Darren Handley and the wisdom of the crowd

Stu Nettle
Surfpolitik

A decade working in surf journalism has allowed me to report on great stories, work with words, and it’s also given me plenty of time to surf. What it hasn’t done is provide me with a sharp wardrobe, so I felt somewhat conspicuous walking around Sydney’s financial precinct yesterday afternoon. It was 5pm and I looked like a lost dog as young men with sharp suits and hard-parted hair walked with intent between buildings and bars.

The reason I was in Sydney was to “meet the management” at the launch of the Darren Handley Designs crowdfunding offer. Employing a mix of old-style shares and modern crowd-sourcing, DHD are using a crowdfunding platform called Equitise to raise capital. Anyone who pitches in ‘owns’ a share in the company.

The meeting was in a building directly opposite the Australian Stock Exchange. Walking towards the building I reflected on Darren Handley, and it hit me like a stray golf ball that the last time he featured on Swellnet was when he crashed the PWC on the Gold Coast. Ho ho ho...we gave him a bit of air time following that incident!

I ducked into a laneway bar and fortified myself with a drink.

Not that it was ultimately needed. When the presentation began, DHD’s CEO Tony Emerton explained that Handley’s plane didn’t make it to Sydney due to the dust storm enveloping the city. Emerton apologised, brushed off the setback and launched into his spiel.

It was an odd audience that Emerton spoke to. Here was Australia’s most visible surfboard company making their pitch, yet if there were other surfers in the room it wasn’t obvious. Foremost, this was a financial crowd. I know I cling to the vestiges of surfing being a hermetically sealed subculture, it’s wilful thinking more than anything else, but it’s still a shock when surfing is presented as a dispassionate business screed - numbers and KPIs and ROIs - to an audience of suits.

As the PowerPoint preso rolled I flashed on Phil Jarratt’s Salts and Suits, a book that chronicled corporate tension following the incursion of non-surfing ‘suits’ into the expanding surf industry. Thinking there was a similarity would prove to be an incomplete read of the situation. But the reason why didn’t hit me till the end of the presentation.

Emerton explained how DHD had recently bought 80% of Modom to expand the company’s push into hardware, apparel, and in time, surf fashion. “When we bought Modom,” said Emerton, “We bought all the mistakes they’d made, so we wouldn’t make the same.”

Modom would also be used to create market segmentation. “We often get asked to create a DHD SUP, or a DHD softboard,” recalled Emerton before explaining that the DHD brand would retain its premium, performance-oriented focus, so therefore all softboards, learner boards, or even SUPs if they were to go down that path would be branded as Modom.

From market segmentation, Emerton moved to “integrated products”, which are essentially co-ordinated products such as fins, grip, and even legropes, all of them upsold with each board purchase. With this explanation, DHD’s bigger picture assumed some shape. Everything they’re currently doing finds root in just one product.

I went into the meeting with the decline of Billabong and Quiksilver in my mind. Great companies that expanded then went bust. There’s a common thread those doomed brands followed, but it appears DHD aren’t emulating it. Gordon Merchant once made boards before he made his fortune in surf fashion. Rip Curl also made boards before they focused on wetsuits. Even Quiksilver tried their hand with Quikstix, before deeming it all too hard and retreating to the rag trade.

But the take home message from the meeting is that, while DHD will branch out into hardware and fashion, they’ll primarily remain a surfboard company. Hand-shaping purists may disagree with their mass-produced methods, but there’s a belief that should be admired. And that is? The surfboard should be the central pillar of a surf company.

I’ve got no idea what non-surfers will make of that belief, or even if it’s a good commercial strategy, but coming from the acclaimed Sandon Point School of Business I think it makes perfect sense.

Other points from the meeting:

  • If something were to happen to “key personnel” - i.e the bloke who the company is named after - Emerton said Mick Fanning would stand in as the shaper and designer of DHD.
  • DHD are moving into epoxy boards. Most will be made in the Cobra factory, Thailand. They’ve just taken delivery of 1,000 of them.
  • The minimum investment is $250.

Read the portfolio here.

Comments

channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:10pm

Not that I would invest here but if I did I would like to know more on Fanning's understanding of shaping and design as this is key risk no. 1. Sure he is an outstanding surfer, but can he make curves that work?

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:20pm

Well, there's another quite well known pro who's done alright as a shaper and designer.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:35pm

Who?

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:40pm

I know you're setting me up but I 'spose I have to go there anyway.

KS.

fitzroy-21's picture
fitzroy-21's picture
fitzroy-21 commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:51pm

Simon Anderson is another that comes to mind...

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:55pm

Richie Collins comes to mind !
Great boards !

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:57pm

@Stu net.
You took the bait. LOL!

channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:42pm

Kelly Tommo Slater?

channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:45pm

Who? Banks? LSD? TF? MR? Simon?
Sure these guys transitioned but also spent a lifetime learning the craft over a planer.

Not saying Mick couldn't transition into this over time but if money was on the line, I would want a better business strategy than that.

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:04pm

Echo that question, who, after the baby boom generation, was pro and shaped their whole quiver the whole way through? Glenn Winton?

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 5:56pm

Dylan longbottom

Max Wax's picture
Max Wax's picture
Max Wax commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 7:43am

Tyler warren, beau foster, Rob machado, Ellis Ericsson?

Bnkref's picture
Bnkref's picture
Bnkref commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 11:36am

x2 on Dylan Longbottom. Have bought a couple of boards off him. Very happy.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:43pm

This is kind of weird/surprising., but i guess we only know of fanning what the media or he lets us see.

Slater involvement in a FW makes sense he has always been mixing it up, experimenting with all kinds of boards, and always talking about boards and different design even experimenting with materials.

For further reference and common sense.

General Social issues: Rita Panahi & Lauren Southern
Indigenous issues: Jacinta Price and Anthony Dillion
Gender: Debra Soh.
Islam: Armin Navabi & Brigitte Gabriel
Population: Dick Smith

yocal's picture
yocal's picture
yocal commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:13pm

Stu,
point 2: Are they "transitioning manufacturing to", or are they "expanding the range to include" epoxy?

The portfolio seems vague also, but the overall approach seems like a long-term transition

Go deeper Taylor, go deeper!

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:18pm

The latter, expanding the range to include epoxy boards.

yocal's picture
yocal's picture
yocal commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:30pm

Perhaps a clear sign that the epoxy tech limitations have finally caught up and are overtaking poly for pole position in high-end surfing. Slater buying Firewire was surely a huge step but felt to me to be a leap of faith.

Go deeper Taylor, go deeper!

sharkman's picture
sharkman's picture
sharkman commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:08pm

oh boy, yeah there are enormous amounts of stock Asian EPS/Epoxy's every where world wide , the customers are slowly but surely returning to PU/Polyester/Epoxy....so the Asian made EPS's have had there day......also I just saw Mick Fanning Soft tops with a DHD logo , to be delivered next year!
DH has had a rather chequered career , and easy to say that he has burnt his markets in Japan /France/Portugal and the USA......not sure how much growth he can get in Australia...but I reckon that's it!

x

redmondo's picture
redmondo's picture
redmondo commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:09pm

Wearing brand names makes me feel like a foolish consumer puppet. I would wear swellnet synoptic t shirt though.

Misery.

yocal's picture
yocal's picture
yocal commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:14pm

i'll second that redmondo but only if the synoptic showed a reddish purple blob where I like it to be positioned!

Go deeper Taylor, go deeper!

yocal's picture
yocal's picture
yocal commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:17pm

I had a Double Keg rashie (the name of DHD's old surf shop next to Kirra Cafe) that I though was the coolest thing going as a 14 year old grom.

Go deeper Taylor, go deeper!

Giovanni's picture
Giovanni's picture
Giovanni commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:26pm

Has BASE been forgotten so easily? *Note to Stu: Article on BASE and the subsequent bankruptcy

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:35pm

That was spoken about at the meeting. Tony Emerton invited any questions, but none were forthcoming.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 6:42pm

Nothing about non payment of superannuation to base employees? That seems to be floating around online.

barrytheblade's picture
barrytheblade's picture
barrytheblade commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:32pm

So whats the return for the investor....chance of a 'cheap' board or apparel further down the track. Can't see there being a dividend for some time...

channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom's picture
channel-bottom commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:38pm

Yep, what barry said.

Harman's picture
Harman's picture
Harman commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:34pm

Invest in your local shapers and not these corporate flogs

dimdim's picture
dimdim's picture
dimdim commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 5:26pm

Fair comment.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 3:52pm

Well it seemed strange at first glance. (Read about the crowd funding a while ago.)
I'm glad you went to the shareholders convention Stu net.

You have bought the most sense to this whole crowd funding thing.
I think surfing neededs a new company/ brand. Feel a lot of the older, more established brands are pretty tired.
If managed correctly and priced right it could be a more "fresh and value orientated " brand for the next generation of surfers.

Why not just re release headworx....

Whatever the outcome. Its going to be entertaining...........

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:01pm

Well I can answer one of those questions...

You can't re-release Headworx because it's still going: http://www.headworx.com/history/

And while on the topic here's my short history on Headworx, which includes a few shots of Handley with hair: https://www.swellnet.com/news/rearview-mirror/2016/04/21/short-history-headworx

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:03pm

Let's resurrect Catchit boardshorts. They were reasonably priced, easily obtained at Target iirc. Catchy name, catch the wave, nothing to do with what a cat does...

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 6:30pm

Catshit.......that's what everyone at school used to call it.
I still think they should bring back gotcha.
Awesome logo , owned the eighties.

simba's picture
simba's picture
simba commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:12pm

Surely it would come down to DHD becoming a cheap asian pop out brand and lose consumer respect for his products.........maybe seeing Mick pump out his soft boards has made Handley greedy.......anyway anyone who drives a jet ski like he did is a risk i recon.

simba

freeride76's picture
freeride76's picture
freeride76 commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:28pm

Lots of new players in the surf industry, bit of a grassroots revival if you ask me.

DHD has had (asian made) epoxy boards on the market for at least 2 years.......the weirdly named Epoxicore.

Far as I can see they haven't really taken off.

Looks to me like asian made eps/epoxy is being sold to the market not for it's performance
advantages but because cheap labour and ease of mass production adds to the bottom line.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 4:38pm

This is all just weird.

For further reference and common sense.

General Social issues: Rita Panahi & Lauren Southern
Indigenous issues: Jacinta Price and Anthony Dillion
Gender: Debra Soh.
Islam: Armin Navabi & Brigitte Gabriel
Population: Dick Smith

Elliedog's picture
Elliedog's picture
Elliedog commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 5:27pm

You’d have to think Mick f has a large stake in this and DH is just gunna go along for the ride..... it’s shit.... agree with Harman support the local shaper even though there aren’t too many. Had an hour with Sam Egan this week.... that visit alone is worth more than a DHD pop out

Luba

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 6:07pm

Not even remotely interested in the DHD deal , but it was a great story right to the point you entered the meeting.

There’s something oddly enjoyable about walking amongst the besuited cube monkeys* in a pair of boardies that feels so liberating. Especially when you get to watch the city recede in the rear view mirror whilst they’re still pushing their pens and watching the clock.

Girls in their city work gear can be next level sexy though. City pubs at lunchtime blow your hair back.

* Cube monkeys ....cheers , Freeride. That term is the gift that just keeps on giving. I love it !

johnson's picture
johnson's picture
johnson commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 9:46pm

I remember going to the city as a kid and looking at all the dudes in suits and thinking "these guys are killing it, they wear a suit so they must be important."

Then I went back again in my early 20's and saw the reality - most of them are barely out of uni, barely able to tie their own shoelaces, and barely able to do their job, let alone choose a suit that fits. And they're willingly signing up to a lifetime of pen-pushing in a cubicle. Any suit you see on the street between 8am and 6pm is probably somebodies glorified errand boy, because all the people who've actually "made it" are permanently chained to their desk while not being paid for overtime.

That realisation changed my life for the better.

Westofthelake's picture
Westofthelake's picture
Westofthelake commented Friday, 30 Nov 2018 at 8:23am

Yea, I can relate to that Johno. I developed an early allergic reaction to suits as well. They simply didn't 'suit' me.

jayet-010's picture
jayet-010's picture
jayet-010 commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 12:23pm

[email protected]#t canyon it's called in Perth. I've worked in high vis and a suit and they both suck. At least the coffee and the view are better in the city.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 6:48pm

I would hate to see them bring down a newer Brand like Modom.

Mergers and Acquisitions......

blower's picture
blower's picture
blower commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 7:55pm

What percentage of DHD the company does DH the man own? While still there, how much have Mick and (likely) Stephanie plowed in and possibly have at stake?

PCS PeterPan's picture
PCS PeterPan's picture
PCS PeterPan commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 11:16pm

OR . . . $ 250 on Number 7 (Red Intuition) Race 2 tomorrow at the Gold Coast races , she's a sure bet .
Full respect for Mick on a right pointbreak , but please don't tell me he's handy with a power planer . Meh !

kaiser's picture
kaiser's picture
kaiser commented Friday, 23 Nov 2018 at 11:24pm

It’s race 5, if you’re playing at home...

Liquidline's picture
Liquidline's picture
Liquidline commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 12:24am

Anyone who buys a Thailand pop out is a flogger. Probably the same floggers who whinge about paying more than $1 a litre for local Australian milk at woolys

Liquidline's picture
Liquidline's picture
Liquidline commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 12:24am

DH is a flogger

Gary G's picture
Gary G's picture
Gary G commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 5:12am

For a $250 investment, Gary will let you watch him do squats for a period of time. 30 mins for most, 45 minutes if your name is Roi, and 60min if you put an eBIT in your mouth while you watch.

You're investing in a tangible and strong asset (Gary's moneymaker) and the inevitable joy you receive from the experience is an instant Return On Investment.

You and me, Gary, ain’t nothing but mammals so let’s do it* like they do it on the aerobics channel

*faceys

Clivus Multrum's picture
Clivus Multrum's picture
Clivus Multrum commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 10:19am

What are Gary’s thoughts on modom? More of a router man/ man-router?

Gary G's picture
Gary G's picture
Gary G commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 11:19am

Gary loves a bit of home handiwork, especially getting on the job with a plunge router.

Every time he see a plunge router, he can’t help but get wood.

You and me, Gary, ain’t nothing but mammals so let’s do it* like they do it on the aerobics channel

*faceys

Optimist's picture
Optimist's picture
Optimist commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 6:11am

Wow DHD’s made in Thailand...another sellout ... find out if your board is made in Australia then buy it. Our guys in our factories are making the worlds best boards and you can ride them for a year then get a good price on gumtree..too easy.

Max Wax's picture
Max Wax's picture
Max Wax commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 7:54am

Debatable, a lot of the little ferrets in Australian factories are 18 years old doing apprentiships.

The DHD PU boards are all Australian made. Only epoxy are made in Thailand and the same goes for JS, the factory those epoxies come out of(cobra) is the biggest epoxy factory in the world. And have more trained people to do that job. If you get epoxy made in Australia it takes 12 weeks with outsourcing labour.
I don't think this aussie/Thai argument is really one that is worth having, who makes your televisions, iPhone, cars, almost everything in the world and does it well?

Max Wax's picture
Max Wax's picture
Max Wax commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 8:25am

Also, it's surfers that come in to shops saying, oh that's too much for a board, I'm not paying that. That leads to production being made over seas. So you can afford it. It's a 200 dollar excess for Australian made epoxy purely for the labour and outsourcing.

The amount of people that say in shops. Oh I can a board made by davo down the street for 550 and I mean sometimes he doesn't make what I want and takessome liberties but he makes a good board!

The reason companies are going to Thailand is cause locals are stingey know it all's.

wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 8:05am

Branding softboards and SUPs DHD is probably the only good business idea in the whole spruik - the only thing they don’t want to do. No one fails in selling clothes. Haha

Spuddups's picture
Spuddups's picture
Spuddups commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 8:12am

I think where you want to be with surfboard manufacturing is where Apple is at with their iphones. The vast majority of the profit for them is in the design, software and intellectual property. They just get people in China and Thailand to do the donkey work for them.

The idea of paying people in Australia to build mass produced surfboards is foolish in my opinion. Australia has near full employment so why try to protect low paying manual jobs that can be done better overseas? Do the higher paying design and maybe the shaping in Australia, make the money from that.

This discussion reminds me of a quip from Milton Friedman. He was in Nepal being shown some roadworks that were part of the development of the countryside. He asked why the workers only had picks and shovels. Why not get an excavator in? The reply was that an excavator would put some of the workers out of work. His answer was "Why not just give them spoons instead of shovels then?"

morg's picture
morg's picture
morg commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 10:16am

How many good Shapers are really paid what they are worth? I’d argue not many.

Pick anyone at the top of their game in your local area, be it solicitor, builder, doctor or tradie in demand. Look at their house(s) and cars etc, then consider your favourite Shaper who’s been refinining his/her skills over their lifetime. How do they compare?
We all like that special feeling of chatting to a shaper and getting our special custom surfboard, but then again there is also something cool about being able to buy a well manufactured surfboard off the rack or online that goes really well at a good price.

Manufactured surfboards becoming mainstream is enevitable and its probably better that it’s driven by someone who has pride in their brand and wants to produce and sell high performance surfboards. Hopefully he/they will get it right this time.

jacksprat's picture
jacksprat's picture
jacksprat commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 10:14am

Oh dear. Most people would accept that crowdfunding is organised begging. All you are investing in here is a brand name. Much like a restaurant. This one only for those who need a tax loss.

onetimeonly

freeride76's picture
freeride76's picture
freeride76 commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 10:38am

"The idea of paying people in Australia to build mass produced surfboards is foolish in my opinion. Australia has near full employment so why try to protect low paying manual jobs that can be done better overseas? "

Yeah, but nah eh.
Building surfboards is not low paying manual work.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 4:02pm

There are not much margins in surfboards though.
Through materials and labour its really a head scratch to figure out if it would be a viable business venture. (I have shaped a lot of my own boards on and off for the last fifteen years.)
Whether boards are made in Australia vs Asia .I think it really comes down to quality control.
Overall quality materials , working conditions, convenience of getting your personal board designer.
Once things start being manufactured overseas things can go downhill pretty quick.
Their is no epa or health standards. No one really watching the overall quality of materials and production techniques.

Then you have wear the burden of transit costs and damage to the environment .I.e board miles( resources used for materials and transport.) Then you might realise that very little or no money goes back into the local economy.

Spuddups's picture
Spuddups's picture
Spuddups commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 6:42pm

How many wealthy shapers do you know? It's pretty low paid man. It most certainly should be better paid, but that's just the way it goes. It was like that long before they started making boards in Asia. I have made fifty surfboards over the years, and one thing I can tell you is that it's not something you would do to get rich. People in Australia make boards because they like doing it. That's about the only reason I can think of.

In regards to the manual labour thing I admit I was a bit fast and loose with that term, however other than the actual shaping, you can teach someone to specialise in any one of the processes involved in a few months; hence why some of the glassing coming out of Thailand is of a reasonably high standard.

What I was really driving at is that we should be leaving the mass production to the Asians. It's a mug's game trying to compete with that. Destined to fail. Where we can compete is in the personal relationship you have with your local shaper. If they are producing finely tuned surfboards that go well for local surfers in local conditions then there'll always be a place for them. People don't mind paying a bit more for the personal touch. That's their competitive advantage.

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 5:03pm

I don't think it's simple as being a bad or good thing if built local or overseas.

In regard to the market as a whole, its only a negative if boards made overseas are sold for a cheaper price than the average local board price, but if it is priced higher than the average board price, then there is even an argument it is helping readjust the value of surfboards and help lift the ceiling.

In regard to damage to the environment (carbon footprint) that's also not so simple, it really depends on the materials and process for example Firewire boards are made in Thailand but due to the materials they use their boards have a very low carbon foot print.
Shipping is actually a very very small part of the overall carbon footprint.

Then you need to factor in lifespan of the board, most PU/PE boards don't last that long meaning you need to buy more which produces more.

Regarding quality, location has nothing to do with quality some of the worse glass jobs I've seen have been boards built in Australia, and these days you an get very high quality materials and workmanship in Asia.

For further reference and common sense.

General Social issues: Rita Panahi & Lauren Southern
Indigenous issues: Jacinta Price and Anthony Dillion
Gender: Debra Soh.
Islam: Armin Navabi & Brigitte Gabriel
Population: Dick Smith

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Saturday, 24 Nov 2018 at 10:14pm

Get off the internet Robert.
Board miles suck .........no question.
Good luck finding a local shaper in twenty years time. When all you wanted was a cool logo and you didn't care where it was made ECT ; ).
Anyone one can surf and that's great. How many surfers do you know who can surf then build you a board start to finish? Within 20 kms of your house or local beach ?

indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming's picture
indo-dreaming commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 2:20pm

If you produce exactly the same board lets say an eco type board locally then yes, board miles count in that case.

But when you are comparing a PU/PE board to a more eco friendly EPS/Epoxy type board using bio resins etc even if its made overseas and shipped to Aust or USA etc the carbon footprint from shipping is tiny and barely factors into the overall carbon footprint (and thats not taking into lifespan)

There has been studies on this area for other industries , the guys from http://www.sustainablesurf.org/ecoboard/ did a good post on this in the surfer mag forum some years ago, i will try to dig it up.

IMHO there will always be local shapers, but i do think it will become more niche type market and customers are going to have to pay a much higher price.

For further reference and common sense.

General Social issues: Rita Panahi & Lauren Southern
Indigenous issues: Jacinta Price and Anthony Dillion
Gender: Debra Soh.
Islam: Armin Navabi & Brigitte Gabriel
Population: Dick Smith

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 3:17am

Nice website.
Just noticed one thing.
Fin boxes are not noted as being eco?
$o that means no board is green or completely uses sustainable products........

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Thursday, 29 Nov 2018 at 5:59pm

Seems you forgot to answer my questions Indo ............?

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 1:23am

Shaper DH doesn't show because of dust....sounds a bit amateur hour right from the start. You are asking for peoples cash, surely you would have flown down the day before to prepare, check the venue etc

knB

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 1:56am

INVESTORS BE WARNED

Ok so I spent a fair bit of time as a cube monkey and know my way around a spreadsheet. Had a quick glance through the offer document.....

1. They are valuing the company at $22.5m that's crazy

2. The company had EBIT Of 909k 07/08 that's earning before interest and tax. So assume NPAT or real would be less than $600k. A very very poor return vs valuation.

3. Actual (net) asset value of only $2m. Very little cash.

4. Of the $2.5m they are trying to raise the crowd funding group take 6 percent.

5. Promising a big uplift 18/19 I don't believe. How and why ?

6. Very limited company history - purchased from liquidation in 2011

7. They list a team of surfers but don't say how much they pay or provide in kind to have said surfers support the brand. Are they owners or just paid athletes ?

Happy to do a deeper assement if anyone's keen but on surface I'd suggest people stay well clear.

knB

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 5:39am

Particularly when their marquee surfer has retired from competition and his global influence is on the descent. If it wasn’t for Fanning , DHD would be just another regional brand.

Without Fanning showcasing the blue channel bottom at J Bay how many of those would have sold ?

Giovanni's picture
Giovanni's picture
Giovanni commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 3:15pm

Sound advice, noting he purchased his own company from liquidation... the one that was going to change surfboard manufacturing forever. It has been said 'if you want to make a small fortune in surfboards start with a large one'...

bukz's picture
bukz's picture
bukz commented Sunday, 2 Dec 2018 at 9:29pm

First useful comment here. Investing is all about these facts and numbers and nothing about random uneducated opinions. Thank you.

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 1:52am

....as for modom I'd be highly sceptical of a company prepared to flog a magnet as a shark repelant when absolutely zero real evidence exists that they work. That's just selling hope and putting people at risk.

knB

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 1:59am

Finally they have only raised $63k so far which isn't going to turn the dial at all for the company. In fact even if they raise the full $2.5m which immediately becomes 2.35m ( after fees) and it's hard to see how that money will mke any difference

knB

wallpaper's picture
wallpaper's picture
wallpaper commented Sunday, 25 Nov 2018 at 8:46am

but it's all so fun modern creative authentic etc going forward

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 3:35am

I really think he damaged the personal brand with the whole jet ski incidents.
This is a very interesting situation, I agree with lost.Not turning up to the shareholder launch regardless. That stems from poor planning and lack of professional standards. Which seems very common in the surf industry.

In this time of the internet, playing quite doesn't work. Even if he did not make it to the meeting. He could have Skype/ live chatted / facebook live / FaceTimed the meeting.
Seriously .......five p's .DHD and
Tony I hope you're reading this .

Optimist's picture
Optimist's picture
Optimist commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 5:53am

Anyone thinking of buying a board made overseas should go and take a walk through a modern Australian board factory. Guys on the computers refining a shape, Great aussie shapers and ghost shapers putting the final touches on some ones dream machine. The glassers and their steely stare as they apply their craft. Boards being built, packed, freighted by the hundreds and all the while there is a buzz in the air, dozens of guys laughing and some cussing as they produce their different brands, incredible order in the chaos, but these guys all love surfboards, they just love surfing and everything about it. I couldn't picture myself contributing to closing my board factory down. I have said before that I don't care if a parent company is based overseas, as long as my board is made by these guys. My Aussie guys are actually refining and improving on some "wonder " shapes originally designed overseas. I'll just continue to rock up with cash in hand and custom order or rack buy my new sticks with that factory always in the back of my mind.

sanded's picture
sanded's picture
sanded commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 5:24pm

Well said Optimist! As a materials supplier to these guys you are talking about, they are doing it out of passion of their product and when they get that text or email about the board they just shaped for their customer going nuts for them, that tells them its all worth doing! - none of these guys are thinking that they will be the next multi million surf business. continue buying from your local shaper as they are the ones who will see you riding your board at your local break and can change the board to suit you! We need to support the local industry or we wont have one.

roondog's picture
roondog's picture
roondog commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 10:19am

Corporate filth / greed - reap what you sow. No sympathy or care for 'labels' that get caught up in expansion or any other form of 'economic development', keep chasing the $$$ - how much was / is enough. Don't even know why publish an article like this.

joesydney's picture
joesydney's picture
joesydney commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 11:29am

What I dont understand is - if you want to get rich why would you go into board shaping? Shaping boards I would have thought is business pursuit with the upside being lifestyle not money.
Reading the article the pitch seems to be give us money so we can diversify be bigger and make more money. As an investor if making money is my sole driver the last place I would park my cash is in a surfbrand.
Just sounds like a really bad pitch really. You have to capture peoples hearts if you want them to invest in a surfbrand - wheres the heart?

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 12:46pm

"Where's the heart?"

I'd say, and take this with a boulder-sized grain of salt, that the heart of a surf brand is the surfboard. It's why I wrote the article in the first place, I don't ride big label boards, I've got bugger all idea about investment, but I like the notion of an expanding surf company retaining the surfboard as their primary product.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 3:48pm

How many boards a year does the average surfer buy Stu net?
I really was expecting Channel Islands to focus more on apparel when they were taken over by Burton ten years ago.
They have (CI) expanded into soft goods, fins, traction, t shirts

I honestly think they missed there window with KS
They day he left quick CI should have purchased Kelly head to toe. It would have been a little risky ......yet the market especially USA would have taken the bait.
Every comment I read about RKS revolves around him with C I boards He was synonymous with the brand. I think they both missed the boat!

joesydney's picture
joesydney's picture
joesydney commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 4:05pm

Hmm I guess if it was me doing the pitch I would have left out the CEO and had Darren stand-up and say something along the lines of “this is my craft and these are my artworks and I have a dream that every young Australian surfer should get to ride a high performance Australian made board that embodies Australian culture so we can have a million Mick Fannings...” now give me your money.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 1:04am

Looks like most products will be made by independent contractors in Asia.
(Who will logo the products DHD )
Then ship products back to Australia and to overseas markets.
Hense my concerns over quality control , materials, board miles .....

Norm de Ploom's picture
Norm de Ploom's picture
Norm de Ploom commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 12:34pm

On from the lifestyle part of the biz, remember a shaper ideally being paid $2000 per board for all the IP and R&D.
IP and R&D being shaping and a shitload, months on end, of surfing.

joeyjojo's picture
joeyjojo's picture
joeyjojo commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 7:02pm

What was Einstein’s definition of insanity again?
How many people does the guy need to rip off before he’s smoked himself?
Man has no scruples or ethics; just ring up any local supplier that he left hanging after buying a shit load of products, knowing they were going into administration the very next day with no intention of paying the bill.
Can’t imagine the Japanese market would be to keen to have the label back again after ripping off a potential investor a million after cooking the books.
Wondering if he still steals cash money and hides it under the carpet. A case of investor beware!

P.s
95 % of micks ( and all other team riders boards) were never shaped by Darren. They were all done by his trusted ghosty. Who he subsequently fucked over as well.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:08pm

Name that ghost?
Or we shall never know ........

surfer1971's picture
surfer1971's picture
surfer1971 commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:29pm

A few of the guys that ghost shaped over the years are Soda, Kuma and a NZ guy that I cant remember but was the guy who did all the team boards. DHD is like a politician. Kisses babies and jet sets around the globe.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:35pm

Paul Barron ? Nz

surfer1971's picture
surfer1971's picture
surfer1971 commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:52pm

No that is not him but I know he is a very good shaper as he does the Lost boards in oz now

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Wednesday, 28 Nov 2018 at 1:21am

Barron does lost in oz?
I know he does C I in nz now days and sold a very interesting design patent to CI a little while back. Which everyone is copying.
He once mentioned to me he worked for DHD.

sanded's picture
sanded's picture
sanded commented Wednesday, 28 Nov 2018 at 3:17pm

Blaise Dylan

joeyjojo's picture
joeyjojo's picture
joeyjojo commented Wednesday, 28 Nov 2018 at 6:04pm

Gavin upson; shapes under 1-Da surfboards now.

bukz's picture
bukz's picture
bukz commented Sunday, 2 Dec 2018 at 9:40pm

1DA Shapes, Gavin makes absolutely magic surfboards. Not cheap but worth every cent.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Thursday, 29 Nov 2018 at 6:02pm

Thank you.

Norm de Ploom's picture
Norm de Ploom's picture
Norm de Ploom commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 7:38pm

On the beancounting thing, intangible assets are a bit over 1/3 of equity.
No details as to what these are.
Mick having another shark fight?

freeride76's picture
freeride76's picture
freeride76 commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 8:54pm

what are they going to do with the money?

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 12:24am

Most of it Working Capital and Property (up to $1.9m)
Product innovation up to $287k
Marketing up to $162k
Other cost up to $150k

Those are the max but i doubt they will get this offer away. They have $63k and need min $500k, Smells bad and numbers are terrible.

knB

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:17pm

On a plate in the microwave.

DamonS's picture
DamonS's picture
DamonS commented Monday, 26 Nov 2018 at 9:27pm

Curiosity got the better of me earlier today and I did a company search of both DHD Surf P/L and Modom DHD P/L. Interesting whether you are “investing” in both, or one.

Directors of DHD Surf;
Matt Bailey, Matt Clayworth, Tony Emerton, Clayton Lyndon, Darren Handley and Kim Handley.

DHD Surf shareholders;
65,000/800,000 Clayworth P/L (QLD),
307,960/800,000 Right Brain Capital P/L (QLD),
280,000/800,000 Evil Empire P/L (QLD),
65,000/800,000 Iamatana P/L (QLD),
82,040/800,000 Haig Fraser Investments P/L (Hampton VIC).

Director of Modom DHD; Tony Emerton.

Modom DHD shareholders;
2/100 TB Ventures P/L (WA),
79/100 DHD Surf (QLD),
19/100 Apex Park P/L (Geelong VIC).

There is a link between the two in there (ie: DHD Surf 79% stake in Modom). Noticeable are none of the “brand” surfers, however expect they would be somewhere behind some of the entities with ownership. But maybe not. I ran out of motivation to keep digging. A lot of interested parties to keep rowing in the same direction.

Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean's picture
Lanky Dean commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 8:38pm

Nice one Damon s
Unveiling the covers of a lot of different hopes.
Honestly this side of the business is necessary.
It's just making me yawn though trying to understand why people would invest in this ?
Surfstitch 2.0
Billabong. 2.0
Quik Ross 2.0
Salts and suits.......

DamonS's picture
DamonS's picture
DamonS commented Tuesday, 27 Nov 2018 at 9:20pm

With the amount of people already involved, likely of adequate means, I can’t understand why they wouldn’t fund their plans themselves - if they believed in them. ASB indicates they are basing their valuation on 22x fy2019 profit which is insanely high. Seems they chasing “free” money to take their risks with? Some may fall for it.

sharkman's picture
sharkman's picture
sharkman commented Thursday, 29 Nov 2018 at 12:02pm

here's one , what if DH fell off a jetski and died , how much is the Co worth ?

x

CMC's picture
CMC's picture
CMC commented Wednesday, 28 Nov 2018 at 5:02pm

How does the saying go?
''Fools and their money are soon parted''

ron's picture
ron's picture
ron commented Thursday, 29 Nov 2018 at 10:01am

This pitch would not go well on shark tank.

tux's picture
tux's picture
tux commented Friday, 30 Nov 2018 at 8:07am

Should of had more JP and less Darren

Terminal's picture
Terminal's picture
Terminal commented Sunday, 2 Dec 2018 at 2:28pm

Just curious about the min-max investment sought target thing works. What happens if they don't reach it in the allotted time as only 67k raised so far. Does the investor get their money back, or is it Filet mignon all round and an open bar at Cooly pub that Friday night?

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 2 Dec 2018 at 4:24pm

They usually need to get to the min to get the share issue away. It dose not look like they are going too so yes investors would get their money back minus fees (all depends on the offer document but this is usually the case). At $67k its highly unlikely they will get their min. The reaction of investors in the first week tends to be the best indication. The swell net comments here will not be helping.

knB

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Sunday, 2 Dec 2018 at 4:25pm

....plus its a terrible investment as per my previous comments

knB

the-u-turn's picture
the-u-turn's picture
the-u-turn commented Thursday, 6 Dec 2018 at 9:34am

...late to the show as I was keen to see this unfold. Stu, appreciate the interest in this subject, I think we all enjoy something that raises good questions.

Lost & Damon have supplied sound figures and as someone who has a little coin in business globally I'd simply say this, 'Where is the point of difference?'. I can't see one.

There's a lot of projection here without evidence...and as Stevie Wright would have said, 'I've got BASE on my mind'.

The EBIT is a concern and I wouldn't be all smiles showing these figures. All this said, I wish anyone willing to give it a go best of luck - just do it with your money, your mortgage, your back to the wall and not that of your investors.

The U Turn
...a little Aloha goes a long way.

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Tuesday, 15 Jan 2019 at 2:12pm

Three days to go till the DHD equity offer closes and they've raised $75,250, or 15.1% of the goal.

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Tuesday, 15 Jan 2019 at 2:42pm

Looks like the uncommon "common sense" has prevailed. I wonder what impact the comments here have had overall. Strange they did very little to promote and get this away from the start. Interestingly Equitise has a new would be digital bank "xinja" with even worse numbers than DHD (no revenue yet an valuing themselves at $100m) in market right now and they have raised $700k in a day. The difference being lots and lots of talking to the opportunity. Media, media, media. PS it looks like a terrible investment as well.

knB

crg's picture
crg's picture
crg commented Tuesday, 15 Jan 2019 at 2:19pm

No luck for the greedy...should buy him a few jetski lessons though...

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Tuesday, 15 Jan 2019 at 2:43pm

They won't hit their min so the money (i assume less fees) will be returned to investors,,,,they got lucky this time.

knB

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet commented Wednesday, 23 Jan 2019 at 6:00pm

I just received an email from Equitise - the company employed to raise capital on behalf of DHD - which closes the affair.

"Thank you for your interest in DHD's equity crowdfunding offer. Unfortunately, the offer has had to be withdrawn due to advanced discussions with a strategic investor that came about through the equity crowdfund.   

We'd like to wish DHD the best of luck with this new opportunity and thank you once again for your interest. 

Please let us know if you have any questions.

Regards

lost's picture
lost's picture
lost commented Wednesday, 23 Jan 2019 at 9:57pm

Ha ha a that's a complete bullshit comment. It has closed for one reason and one reason only - they were no where near the min investment. Clearly they think this is a nicer way of saying it.

knB