Australia - you're standing in it

Sheepdog's picture
Sheepdog started the topic in Friday, 18 Sep 2020 at 11:51am

The "I can't believe it's not politics" thread.

Hutchy 19's picture
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Hutchy 19 Monday, 4 Oct 2021 at 2:20pm

Blowin - very happy to agree with you and fight with you on issues we believe in . I do have a different view , I think , to you on immigration .

I will do a quick outline of my views on the home prices thread if you are interested .

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Michael Adam Monday, 4 Oct 2021 at 2:21pm

He’ll be banned/silenced/cancelled/
censored soon. The bullying aint working dammit!

san Guine's picture
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san Guine Monday, 4 Oct 2021 at 7:19pm
Michael Adam wrote:

He’ll be banned/silenced/cancelled/
censored soon. The bullying aint working dammit!

Michael,
Who will be banned? and Why? Please explain...

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 7:44am

Oh my freaking god.

Just when you are starting to think that this outrageous totalitarian / corporatistic political system can’t get any more bizarre….

Now the government refuses to let their coolie labour leave Australia. Imagine if all the highly skilled food service delivery technicians left and Australian businesses had to start paying living wages! Or if all the extremely valuable unskilled dependent partners of those highly skilled food service delivery technicians wanted to return to India and the savvy property investors who rely on them to pay rent on their sky kennel apartment investments, suddenly found that their petrol-derivative clad investments were now financially underwater and there was a knock on effect through the completely stable and fundamentally secure real estate market!

Better to just shut the borders and refuse the coolie labour the opportunity to leave our land of the free! How did the coolies even get out of house arrest anyway!?!?

Lock. Them.Up!!!!!!!

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/the-feed/devastated-temporary-visa-holders-e...

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wallpaper Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 9:11am

you really are a very ugly very insecure person and a coward to boot.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 9:41am
wallpaper wrote:

you really are a very ugly very insecure person and a coward to boot.

Good point.

Scomo should tear up the passports of the temporary visa holders who want to return to their home nations. Thank you for your voice of reason in showing me to be the bad guy in this situation. Every owner of an Australian business who’d rather the government hold foreign nationals hostage so they don’t abandon their exploitive work places thanks you from the bottom of their hearts.

Quick question: On exactly what basis do you think the government is preventing foreign nationals on temporary visas from leaving the country after the borders are opened for Australian citizens?

There was never a scientific or medical justification for preventing Australians from leaving the country. What about preventing foreign nationals from leaving? It shows the times we are living in and how far the insidious creep of governmental authoritarianism has progressed that every person in the world isn’t utterly gobsmacked at what’s occurring.

BTW….isn’t it funny about wallpaper? About 40 years ago people realised that it was a bit pointless and didn’t really add anything positive. Since then it’s basically been ignored…..with good reason.

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stunet Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:01am

Pretty shitty comment TBH. I know a few people now caught up and they don't fit your profile in the least.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:12am
stunet wrote:

Pretty shitty comment TBH. I know a few people now caught up and they don't fit your profile in the least.

It’s a bit disingenuous to suggest that my comment doesn’t reflect the nature of the government’s completely arbitrary, inhumane and unscientific ruling.

Just because you know a nice foreign National inadvertently caught up in the heinous rule doesn’t undermine the truth in what I say.

Perhaps you could explain the good faith and necessity behind the ruling? Once you’ve explained it to me you can go and tell your foreign national temporary visa holder friends that, whilst you are allowed to fly to Bali on your way to XXXX, they really don’t qualify to leave Australia because…..?

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garyg1412 Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:13am

Blowin instead of wearing horses blinkers try getting your information from the horses mouth.
Capture
image uploader
Seems to me like those food service delivery technicians are allowed to leave but not allowed to come back. But then again we all know, as Stunet said, the profile of most people caught up in this are not food service delivery technicians is it. Come on tell us you agree!!!

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:23am

Come on….let’s not beat around the bush here.

Why do you think the government is doing this? As soon as Australians are permitted to leave will let any foreigner from anywhere come here as a tourist or to buy real estate as long as they are jabbed, but temporary visa holders aren’t allowed to re-enter? The international students are coming in.

It’s government coercion.

They are bluffing the exploited workers with the call that “ Sure you can leave but you can’t come back” in order to prevent the likely loss of exploitable labour.

stunet's picture
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stunet Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:23am

@Blowin,

Then unload on the govt and not accuse all temp visa holders of being coolie labour. FFS we live in an international world, there are as many temporary visa holders here as there are Australians who've benefited from holding a temp visa while living OS.

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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:33am

I didn’t accuse all temporary visa holders of being coolie labour but it’s ridiculous to try and portray someone you know as representative of temporary visa holders, after the routine establishment that exploitation of temporary visa workers as an option to employing or training Australians isn’t an entrenched nation wide culture.

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2019/03/migrant-workers-taskforce-finds...

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garyg1412 Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:33am
Blowin wrote:

Come on….let’s not beat around the bush here.

Why do you think the government is doing this? As soon as Australians are permitted to leave will let any foreigner from anywhere come here as a tourist or to buy real estate as long as they are jabbed, but temporary visa holders aren’t allowed to re-enter? The international students are coming in.

It’s government coercion.

They are bluffing the exploited workers with the call that “ Sure you can leave but you can’t come back” in order to prevent the likely loss of exploitable labour.

Apologies I found the latest version of the Dept of Immigration's policy in this regard. Seems like you are correct.

Capture

As I said time to take those blinkers off. They not only make you look stupid they make you sound stupid as well.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 10:34am

+
Migrant Workers’ Taskforce finds systemic exploitation
By Unconventional Economist in Australian Economist
By Leith van Onselen

The federal government has expressed in-principle support for the 22 recommendations made in the report of the Migrant Workers’ Taskforce. The report found that “wage underpayment is widespread and has become more entrenched over time”, with as many as half of all migrant workers exploited. The government is set to announce criminal sanctions for “clear, deliberate and systemic” underpayment of workers, despite opposition from employers’ groups. It also intends to establish a national labour-hire registration scheme covering industries where wage exploitation is widespread. From The AFR:

The 141-page report concluded “the problem of wage underpayment is widespread and has become more entrenched over time”, with the most comprehensive survey showing as many as half of temporary migrant workers may be underpaid…

“There needs to be a much stronger enforcement response than has been evident to date,” the report said…

The Morrison government has agreed to introduce unprecedented criminal sanctions for employers who seriously exploit workers and a national registry scheme to crack down on unscrupulous labour hire firms…

It’s amazing that it has taken this long for our politicians to respond.

The 7-Eleven migrant worker scandal broke in 2015, and since then there has been a regular flow of stories emerging about the systemic abuse of Australia’s various migrant worker programs and visa system.

The 2016 report by the Senate Education and Employment References Committee, entitled A National Disgrace: The Exploitation of Temporary Work Visa Holders, also documented the abuses of Australia’s temporary visa system for foreign workers, and found that migrants were “consistently reported to suffer widespread exploitation in the Australian workforce”.

According to the ACTU, the perpetual flood of migrant workers is a direct cause of Australia’s anaemic wages growth:

The relatively recent availability of a large and vulnerable pool of temporary migrant workers has undoubtedly contributed to current record low levels of wages growth and a growing reluctance by employers to train local workers…

There have been a range of abuses uncovered which have clearly shown that the entire system is broken. From 7-11 and Domino’s to agriculture, construction, food processing to Coles, Dominos and Caltex, it is clear that the abuses occur in a number of visa classes whether they be students, working holiday makers or visa workers in skilled occupations…

Migration intermediaries have a vested interest in inflating demand. Australia has created a massive industry with many migration agents outside of our jurisdiction who cannot be prosecuted for breaches. This mushrooming “migration industry”- a complex and transnational web of agents, lawyers, labour recruiters, accommodation brokers and loan sharks – is currently largely unregulated.

The growth of labour hire operators alongside the migration industry has led to companies seeking to sell temporary migrant workers to employers, creating a fake “Job Network” which preferences temporary workers over Australians.

These views were echoed by the book, The Wages Crisis in Australia, released late last year by a group of labour market academics:

Official stock data indicate that the visa programmes for international students, temporary skilled workers and working holiday makers have tripled in numbers since the late 1990s…

Decisions by the federal Coalition government under John Howard to introduce easier pathways to permanent residency for temporary visa holders, especially international students and temporary skilled workers, gave a major impetus to TMW [temporary migrant worker] visa programmes.

Most international students and temporary skilled workers, together with many working holiday makers, see themselves as involved in a project of ‘staggered’ or ‘multi-step’ migration, whereby they hope to leap from their present status into a more long-term visa status, ideally permanent residency…

Though standard accounts describe Australian immigration as oriented to skilled labour, this characterisation stands at odds with the abundant evidence on expanding temporary migration and the character of TMW jobs… the fact that their work is primarily in lower-skilled jobs suggests that it is more accurate, as several scholars point out, to speak of a shift in Australia towards a de facto low-skilled migration programme…

Put simply, temporary demand for migrant workers often creates a permanent need for them in the labour market. Research shows that in industries where employers have turned to temporary migrants en masse, it erodes wages and conditions in these industries over time, making them less attractive to locals…

Combined, then, with the problems with enforcement and compliance, it is not hard to conclude that the failure to index TSMIT is contributing to a wages crisis for skilled temporary migrant workers… So the failure to index the salary floor for skilled migrant workers is likely to affect wages growth for these workers, as well as to have broader implications for all workers in the Australian labour market.

Australia’s immigration system has become a giant rort that’s all about lowering costs for employers by crushing wages and abrogating their responsibility for training, while also feeding the growth lobby more consumers.

Indeed, the latest data from the ABS, released last month, revealed that the median income of so-called ‘skilled’ temporary migrants was a shockingly low $1,143 per week or $59,436 per year in 2016. And this is unambiguously contributing to lower wages growth across the broader economy.

Eliminating migrant abuse and raising wages would be good for the Australian economy. Why? First, because the least productive businesses would lose people, shrink and go bust, transferring workers, land and capital to more productive businesses, thereby raising average productivity across the economy. Second, because all businesses, observing higher wages, would invest more in labour saving technologies, training and restructuring to raise productivity.

This is how the labour “market” is supposed to work. However, allowing the mass importation of foreign workers circumvents the ordinary functioning of the labour market by enabling employers to pluck cheap foreign workers in lieu of raising wages, and abrogating their responsibility for training.

This is deleterious for both Australian workers and the broader economy, and must be stopped.

garyg1412's picture
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garyg1412 Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 11:05am

How can the median income of so called "skilled" migrants of $1,143 per week be "shockingly low". That is above the current average wage of a legal secretary in Tasmania and they are well skilled. Actually it would be more than a lot of wage earners in Tasmania full stop. Probably the same in most smaller regional areas. Might be shockingly low if you live in the bigger cities but that would be a choice now wouldn't it.

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 11:39am

FMD, day in day out its the same plonkers on here** peddling the same batshit ....

** not specifically this topic at this time, tune in later and it will be something else sssssh

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 5:28pm

Lockdowns - Melbourne isn’t the world’s longest by far ....

***

5-FE81-A43-E480-4762-A698-859662-C5-AF98

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Hutchy 19 Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 5:40pm

You don't live in Melb do you Smiley . One second longer that the previous record is WAY to far imo .

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 5:59pm

Not sure how scooter can argue against lockdowns while keeping innocent people locked up in detention

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indo-dreaming Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 6:06pm

Nobody is locked up in detention all are free to go at any time, the offer of resettlement in PNG or Cambodia(both countries signed to the refugee convention) is probably still an option as is returning home with huge resettlement payments.

Quite a few have taken this option, because situations change, wars end political situations change.

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 6:26pm

Too easy, bait taken by two of SN’s resident plonkers .... easier than hooking flathead

blindboy's picture
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blindboy Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 6:28pm

Watch out for Kneecapper Guy, he's pretty handy with that shotgun. He'll take out your patella from 100m.

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GuySmiley Tuesday, 5 Oct 2021 at 9:23pm

@ huh BB? I’m just a humble fisherman casting some well targeted bait into SN’s daily BS stream. Tonight landing two massive plonkers with little skill just a nose to the wind ....

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blindboy Wednesday, 6 Oct 2021 at 7:02am

Guy Kneecapper is Indo who thinks that kneecapping is a reasonable response to trespassers.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Wednesday, 6 Oct 2021 at 7:49am

Best we watch out for the hunch backed gaoler then. The soggy old authoritarian who thinks those who are guilty of Wrongspeak should be gaoled.

Bit of a chicken and the egg conundrum : Does being a school teacher for 30 years make someone a fascist authoritarian or does one become a career school teacher because they’re a fascist authoritarian?

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blindboy Wednesday, 6 Oct 2021 at 12:50pm

Well make up your mind, the other you called me a commie. But you know I always took a balanced political position when teaching. We would start the day with "Keep The Red Flag Flying" one day and " The Horst Wessel Song" the next.

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GuySmiley Wednesday, 6 Oct 2021 at 12:57pm
blindboy wrote:

Guy Kneecapper is Indo who thinks that kneecapping is a reasonable response to trespassers.

Must of missed that gem BB but I still remember the one where he expressed support for motorists delayed by extinction rebellion protests if “they took matters into their own hands”, the inference being some sort of violent response. This from the plonker who has scribed so much against BLM while remaining silent about lockdown protests.

blindboy's picture
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blindboy Wednesday, 6 Oct 2021 at 1:08pm

Check out the Vegan thread. It is pretty revealing about the attitudes of some of our prominent opinionators.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Thursday, 7 Oct 2021 at 5:59am

So now the ALP supports the moratorium on pursuing fraudulent behaviour and the acquiring of financial benefit through deception because it doesn’t want to alienate “aspirational” Australians AKA thieves.

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/labor-pledges-they-won-t-demand-...

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Optimist Thursday, 7 Oct 2021 at 7:56am

It was nice to see John Barilaro left a jar of his hair gel on his desk for the new incoming leader…..like all good tractors and farm machinery the hair needs a good slop of Rimula X to protect.

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seaslug Thursday, 7 Oct 2021 at 12:31pm

I thought it was a jar of Vaseline, also used for protection

udo's picture
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udo Thursday, 7 Oct 2021 at 2:18pm

Barilaro been having affair with Barnabys daughter...

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Friday, 8 Oct 2021 at 11:18am

Barnaby Joyce’s daughter was a senior advisor to Bruz Barillaro.

She is 23.

Nothing to see here. Move along.

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Roadkill Friday, 8 Oct 2021 at 12:20pm

23 years old...and a senior political advisor. Our capital is full of great examples of nepotism.

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zenagain Friday, 8 Oct 2021 at 1:52pm

I was thinking the same thing- laughable.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Monday, 11 Oct 2021 at 10:20am

From the Honourable Macrobusiness site:

+
Australia’s five Donald Trumps should shut up
By Houses and Holes in Australian Politicsat 10:00 am on October 11, 2021 | 3 comments
When MB successfully forecast and then chronicled Australia’s great “lost decade” of the 2010s, we did not anticipate it leaving a toxic rhetorical legacy worldwide.

The political carnage of the “lost decade”, in which we plodded through six PMs in seven years has, unfortunately, populated the world with a phalanx of young(ish) and damaged political misfits carrying grudges.

Literally, daily, now we have to endure the latest proclamation of drivel from an embittered former PM. These outbursts carry the implied seal of Australia’s highest office. The press has no choice but to report them and they must be taken seriously by the political economy in general.

Like a giant bat, Paul Keating swoops upon anything he sees as anti-China from his cavernous Potts Point office via connections at the China Development Bank.

Like a crumbling sphinx, John Howard haunts the press whenever his beloved Coalition chokes on its own blunders.

Like a tide of curdled milk, Kevin Rudd washes over the world on a million bucks a year from the Asia Society whose mission it is to bring us all together with Asia, whether that’s a good idea or not.

Like a pith helmeted relic, Tony Abbott genuflects before the sarcophagus of Prince Phillip at every available opportunity. Today taking the war to Taiwan.

Like an empty jar, Malcolm Turnbull echoes with perpetual policy prescriptions and values he conspicuously failed to either represent or implement himself.

Only Julia Gillard is operating with dignity and sense, using the badge of the office to further social equity and staying out of day-to-day politics.

What are these five Donald Trumps adding to Australia and the world other than their own burnished images of themselves? They are like the Office of the Australian PM: the musical. Or, perhaps FacePollie, a new and abused social media platform for inept former PMs.

Overly dramatic, amplifying divisions, reinforcing political tribalism, unlike the protocol of dignified noblesse oblige of yesteryear, the failed and pitiful five have become outriders for their respective causes, pushing civilised normatives into the profane.

This is the very opposite of what they should be doing, on-the-ground good works repaying the people that rose them on high.

If the Trump Five can’t bring themselves to put the office that they failed to good use then at least pay Australians the courtesy of putting a sock in it.

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san Guine Monday, 11 Oct 2021 at 10:48am

Haha "like a tide of curdled milk", KRudd in a nut shell

blindboy's picture
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blindboy Monday, 11 Oct 2021 at 10:53am

Well said. The collective wisdom of those 5vprevious PMs on current affairs, is pretty thin gruel.

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gsco Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 7:08am

A nice article for blowin on immigration:

afr.com wrote:

Australia needs an explosive post-World War II-style immigration surge that could bring in 2 million people over five years to rebuild the economy and address worsening labour shortages, according to NSW government advice to new Premier Dominic Perrottet.

Top bureaucrats last week urged Mr Perrottet to seize the national leadership initiative by pushing a “national dialogue on an aggressive resumption of immigration levels as a key means of economic recovery and post-pandemic growth”.

https://www.afr.com/politics/australia-needs-explosive-surge-of-2-millio...

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 8:38am

“rebuild the economy” = Pump up the Ponzi scheme.

Fuck the environment….we’ve got to sell more Sky Kennel dog box apartments to more highly skilled, yet eminently exploitable food service delivery technicians ASAP!

Australia needs more diversity just like it did in 1788!

offshoreozzie's picture
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offshoreozzie Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:04am

Immigration aint gunna do it.
Especially at the level of demise coming.

Immigration has seen the evaporation of national identity in many commonwealth countries including my current residence Canada and will enable State/Gov/NWO to further control/removal of rights and lunacy.

Thumbs up for Blowin.
(even though you're angry and rightly so as you're dealing with people here who are clueless)

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:09am

Lost me at New World Order.

offshoreozzie's picture
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offshoreozzie Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:17am

Many Australians are so blind to their own ignorance it's hilarious.

You can want change all you can Blowin but those in power aren’t going anywhere any time soon. They’re there as part of the plan and are the chosen puppets… it’s time to put away the disillusion that “Scotty from marketing” and his pals are just the “lucky” slapstick cronies holding the keys through the worst event ever in history - every part of the propaganda the last 20+ yrs has seen them ascend there at just the right time.

It’s kinda the same way Manchurian candidates Obama and currently in power Trudeau in Canada are grafted through and there for the REAL powers that be.

Being out for a while has helped me see much more impartially and to say...
Australia - you're fucking well and truly standing in it

offshoreozzie's picture
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offshoreozzie Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:19am
AndyM wrote:

Lost me at New World Order.

Sorry 'tard.
Perhaps you can buy the book the NWO spokesman???
https://www.amazon.ca/COVID-19-Great-Reset-Klaus-Schwab/dp/2940631123

What exactly are you struggling with AndyM?
The whole concept? You are truly lacking if so...

AndyM's picture
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AndyM Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:23am

Haha, Great Reset!
Keep 'em coming mate.

Lizard people?
HAARP?

stunet's picture
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stunet Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:28am

I'm with Andy.

Soon as I hear NWO, I'm out. The three letter acronym has been used as a catchy description for various social and political movements for a hundred years. It sounds ominous, means nothing.

And the idjits who use it to describe a coming world Totalitarian government? Deluded as Charles Webster Baer. Goes against the last two decades of historical shifts. An easy 'answer' for people who can't or won't accept complexity in their worldview.

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:49am
stunet wrote:

I'm with Andy.

Soon as I hear NWO, I'm out. The three letter acronym has been used as a catchy description for various social and political movements for a hundred years. It sounds ominous, means nothing.

And the idjits who use it to describe a coming world Totalitarian government? Deluded as Charles Webster Baer. Goes against the last two decades of historical shifts. An easy 'answer' for people who can't or won't accept complexity in their worldview.

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Yeah, nah.

Which historical shifts over the past two decades are you talking about?

I guess you’re not referring to the way Western societies are starting to parrot the illiberal nature of totalitarian China in the manner that everyone falsely assumed that China would liberalise in the manner of the West?

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/oct/11/authoritarian-sty...

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stunet Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 10:52am

Shifts away from nineties and early-millennium thinking of global order, back towards state-based sovereignty.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 11:03am
stunet wrote:

Shifts away from nineties and early-millennium thinking of global order, back towards state-based sovereignty.

I think you’ve fallen for the media’s superficial veneer of sovereignty.

The US has abandoned its borders as has England. The EU is nothing but a direct contradiction of sovereignty. Australian citizenship carries no real currency which isn’t trumped by international trade. We are inveigled in more and more sovereignty eroding transnational pacts every few years. There is zero serious oversight of foreign ownership of any sovereign territory in the West. Transnational corporations control democracies everywhere. Every Western nation has taken a huge step back from liberalism.

Not sure what you’re talking about?

Maybe you mean the Australian flag on Scotty’s face mask?

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stunet Tuesday, 12 Oct 2021 at 11:21am

"Not sure what you’re talking about?"

After this morning's outbursts I'm not surprised.