us too in this regard.

Anzackery and sport ain't cutting it. Can't ever cut it.

We, as a nation, need to reconcile our past in a meaningful way. The offer to move there has been magnanimously proffered by the peoples that have been here for a span of time that is almost unimaginable, and that we tried to destroy.

And with the shit-full horror they've been put through, and continue to deal with, we're all nothing - especially to be "proud" of - if we don't move in their direction with them. Together.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 3:11pm

Just had a solo session at the local.

That's what's what.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 3:20pm

Sorry , mate.

You’ll have to try harder.

Who are you to dictate to others what they can and can’t feel ?

If someone is proud that they’ve survived being cast into the wilderness of a different hemisphere against their will , after being on the sharp end of a discriminatory class war , and still managed against all odds to survive, thrive and forge a society that is so envied on a global scale , that the queue to join strings around the globe.

Fancy being descended from Irish stock , pilloried and downtrodden for centuries , then finally coming to Australia where your ancestors partook in the formation of such a stable , harmonious culture.

A lot to be proud of if you’re that way inclined. I’m no flag waving Uber patriot , but I recognise what’s been achieved here . Life and history is a journey, things aren’t perfect and they’ve never been faultless or without regret or despair at wrongdoings, but if someone wants to reflect on where we currently stand or the destinations that we may attain together then it’s theirs to appreciate....or not.

Each to their own.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 3:24pm

Your a lucky , lucky man , Stu .

So what was going on out there ? Utter shite ? White pointers cruising the line up ? How’d you grab it solo ?

It’s putrid where I am. But a walk on the beach here was very Storm Boy and cleared the head nicely.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 3:32pm

Looked like a Post-Impressionist's seaside nightmare, all flying spray and whitewash, but being an art lover I knew to look past all that and just focus on the angle. Which was just right.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 3:37pm

Nice work.

I could potentially do the same .

But probably won’t. Im not a big fan of river run off around here.

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:24pm

Hah! I literally just got sent this. Peter fucking Goers!

Reconcile our past and advance Australia fairer.

"Asked what he thought of western civilisation, the great Mahatma Gandhi said “it would be a good idea”.

For 65,000 years Aboriginal people preserved the ecology of our continent supremely well. They understood the balance required.

And then the ships brought “civilisation” and for more than two hundred years we’ve been destroying and denying the oldest living culture on earth.

We did not offer them a treaty or anything. We denied their practical and spiritual bond with their own land. We stole, killed and considered them less important than farm animals. We’re still at it.

The screamingly racist attitude to the long-overdue memorial to the massacre of Aboriginal people at Elliston has shocked and changed me.

Until we properly reconcile the horror visited upon an invaded and oppressed people, Australia has no right to what is positive in our past and future...

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:20pm

"...At the Walkerville Rotary Art Show I had an epiphany looking at the iconoclastic Driller Jet Armstrong’s superb picture of the British invaders coming ashore on a sea of blood into the dark night of the soul of the Aboriginal people. They thought they were conquering a void. We still fail to understand what we share with Aboriginal people. We need to share the spirituality of our shared land.

When a great national symbol is window-dressed in the name of commerce – the Sydney Opera House – we are rightly outraged, yet we are apathetic about more crucial symbols.

We are the only nation on earth divided rather than united by our flag (containing the flag of a foreign country), anthem, national day of celebration and an archaic constitution which eschews any recognition of First Nation peoples and gives ultimate power to a foreign ruler. Poor fellow my country...

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:23pm

"...We’ve had the appalling Advance Australia Fair as our national anthem for 34 years and yet its words are still printed on programs of official events because we are still deaf to them. It’s a phony and unpopular dirge. It’s a lie. We are not “young and free”.

We are ancient and not free of our colonial overlords – by accident of birth in one English family that foreigner, who can never be an Australian citizen and doesn’t want to be, is legally the most important of us.

“Peace and harmony” would also rhyme with the ridiculous “girt by sea”. Give us the beautiful, healing, embracing I Am Australian as an anthem.

“Boundless plains to share” is a bad joke unless you are an au pair or Argentinian polo player or Asian millionaire. Thousands of actual refugees share only a concentration camp of Nauru and hopelessness.

Australia Day celebrates only the British claim to Sydney and the east coast. It’s a recent concoction which insults Aboriginal people whose own boundless plains were stolen without negotiation because it was “good for them”. Then when we couldn’t kill or subvert them we stole their children as well...

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:21pm

"...We won’t have a true national day until we finally declare a republic as one people and resolve the bloody past.

Meanwhile we are an appallingly led, disunited, disintegrating, corrupt nation in historic denial.

The overwhelming success of the recent quasi plebiscite/postal vote gives great hope because it opposed the will of our political masters who constitutionally must have no allegiance to any other country in multicultural Australia and must then prove this by swearing allegiance to a foreigner.

In Advance Australia Fair, “joyful strains” are encouraged.

To me a joyful strain is a nice shit and that’s the shit this country I love; you love; we love; is in."

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:38pm

Blow in.

"...and still managed against all odds to survive, thrive and forge a society..."

At whose expense?

"...where your ancestors partook in the formation of such a stable , harmonious culture."

Unless you were on the receiving end?

"...but if someone wants to reflect on where we currently stand or the destinations that we may attain together then it’s theirs to appreciate....or not."

Easy to say, when you're holding all the cards?

"Sorry , mate.

You’ll have to try harder."

Indeed.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 4:58pm

Cool .

You can wake up every morning and punch yourself in the face for the atrocities you’ve committed if you’d like.

PS I still don’t understand why you and Lifty keep posting the same gear that went out of fashion 30 years ago . EVERYONE knows and has acknowledged that the blackfellas were done over. Who is there left that you’re trying to convince ?

PS You’ve still got zero right to rubbish other people if they choose to admire the society that our nation has become . Why not get down to the citizenship office and start poking your finger into the chests of a few Somali refugees and berate them for being glad to be here ?

If you don’t like it , well wacko . You’ve got no entitlement to start calling others racist , flag waving rednecks , or whatever other puerile insults you’d like to throw around.

PPS “Poor fella my country “ sounds an awful lot like cultural appropriation wouldn’t you say ? Particularly coming from a white fella , such as yourself , who still has his boot on the throat of the blackfellas.

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 6:17pm

Blowin you have the patience of a saint.

We've gone over one part of Australia's past in depth on this thread, but have we talked about the Rum Corps? I'd argue that the business system they set up is alive and well here today and shafting everyone no matter their creed or colour. Discuss.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 6:36pm

My wife has become good friends with an indigenous work friend, she was over watching the AFL grand final having a few drinks, I'm not sure how it came about but the topic of embracing culture came up as my wife embraces her Indonesian/Javanesse culture with pretty much everything she does (our house and garden is like a shrine to Indonesia)

Anyway it was interesting to hear her indigenous friends opinion and view on culture and said that it's not really important to her or doesn't shape her as a person and say's it's kind of annoying that people expect or even want her to embrace her culture, she said her family and friends that live up North on country are similar and laughed and said that AFL is now their culture.

Was an intersting insight.

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:27pm

Blowin does seem to have the blind faith in dogma of a saint.

"...the same gear that went out of fashion 30 years ago."

Fashion?? That's how you see this?

"...start poking your finger into the chests of a few Somali refugees and berate them for being glad to be here."

I would've thought they'd be stoked to be alive and healthy, and relatively safe for one. Well, without freaky white people getting up in their grill. 'Cos there does seem to be plenty of other types that want to point at them, poke and shirt-front them though. Dutton, for one; Hanson; Other anti-immigration-ists of that ilk.

"You’ve got no entitlement to start calling others racist , flag waving rednecks , or whatever other puerile insults you’d like to throw around."

Wow! Is this "punching yourself in the face"? In Macbeth Shakespeare described guilt as "life's fitful fever". (I know how you seem to like quotes).

“Poor fella my country “. That's a quote! And let me guess, you don't know what this is, what it refers to, and/or what it means?

Hey, we are all ignorant about stuff.

It's how we deal with that fact that matters.

Guess what? This discussion will not go away, and Australia won't be able to heal, trodding along the same old path.

It's a dead-end. And there are new tracks to follow. New to a lot of us white-fellas, anyway.

Of genuine interest, what have you got against say, what was outlined in the Uluru Statement from the Heart?

What are your objections to say, Australia becoming a Republic? And a subsequent change of national symbols: flag, anthem, day of celebration?

With all that potted Irish stuff you mentioned before, I'd assumed you'd be all for a Republic? The Irish Catholics in particular were still copping it hard at the start of the last century here in Australia, even post-war.

And the Irish during the early days of the NSW colony?

I know you're not much for reading, Blow in, but here you go:

https://redflag.org.au/node/5651

British PM Disraeli:

“The Irish hate our order, our civilization, our enterprising industry, our pure religion. This wild, reckless, indolent, uncertain and superstitious race have no sympathy with the English character”.

Substitute Muslim for Irish, and this could have been written last week"

(by an Aussie PM? Defo, someone like Hanson!)

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:12pm

"Was an intersting insight."

Yes, indeed.

Into your thinking.

Thanks, Indo.

I focus's picture
I focus's picture
I focus commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:13pm

"We've gone over one part of Australia's past in depth on this thread, but have we talked about the Rum Corps?"

I have never trusted anyone from NSW........

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:22pm

C'mon Indo...really?

Not fifty years ago, well within many people's memory, Aboriginals were the equivalent of fauna. We allowed them no agency, split up their families, violently disrupting their way of life, and shamed them for trying to embrace their own culture.

And now you wonder why...?

factotum's picture
factotum's picture
factotum commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 7:50pm

Big day in politics. Summed up. Horrifically.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:03pm

Okay Stu so now it's our fault that people don't embrace their culture.

Do you embrace you culture?

But we expect others do so yeah?

I think with westerners there is almost a zoo like factor in expecting cultures to embarace tradition, and i admit I'm kind of guilty of it myself, like traditional Mentawai culture and last time i was in Indo i was trying to dig into my friends areas culture asking him some things and he said only the old people do that or did that, and i said well why don't you blah blah blah..then i realised shit I'm doing this zoo like culture embracing thing wondering why my friend doesn't eat grubs out of Sago palms anymore or practise this or that...

Reality is most people just want to live the modern life most of us also want to live, in a sense it's almost kind of racist that we expect someone to practise or embrace their culture because it's what we think they should do or we may even think they are less (insert ethnicity) because they don't embrace or practise something.

@Factum Whatever dude, FYI my wife works in a aged care facility, if you don't know many different ethnic groups tend to work in these facility's especially from low social economic disadvantage i guess low type educated backgrounds, I'm not sure why but it's like that maybe they are the only ones that can put up with the shit money and hard work, I know she works with a lady from PNG, a Cambodia women who's family fled Cambodia and an African lady (i think Sudanese) and recently an Aboriginal lady, she tends to get on well with the all, trust me i hear it all every day after she finishes work .

Westofthelake's picture
Westofthelake's picture
Westofthelake commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 9:22pm

Classic facto.
Who's the guy with his head poking out of the sand, and the one next to Moronson?
Ok just had to zoom in for Sharma, but still don't know who the head in the sand is.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:10pm

ID said..."Okay Stu so now it's our fault that people don't embrace their culture."

It's not my fault and it's not your fault, but it is what our culture did to Aborigines up until very recently, and it does illustrate why many Aborigines have a fraught relationship with their traditional culture.

Their culture was violently overthrown, thrown into disarray, and shamed. Now that we're all supposedly on equal terms they can't simply revert to some notion of traditional culture. After a generation of cultural dislocation there's no longer any authentic expression of it.

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:35pm

All that is true Stu, and it's exactly what happened in the British isles and Europe when Christianity overcame the traditional religions and cultures of that area. All that is left are some incredible stone monuments aligned with solstices, and the poetic Eddas. The loss of culture was absolutely devastating. I hope it has continued underground somehow.

I am heartened that comparatively more of the Aboriginal culture has survived, for example art highlighting how floodplains work.

sypkan's picture
sypkan's picture
sypkan commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 9:49pm

"....EVERYONE knows and has acknowledged that the blackfellas were done over. Who is there left that you’re trying to convince ?"

Yep you've really gotta wonder...

Like really really wonder...

People carrying on about the history wars. I literally do not know a single person who denies the history. Even my rednecky mate, who likes to give em a kick now and then, would not ever deny the history. Not even close, he'd admit they got a raw deal, then maybe let out a slur, but he still admits and acknowledges the reality of the history.

I think the few people who are left denying and fighting the history, you're not ever going to convince otherwise.

So, we are at this point where the self appointed are having this emotional aggressive argument, getting all riled up and angry, arguing with themselves about how disgusting australians are for denying history. Who the hell are you talking about/to?

a few liberal party nutters maybe, but that's about it.

It really is broken record syndrome, where people - sometimes good natured and empathetic souls - are getting sick of fucking hearing it. Switching off to the 'white noise'. Like the wider identity politics debates, we're now in losing ground territory because, well, there's nothing more to say. No more point to make. Yes there are still issues, there's possible ground to make up, but ya ain't gonna break that ground with this broken record MO.

I think indod's little observation is quite interesting. I had involvement with a dance group for a while, encouraging culture and a heap of good stuff, amazing how many aboriginal kids just weren't into it. It was kind of forced onto them. Some loved it. totally into it, and it was great to see, but others, no interest at all. They were more interested in 'other dancing'. And fair enough, there's no obligation. Or there shouldn't be.

But there clearly is a feeling of obligation. I listen to a lot of community radio, and the other week there was a bit of a hip hop show going on that had a few blackfella artists on it being interviewed. Pretty switched on dudes and dudettes making some good tunes. Some of them spoke of just wanting to make music, good music, have fun, avoid the politics. But said they felt immense pressure to be more political and cause based in their music. Said they really didn't like the expectation that just because you're indigenous you're expected to behave in a certain way. Just wanted to get on with it.

All sounds fair enough to me. In fact I see it as a positive. A development from our dark divided past, where they just want to get on with shit, get on with being normal, whatever that is.

Having said all that. I really wish those kids would get fully involved in the dance and culture. It appears lots of good stuff is learnt under duress.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 8:55pm

Thats true Stu but i don't think thats the reason.

The attitude i got was (and not these words or so blunt) but what do you expect?

Like what do we really expect them to practise?

Tell stories of the dream time and go hunt and gather and then come back and cook on coals of a fire, or do bark paintings or other cliche traditions.

Like i said our expectations of others to practise and embrace their culture are almost racist stereotypes.

And i admit i have these expectations when i met people of different ethnicity's especially when it comes to food I'm always disappointed when they don't eat their traditional food or can't cook it and i end up finding out they just eat what other Aussies eat. (luckily the African lady my wife works with is still into her traditional food, so somehow I'm going to get a feed of some real home cooked African food)

GuySmiley's picture
GuySmiley's picture
GuySmiley commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 9:34pm

https://go.mycastingnet.com/Apply/Show/HardQuizCasting

National fame awaits, time waits for no indo

sypkan's picture
sypkan's picture
sypkan commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 9:41pm

and just for a little balance

this song is amazing

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JLQ4by3lUJo

sypkan's picture
sypkan's picture
sypkan commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 10:07pm

Tim Jackson prosperity without growth for those adverse to reading

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ3Rnfg8oUE

I think Japan is a pretty good model to show the world doesn't end with a recession. They've experienced one for decadee and seem to be doing alright.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Tuesday, 16 Oct 2018 at 10:49pm

'Of genuine interest, what have you got against say, what was outlined in the Uluru Statement from the Heart?

What are your objections to say, Australia becoming a Republic? And a subsequent change of national symbols: flag, anthem, day of celebration?

With all that potted Irish stuff you mentioned before, I'd assumed you'd be all for a Republic? The Irish Catholics in particular were still copping it hard at the start of the last century here in Australia, even post-war.

And the Irish during the early days of the NSW colony?

I know you're not much for reading, Blow in, but here you go:

https://redflag.org.au/node/5651'

All legitimate questions if you are truly interested in something better.

Haha, another indoblown 'confirmation' bbq saga. Including the brilliant, and beloved, his enshrined, good 'ol klan 'stuck cunt' ideology:

'if you don't know many different ethnic groups tend to work in these facility's especially from low social economic disadvantage i guess low type educated backgrounds, I'm not sure why but it's like that maybe they are the only ones that can put up with the shit money and hard work'

'Its advanced!!!' 'Its all we got!!!'

'I know you're not much for reading, Blow in, but here you go:'

What's what? Good question. Why again... for the klan 'readers'???

'Non-Indigenous Australians want to see Indigenous peoples “included” or “embraced” in the nation. But many don’t want to change their ways to accommodate Indigenous rights or difference. The flow is one way. We are taught that western civilisation is superior, and Indigenous difference is a deficit.

There is Indigenous leadership on these questions that is both visionary and practical. In 1987, Kevin Gilbert, a Wiradjuri man, produced a comprehensive critique of Australia’s claims to sovereignty, and the need to recognise the sovereignty of Indigenous peoples.

Irene Watson, a Tanganekald and Meintangk Boandik legal scholar and professor, points out that crises such as climate change are a call for a new relationship between Indigenous and non-Indigneous Australians and our environment. She shows how Indigenous moral and relational values provide a sound basis on which to build those new relationships.

Victoria Grieves, a Warraimaay historian, foresees a Republic of Australia based on the sovereignty of Aboriginal peoples. She says:

Australia could achieve absolute decolonisation and shared sovereignty and live up to the reputation we like to have, as a nation deeply concerned with human rights and social justice.

It is wrong-headed to think of “embracing” Indigenous peoples. Those with a western heritage must relinquish their arrogance, rewrite the distortions of their history, and place Indigenous interests at the forefront of social, economic and political concern.

We need to look beyond symbols to restitution: compensation, reparations and resource sharing. Indigenous peoples, through seeking a treaty, invite us to share in building an honourable future. Surely we can agree that Australia is worth it.'

https://theconversation.com/indigenous-treaties-are-meaningless-without-...

Klan blowindo's 'chapter' 'reading'???

'Tell stories of the dream time and go hunt and gather and then come back and cook on coals of a fire, or do bark paintings or other cliche traditions.

Like i said our expectations of others to practise and embrace their culture are almost racist stereotypes.'

Exactly numbskull. So why are you 'reading' that drivvle of yours into the above Indigenous Australian words? Again... and again... in a nutshell... again...

However, reality shows an 80,000 year success story. Other 'politics' are proven to work better than any smarmy, sleazy, western 'colonization' ever has.

Reading. Games. What the fuck is what??? Past... 'form'...

You can't make this shit up. I don't have to but... in a nutshell...

'artists'... so much... so much... 'work'... 'rivers'... of... of artistry... 'artists' always struggle to keep track of the 'work'. Reading??? Between the lines... so to speak... in a nutshell...

I like your attempt... but its for a good cause stupe', taking one for the... 'loopers'...

'We stock Gearbox as well as Futures as we feel their the 2 best systems around, ease of install vs strength, plus they support backyard builders in Oz. FCS is a good system, just for our customers a repair is a lot easier with Gearbox and Futures, for a backyardie to do themselves.

IMHO I like the feel of the Futures and Gearbox has some amazing fin styles for alternative boards!'

https://www.swellnet.com/comment/515878

WTF is what...

This blithering, blathering dribbling, this 'udesless' is what...

'Didn't know Futures did a oval leggie plug ..are they popular have never seen one on a board.'

No fucking kidding... surprise fucking surprise... even though plenty had... among other much earlier, very similar fin 'systems'...

Look at the blathering, gushing, drivvling... the 'readers' names, there's not a lot... but there they are... same ol... klan boyz... again...

Art... form... artists... 'work'... 'rivers'...

https://www.swellnet.com/comment/584844

Udesless... oh yes, the river again... becomes a babbling brook... again...

'Fin system FCS or Futures ?'
Or Gearbox....'

'With Gearbox plugs and some minor trimming of FCS type fin tabs you can get 8-10 mm of fine tuning...'

Carry on 'reading'...

Same 'ol names justa 'readin' up a storm...

'Who the fuck ARE you , Udo ?

On the pulse , mate.'

'I'd never heard of Gearbox and just looked them up now. Frankly it's all too late for me to change, '

'No'.

With an emphatic O... in a nutshell... again

Please stop.

Please read. For once.

Form is form but... in a nutshell. The country, the globe is crying 'change'!!!

The 'readers' have form but... aaayeee.... mmmaaa...

Moral... don't put the fucking pedophile hiding and protecting pope in charge of any fucking thing. Despite his 'social' workers. And lawyers and bean counters.

'You just take a back seat 'God', 'little buddy, coz my 'brothers and sisters' will handle this... again... and again... with a lurvin!!!' In a nut shell.'

You know what???

'Same 'ol names justa 'readin' up a storm...'

They don't like a spray... but... a good fuck'n spray is needed sometimes... when the 'readers do years more fuckin' blathering, driveling and the 'rivers', the brooks babble... udeslessly.

Shut the fuck up and fucking read, fucking listen... learn, change... klan boyz...

You can't make this fucking shit up...

'Who the fuck ARE you , Udo ?

On the pulse , mate.'

'I'd never heard of Gearbox and just looked them up now. Frankly it's all too late for me to change, '

What fucking 'pulse'!!! Spray it again... ronnie!!! In a nutshell!!!!

Facto, guys, the 'leaders', the 'forward thinkers', well done... again...

The klan boyz 'team'... get out the umbrellas... again... in a nutshell...

upnorth's picture
upnorth's picture
upnorth commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 5:59am

'All that is true Stu, and it's exactly what happened in the British isles and Europe when Christianity overcame the traditional religions and cultures of that area. All that is left are some incredible stone monuments aligned with solstices, and the poetic Eddas. The loss of culture was absolutely devastating. I hope it has continued underground somehow.
I am heartened that comparatively more of the Aboriginal culture has survived, for example art highlighting how floodplains work.'

Underground? Not much truth in some of that. Have you heard of the Celtic languages, culture, tradition? Pagan worship and Christian worship merged over hundreds of years in the British Isles. There was of course conflict but nothing on the scale of the genocide which took place in Australia.
Comparatively Aboriginal culture was deliberately erased and other than place names is conspicuous by its absence today.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 7:07am

Perhaps culture is actually not a static thing and is ever-changing?

We all have a culture as all have roots starting somewhere.

My father is Dutch but came to Australia when young, my mother English but only lived in England for a few years before living in Africa, Fiji, Australia .

But i have no connection to anything Dutch (bar maybe some biscuits) even though my grandparents were very Dutch in their ways only the English side more so because non indigenous Australian culture developed from England.

Even non indigenous Australian culture is changing or changed, the food we eat, our housing design, how and what we celebrate yearly events, weddings, deaths etc even our language has changed to a degree that Aussie larrikin type spirit.

I expect pretty much all of us have also lost a culture from the period where we were nomadic hunter gatherers or different periods between then and now.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 8:12am

"Perhaps culture is actually not a static thing and is ever-changing?"

Of course it is. Culture is fluid, it's changed even since you and I were young.

People who harp on about political correctness are blind to this. Culture is moving forward, and they aren't, yet they long for the time of their youth.

Once it was perfectly fine to call a black fella a nigger, or a homosexual a faggot, and now it's not. Some people call that (and other similar examples) political correctness, when it's simply culture changing.

Similarly, people who would wrap Aboriginal culture in a loin cloth and stuff it in a jar of formaldehyde do no help. There are many waves for them to express their culture, including, as Sypkan said, by doing nothing at all - it's still culture! But for many others, ovecoming the great upheavals, finding their place in the modern world, dealing with reconciliation, will be part of their cultural expression, and white fellas just have to deal with that.

No need for white victimhood, or bogus Senate motions about being white, try and see it through their eyes. It's just a cultural moment we're all passing through.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 8:22am

Currently reading barkskins by Annie Proulx.

The book deals with this very topic regarding a culture floundering in the face of new and unsympathetic cultural invasion. Set in Canada and the US starting in 1690 and illustrates how the North American natives dealt with the creation of the US/ Canada and the onslaught of a foreign culture.

Great book . Highly recommended.

A cross between The revenant , a James Michener saga and There will be blood.

CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight's picture
CryptoKnight commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 8:41am

Yeh, blah, blah, fucking blah, fucking blah, meanwhile you're championing a 'culcha' where you throw your wife under your cherished and championed 'stuck cunt' bus, while you spend the day on your fat arse swillnuttin'... again... and again... then whinge that the 'stuck cunts' won't cook ya up some traddy culcha shite... aaaayyeee mmmaaayyyte... at ya 'confirmation'...

Then you won't surf in no city but... 'them other 'stuck cunts' making all the stuff so's I can swillnut all day, can do all the reams upon reams of that 'advanced' 'culcha' shite aaaayyyeee mmmaaayyytee...

'I expect pretty much all of us have also lost a culture from the period where we were nomadic hunter gatherers or different periods between then and now.'

That solves the heinous crimes perpetuated to this day against Indigenous Australians. Including 'stuck cunts'. You fucking idiot. To put it politely.

F... FFS yah can't make this shit up... you don't have to but... in a nutshell...

Its a fucking useless system. If you want some quandongs, rabbits, water, whatever to give you quandongs, rabbits, water whatever, plus x, plus x, ad infinitum, while you go swillnuttin', somebody, some 'stuck cunt' always has to pay x, from the cess pit 'stuck cunt' bottom everyone sweeps under bennies rug.... So, like phil and liz's lot figured out, beat the fucking crap out of the 'stuck cunts' till they pay. And when you've rung every fucking drop of blood and life out of them, and the fucking ground they live on, go find some new 'stuck cunts', repeat... 'colonize' the fuckers!!! Its advanced!!! Its an art alright aaayyee... orn the faaarkin' pulse mmmaaayyyttee...

Swillnuts 'pulsing' away... changing gear... again... 'artistry' in a nutshell...

You can't make this shit up... you don't have to but... in a nutshell... again...

'carry orn 'readin'!!!!

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Wednesday, 17 Oct 2018 at 8:57am

Lifty , the main problem with your arguments is that you have no true antagonists . You’re inventing an opposition that you can rail against in order to mask the inherent hollow emptiness of your life.

Example - Indo D and myself are , by any measure , obviously not evil tyrants who would oppose or oppress someone for the colour of their skin . Indo has an Asian wife for Christ ‘s sake ! Yet you regularly call us Nazi’s and Klan members .

There is nothing that anyone on Swellnet has ever said and done to justify your outrage or your insults.

I’m afraid you’re either a sad , modern Don Quixote, insane and so enamoured with the romanticism of chivalry that you’d walk over broken glass to find anything to rail against or , more likely, you’re suffering from :https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factitious_disorder_imposed_on_another

Either way , give it up , you’ve got zero grounds to base your ridiculous rants on. No one hates blackfellas anymore . No one wishes them ill or wants to subjugate them in any way .

You’ve got nothing to rant against.

Seek help

I , Blowin , believe in the equality amongst humanity. People are no better or worse due to race . People are good and bad regardless of hue , religion , culture or nationality Different cultures are...different. The world is a beautiful place with lots to love.