Vaccinate or not

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak started the topic in Tuesday, 24 Nov 2020 at 6:20pm

I was a little shocked at Alan Joyce (CEO Qantas) announcement that international travelers will be required to have a covid 19 vaccination in order to travel on Qantas flights . The government wanted to have mandatory vaccination but after the bumbling of its release ( it was painful to watch the delivery of that announcement ) they withdrew the mandatory part but it seems Qantas and other business may demand a vaccination in order to use their services. I’m not anti vaccine by any means I just don’t trust this government or a vaccine that has been rushed through. A jab followed by another jab followed by yearly jabs doesn’t sit well with me as I have never had a flu shot or the flu for more than 20 years. Plus I don’t want to give this shot to my healthy 4 year old daughter. She is up to date with all her vaccinations but this covid vaccine is new and not being around for decades like the others. Tuberculosis remains the number one as far diseases go and you don’t need proof of vaccination to travel so what is going on ?

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tubeshooter Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 12:38am

Yep TBB , interesting to note in that last link is the continued extension of construction work days/hours.. The limits on construction noise on Sundays isn't deterring the site up from me tho.
As for the " the person carrying out the work or activity must not play music on any device or equipment or use a radio" on a Sunday gave me me a laugh.

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Supafreak Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 7:45am

This podcast is over 3 hours long and is banned on YouTube, it talks about a variety of issues including censorship, it has the timestamps listed for certain discussion points so you can skip to those. Doesn’t matter if you agree or not it’s a discussion that many ignore.

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Blowin Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 10:49am

Another excellent Taibbi article. I recommend you go and watch “Dallas Buyer’s Club” starring Matthew McGonaughey afterwards to establish a bit of historical perspective on this type of issue.

Ivermectin: Can a Drug Be "Right-Wing"?
A potential Covid-19 treatment has become hostage to a larger global fight between populists and anti-populists
Matt Taibbi
Jun 25

On December 31st of last year, an 80 year-old Buffalo-area woman named Judith Smentkiewicz fell ill with Covid-19. She was rushed by ambulance to Millard Fillmore Suburban Hospital in Williamsville, New York, where she was put on a ventilator. Her son Michael and his wife flew up from Georgia, and were given grim news. Judith, doctors said, had a 20% chance at survival, and even if she made it, she’d be on a ventilator for a month.

As December passed into the New Year, Judith’s health declined. Her family members, increasingly desperate, had been doing what people in the Internet age do, Googling in search of potential treatments. They saw stories about the anti-parasitic drug ivermectin, learning among other things that a pulmonologist named Pierre Kory had just testified before the Senate that the drug had a “miraculous” impact on Covid-19 patients. The family pressured doctors at the hospital to give Judith the drug. The hospital initially complied, administering one dose on January 2nd. According to her family’s court testimony, a dramatic change in her condition ensued.

“In less than 48 hours, my mother was taken off the ventilator, transferred out of the Intensive Care Unit, sitting up on her own and communicating,” the patient’s daughter Michelle Kulbacki told a court.

After the reported change in Judith’s condition, the hospital backtracked and refused to administer more. Frustrated, the family turned on January 7th to a local lawyer named Ralph Lorigo. A commercial litigator and head of what he calls a “typical suburban practice,” with seven lawyers engaged in everything from matrimonial to estate work, Lorigo assigned one of his attorneys to review materials given to them by the family, which included Kory’s Senate testimony. The associate showed Lorigo himself the the material next morning.

“I was so convinced by what Dr. Kory was saying,” Lorigo says. “I saw the passion and the belief.”

Lorigo immediately sued the hospital, filing to State Supreme Court to force the facility to treat according to the family’s wishes. Judge Henry J. Nowak sided with the Smentkiewiczes, signing an order that Lorigo and one of his attorneys served themselves, and after a series of quasi-absurd dramas that included the hospital refusing to let the Smentkiewicz family physician phone in the prescription — “the doctor actually had to drive to the hospital,” Lorigo says — Judith went back on ivermectin.

“She was out of that hospital in six days,” Lorigo says. After a month of rehab, his octogenarian client went back to her life, which involved working five days a week (she still cleans houses). Her story, complete with photo, was told in the Buffalo News, causing Lorigo’s phone to begin ringing off the hook. Doppleganger cases soon began dotting the map all over the country.

One of the first was in nearby Rochester, New York, where the family of Glenna Dickinson went through an almost exactly similar narrative to the Smentkiewiczes: they read about ivermectin, got a family doctor to prescribe it, saw improvement, only to later have the hospital refuse treatment. Again Lorigo intervened, again a judge ordered the hospital to treat, again the patient recovered and was discharged.

Hospitals fought hard, hiring expensive law firms, at times going to extraordinary lengths to refuse treatment even with dying patients who’d exhausted all other options. At Edward-Elmhurst hospital in Chicago, a 68 year-old named Nurije Fype was admitted, put on a ventilator, and again, as all other treatments failed, her family got a judge to order the use of ivermectin. Lorigo claims the hospital initially refused to obey the court order, which led to the filing of a contempt motion, which in turn led to a pair of counter-motions and another confrontation before another befuddled Judge named James Orel.

“Why wouldn't this be tried if she's not improving?” the Chicago Tribune quoted Orel as saying. “Why does the hospital object to providing this medication?”

“He basically said, ‘What do you have left?’” Lorigo recounts. “No one would administer the ivermectin. It’s as safe as aspirin, for Christ’s sake. It’s been given out 3.7 billion times. I couldn’t understand it.”

Stories like these aren’t proof the drug works. They don’t even really rise to the level of evidence. People recover from diseases all the time, and it doesn’t mean any particular treatment was responsible. Short of the gold standard of randomized controlled trials, there’s no proof.

However, anecdotes have a power all their own, and in the Internet age, ones like these spread quickly. Lorigo estimates he now gets “10, 15, 20” calls and emails a day. At this level, at the bedside of a single Covid-19 patient who’s already received the full official treatment protocol and is failing anyway, the decision to administer a drug like ivermectin, or fluvoxamine, or hydroxychloroquine, or any of a dozen other experimental treatments, seems like a no-brainer. Nothing else has worked, the patient is dying, why not?

Telescope out a little further, however, and the ivermectin debate becomes more complicated, reaching into a series of thorny controversies, some ridiculous, some quite serious.

The ridiculous side involves the front end of Lorigo’s story, the same story detailed on this site last week: the censorship of ivermectin news that, no matter what one thinks about the evidence for or against, is clearly in the public interest.

Anyone running a basic internet search on the topic will get a jumble of confusing results. YouTube’s policies are beyond uneven. It’s been aggressive in taking down videos containing interviews with people like Kory and doling out strikes to independent media figures like Bret Weinstein, but an interview with Lorigo on TrialSite News containing basically all of the same information is still up, as are clips from a just-taped episode of the Joe Rogan Experience that feature both Weinstein and Kory. Moreover, all sorts of statements at least as provocative as Kory’s “miraculous” formulation in the Senate still litter the Internet, many in reputable research journals. Take, for instance, this passage from the March issue of the Japanese Journal of Antibiotics:

When the effectiveness of ivermectin for the COVID-19 pandemic is confirmed with the cooperation of researchers around the world and its clinical use is achieved on a global scale, it could prove to be of great benefit to humanity. It may even turn out to be comparable to the benefits achieved from the discovery of penicillin…

There clearly is not evidence that ivermectin is the next penicillin, at least as far as its effects on Covid-19. As is noted in nearly every mainstream story about the subject, the WHO has advised against its use pending further study, there have been randomized studies showing it to be ineffective in speeding recovery, and the drug’s original manufacturer, Merck, has said there’s no “meaningful evidence” of efficacy for Covid-19 patients. However, it’s also patently untrue, as is frequently asserted, that there’s no evidence that the drug might be effective.

This past week, for instance, Oxford University announced it was launching a large-scale clinical trial. The study has already recruited more than 5,000 volunteers, and its announcement says what little is known to be true: that “small pilot studies show that early administration with ivermectin can reduce viral load and the duration of symptoms in some patients with mild COVID-19,” that it’s “a well-known medicine with a good safety profile,” and “because of the early promising results in some studies, it is already being widely used to treat COVID-19 in several countries.”

The Oxford text also says “there is little evidence from large-scale randomized controlled trials to demonstrate that it can speed up recovery from the illness or reduce hospital admission.” But to a person who might have a family member suffering from the disease, just the information about “early promising results” would probably be enough to inspire demands for a prescription, which might be the problem, of course. Unless someone was looking for that information, they likely wouldn’t find it, as mainstream news even of the Oxford study has been effectively limited to a pair of Bloomberg and Forbes stories.

Ivermectin has suffered the same fate as thousands of other news topics since Donald Trump first announced his run for the presidency nearly six years ago, cleaved in two to inhabit separate factual universes for left and right audiences. Repurposed drugs generally have had a hard time being taken seriously since Trump announced he was on hydroxychloroquine last year, and ivermectin clearly also suffers from its association with Republican Senators like Ron Johnson. Still, the drug’s publicity issues go beyond the taint of “conservative” news.

The drug has become a test case for a controversy that’s long been building in health care, about how much input patients should have in their own treatment. Well before Covid-19, the medical profession was thrust into a revolution in patient information, inspired by a combination of Google and new patients’ rights laws.

Should people on their deathbeds be allowed to try anything to save themselves? That seems like an easy question to answer. Should the entire world be allowed to practice self-care on a grand scale? That’s a different issue. Some would say absolutely not, while others would say the corruption of pharmaceutical companies and the medical system unfortunately make it a necessity. The world is increasingly divided along this trust/untrust axis.“

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sypkan Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 11:51am

"Ivermectin: Can a Drug Be "Right-Wing"?
A potential Covid-19 treatment has become hostage to a larger global fight between populists and anti-populists
Matt Taibbi"

an absolutely ridiculous conversation it seems the world needs to have...

a situation that absolutely beggars belief

and the answer to that question from certain parts of 'the left'? more and more censorship...

who would've thought? ...well just about everyone given the recent record...

the world has gone crazy!

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troppo dichotomy Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 12:34pm

Scary when the parliament and da P.M. are nothing but sales reps for pharmies n phossil phuels!

Sypkan the Wade article was excellent.
TBB,Supa,Blowin n everyone else i'd like to thank for all the various opinions n information.

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Supafreak Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 8:41pm

Hunt has ordered a review.

Thought this was previously denied

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Supafreak Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 9:22pm

CSIRO lab rat 2-B52-FCD5-ADDD-4-EA9-9-F6-D-608575779834

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truebluebasher Saturday, 26 Jun 2021 at 11:10pm

troppo dichotomy & crew just won a Vaccinate or Not live breakthru

Supafreak needs to see Batman...(Head of CSIRO Virology for decades)
Runs the World in his spare time + Best Karaoke singer > Bat Lady / Daszak / WHO / CDC worship him!
Play yer a Pod soon enough where he all but gives the game away...more damning than any.

91% > 97% Vaccinated Cities are spreading well over 60% Delta cases
>65% Lowest Vaxed Largest Cities ( London / Birmingham ) are least affected with 10-20% Delta cases.
Maps show this Vaccinated Delta invasion of low vax strongholds. (re: Chiltern / Birmingham will soon fall)
Low vaxed London to Brighton will be last to surrender to High Vax Strain takeover...see for yourselves...

Update: Variant slays the Vaccine...(Game Over the World Over)
tbb has long foretold of Vaxerz overtaking the unvaxed in Hospitalisations & Deaths...(Now Worldwide!)
Govt rewards #1 VIP Vaxed Superspreaderz to spread Delta faster than's how...

14th -21st June UK Delta Stats (Hospital Cases) From 806 > (Current) 1,320 (Delta now 96% of cases)
tbb will purposely FF UK's most progressive vaxed 50+ to best demonstrate the breakthru...(re: return below)
Over 50's > (418 ) Hospitalisations
Unvaxed = 136 (33%) (vs) Vaxed = 252 (67%)

Unvaxed = 136 (Current UK Health Death Rate = 6.45% )
One Dose / Fully Vaxed = 252 (breakdown)
>21 days = 9 (See next)
21 days + =79 (Current UK Health Delta death rate = 7.41%)
Fully Vaxed = 163 (Current UK Health Delta death rate = 30.95% )

Recap : Most vaccinated Seniors in Most vaccinated Cities occupy the most UK Delta death beds.
As tbb keeps saying...this is not anti vax & not an anomaly but simple's not even tricky...

Ok! We can run the check list to rule out why this is happening...

* Seniors / Frontline take most drugs + Lowest Sleep- Sunlight - vD - Melatonin = Low immunity & efficacy.
Elderly Lymphoma increases in elderly 8-10% / year & fail to mention that mirrors increased inoculations.
Just saying that Covid Vaxes swell up Lymph nodes being slower to recover in frail would impair immunity.
This increased Lymphoma could also play as a main driver to seeking "Kinder" Covid treatment for elderly!

* Recall EU claiming AZ was a waste of time on Seniors...Delta walks straight thru them.

* Phase 1 were Vaxed from Dec.2020 ...(Now 6 months....already poorest efficacy is fading faster than trials!)

How to fix this Fuck up?
Oxford /AZ have already wiped the Phase 1 Daily Vax / case Spike to fix similar Dec/Jan problem
UK now split Vax Stats into Premier League > Evil No vax / Post 21d Vaxed / Pre 21d (vs) Nice Fully Vaxed.
By outcasting First Dose > Pre / Post to (Non Vaxed) excuses an extra 2 months leeway for Vax stats.
US just simply Mandated to censor any counts of Break Thru Vax stats...sorted.
"Covid" Deaths can also have a cut off time (28 days) Simply = Still no Vax covid Deaths!
UK have World's most convoluted death counts & can & do add/remove 1,000's at a time...(Do anything!)

Phase 1 will always need (Low Cost) 2x / year Boosters...
re Crew: Ivermectin Trial is via "Home Treatment" + "Home Testing log book" > Frontline Jobs is coming soon!
Advise all to note that main criteria of Trial is to stay at home! ("Drug" is secondary to cutting Health costs!)
supafreak & even blowin are onto it...the need for instant anti inflammatory curbs Vent' / Hospital costs.
The idea being to have Big Pharma mark up Chemist DIY packs in readiness for never ending waves...
Ivermectin was never gonna work for those losers but it should work a treat for rebound big Pharma.

Vax is too overbearing on the Health System & a variant Vax breakthru Tsunami is rising up...
The future is a DIY honesty the Flu...(Can't come in today, got The Flu / Covid / Plague...sign here!)
Oxford / AZ appear to be covering their tracks to mop up the DIY Covid home brewery kits!
Also that Batman has some shit hot immunity test Kits & 1 shot anti freeze mRNA Vax ...(Another Day!)

21st June UK Weekly Hospital all stats (Continues from above) ...(514) 304 no vax (vs) 210 vax
Just sharing this fast ramping vax stat as it too, will soon Vaxerz hogging most Hospital beds.
Just saying the guilt trip factor to vax falls away as vaxerz "Present" more sick in larger numbers each day.
Govt do not want Media reporting such home truths...that's why media run with..."Disgusting Non Vaxerz"
Crew can see it's only a very short time (Already!)... before VIP Vaxerz are #1 Spreaderz...(Game over!)

Just in case ya missed that & still think tbb is getting ahead of himself...
Recall recent Singapore breakthru cases...overpowering & infecting non vaxerz...

26th June 2021 Israel { Today's Newspaper Headline }
"50% Infected Adults in Covid-19 Delta Outbreak are Fully Vaxed"

Israel shows tonnes of this stuff ...can count it by the week / month 30% > 40% > now 50%

OMG! Pretty soon one of them there experts is gonna trip over the breakthru code...
Anyhow! Get used to the fact that Vaxerz start spreading the most Covid from 60% Rollout onward...
Please do not tell Breaky TV that their VIP vax bumper stickerz come unstuck...can go to jail for that!

If some loser wants to reward the biggest VIP super spreaderz with a badge...well..Hey!
Be a pretty fucked up mental World if our leader was deprived of that honour! **daggydadpollskyrockets* **

PS: Get well soon NSW!

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indo-dreaming Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 8:43am

I didn't know this until yesterday but one of our Indonesian friends brothers in Java died last year of covid, he was only 47.

Another friend of my wife's in Indonesia whole family also all have Covid, there has been quite a few people now that we know in Indonesia in Java that have had Covid (maybe 20+), even her brothers GF hard it, but somehow he got away with not getting it as she was in another city.

Apparently in my wife families neighbourhood currently there is now six people with Covid and people in the area have died of covid, luckily her parents have had their first jab and about to get their second.

BTW. When im talking neighbourhood so you can picture things although her family is not poor, the neighbourhood she lives in is like you see on documentaries of India or Jakarta etc down a maze of alley ways/gangs one room houses wall to wall no grass barely a plant, her family has a well and toilet, but many places dont, you walk by houses and look inside and its just a dark concrete box.

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etarip Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 9:41am

Wife and I have both had first Pfizer jab done. No noticeable side effects for either of us.

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Supafreak Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 11:16am

@indo not sure if you read a link I posted from trial site news a few posts back ? Here is another link from BIRD And here’s the source for trial site news

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indo-dreaming Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 3:10pm
Supafreak wrote:

@indo not sure if you read a link I posted from trial site news a few posts back ? Here is another link from BIRD And here’s the source for trial site news

Cheers yeah interesting.

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indo-dreaming Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 3:13pm

God i hope Australia follows Singapores future plan, this makes sense, get the majority vaccinated or a chance to then open borders.

"Singapore’s surprising new plan to ‘live with covid’ revealed

No quarantine, no icky tests and no daily numbers – one nation that Australians know well is taking a controversial course out of the pandemic."

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Supafreak Sunday, 27 Jun 2021 at 6:52pm

Great article simba , I recall reading early in the pandemic a scientist from csiro dismissing the lab leak theory and saying a natural origin was far more likely. With the latest revelations about the involvement of csiro and university of Queensland with the Wuhan lab a whole new can of worms is opening up or is it just a storm in a tea cup ?

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gsco Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 1:02pm

Australia is now the covid laughing stock of the world.

We should be leading the world with vaccination rates and vaccinated people should be living completely free now:

Anyone choosing not to get vaccinated but instead spending their time caught up in the artificial online world of covid and vaccination commercialisation, politicisation and conspiracy theories are now equally also the problem as our politicians.

It is mindless idiocy for our politicians to be addicted to lockdowns and state border closures but blind and ignorant to providing incentives and pushing hard for increasing vaccination rates.

It is equally mindless idiocy for people who are eligible to be vaccinated to be turning their nose up at doing so.

Australia - both politicians and the public - need to wake up.

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Sprout Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 2:04pm

Wait, so vaccines... work!? *audible gasp!*
A Sydney house party that acted as a superspreader event for the coronavirus has also become a case study in the effectiveness of vaccines.

While the majority of the people who attended the West Hoxton party were infected with the virus, those who emerged unscathed had been vaccinated, the NSW Health Minister said.

“I can report that of the more than 30 people that were at that party, 24 of those people are now positive for Covid-19,” Brad Hazzard told reporters on Monday.

“And not one of those 24 people were vaccinated. I could also advise that six health workers who attended at that party, who were fully vaccinated, not one of those people has been infected with (the coronavirus).

“I can also report that there was one aged care worker at the party, who’d had the first dose, and that aged care worker was also not infected at the party.”

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Blowin Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 2:17pm

How many of the 24 who tested positive felt any symptoms and how many has any illness of any significance?

Catch Covid and display no symptoms, like 80 percent of people and you have greater future Covid immunity than any vaccine.

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Supafreak Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 2:57pm


Sprout's picture
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Sprout Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 3:09pm

Fair point.
I hate people with the best of 'em, but I'd still feel like a cunt for inadvertently knocking off my mates, mates, mates Grandparents because I caught it, was asymptomatic and passed it down the line when I could have just got a simple and effective vaccine instead.

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Craig Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 3:41pm

That little sample case from the party is great eh Sprout. Telling.

Sounds like also those who were vaccinated didn't carry it either, ie to be passed on.

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shoredump Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 3:59pm

Excellent news Sprout

I know which team I’m on

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Blowin Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 4:38pm

120 people have caught it in Sydney. How many have symptoms? How many hospitalisations? How many deaths?

But… numbers!

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indo-dreaming Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 4:42pm
Blowin wrote:

How many of the 24 who tested positive felt any symptoms and how many has any illness of any significance?

Catch Covid and display no symptoms, like 80 percent of people and you have greater future Covid immunity than any vaccine.

This might end up being true, but it seems like its is not known yet, plus you could also be in the small percentage that do get very sick, or you could also end up with long term covid.

Makes more sense to just get vaccinated and not flip the coin.

From pretty recent article.

"Experts told USA TODAY both infection and vaccination are protective against the coronavirus. Scientists don't yet know whether natural immunity or vaccine immunity lasts longer, given the limited time COVID-19 has existed. But research suggests vaccination provides more consistent protection against the virus."

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garyg1412 Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 4:49pm

A mate of mine who is a nurse doing Covid vaccinations says he's really struggling trying to separate the microchips so only one goes up the needle for each jab.

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Blowin Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 4:58pm

People impressed because a tiny sample of vaccinated people didn’t pass on the virus to others. Tells you enough about how high the bar of expectations has been set for the vaccine.

Did any of the 24 non vaccinated people pass it onto others?

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shortenism Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 5:14pm

What a load of horse shit Sprout. What about the positive influence you have on the ppl around you, surely you can see that? Why suggest your a cnt for passing on a cold. FFS. Drawing lines like that is worse than Paleo Pete’s fade to bottom turn up at the point... But I have a sneaky suspicion between you, Craig and shoredump he’d still have u all combo’d in the first half of any heat.. Conspiracy? wake up fellas.. super strains, delta strains, South American strains, COVID sniffing K9’s at airports... Dan Andrew’s media piece on his return with the wife’s new haircut and kids in the periphery, just off screen making it sound like a fkn miracle that we still have the honour of his presence.. lockdowns in SA now without even a case...Wow, I am godsmacked that ANYONE can take this horse shit seriously, especially a bunch of albeit anonymous fearless hellmen surfers like yourselves. Wake up Australia.

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shoredump Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 5:22pm

Fair point about that 80%, what about the one thousand six hundred million other human beings you dismissed?

There’s been several mutations, for the worse, in the first 18 months. To me there’s a pattern forming, can you see it?

Suppress or not to suppress, that is the question

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old-dog Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 6:03pm

There is no lockdown in SA, just a bit of preventative mask wearing and patrons reduced a bit at pubs and social gatherings limited to 150. I have only had 3 days locked down since it all began. If this thing really gets out of hand some of you cowboys might have to eat humble pie and fight your way to the vaccination place. A guy I know has family in India, so far he has lost both grandparents, his 50 year old dad and 28 year old cousin. If the numbers get high enough even a few young crew bite the dust. Just saying.

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Supafreak Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 6:12pm

Might be a good mask for the snapper crowd. 5-EA2763-F-AA93-4274-9-DD7-D8055089749-A

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indo-dreaming Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 6:34pm

@ Supafreak "Why did YouTube censor discussion of Ivermectin? | Bret Weinstein and Lex Fridman"

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sypkan Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 7:11pm

"120 people have caught it in Sydney. How many have symptoms? How many hospitalisations? How many deaths?

But… numbers!"

citing rita panahi probably won't win me any friends... but here you go blowin...

you look at those numbers, ...hospitalisations and the number of crew in lockdown... and it does seem we've lost our minds

but as the comments point out, hospitalisation numbers aren't really relevant if we are going for elimination strategy, the question is... is elimination strategy realistic when...

a) the rest of the world is moving on...

b) vaccinations seem incredibly limited in terms of efficacy, and the freedoms they will allow re. travel and quarratine

c) it's clear new strains will keep evolving

d) it's clear people will continue to return to oz in some form or another

e) purpose built quarrantine is a good 12 months away

f) b to e of the above, all mean australia is commiting to years of lockdowns, restricted travel, and quarrantine for all travellers to come... years at a minimum...

is this realistic?

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sypkan Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 7:05pm

and a different perspective on australia has lost it's mind...

dare I say a fair and balanced article from the murdoch press with some good points

"...Look around the world. In many countries, a level of normalcy is returning. Americans, you know those people that live in the most Covid ravaged nation on earth? They’re now sunning themselves on Greek beaches.

Meanwhile, Sydneysiders are banned from sunning themselves on Gold Coast beaches..."

"...Hotel quarantine first. Undoubtedly, that’s where most of the virus outbreaks have come from.

Depending on who you speak to, hotel quarantine is either actually pretty good at keeping Covid at bay, considering the number of people who’ve flown in, or it’s a leaky shambles.

A recent paper from Melbourne University and New Zealand’s Otago University found there were 4.9 failures per 1000 positive cases in quarantine, reported The Conversation..."

those numbers are pretty shit for a quarrantine situation from my perspective

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truebluebasher Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 7:05pm

Our town is substantial & has a few Doctors but only one is part / Vaccinating.
They don't have any Pfizer so AZ Grey Army bookings are naturally falling this...
Week 1 - 95% booked
Week 2 - 67.5% booked
Week 3 - 40% booked
Week 4 - 10% booked
(Aug) 60% VIP's booked their spoonful of Pfizer but then supply drops off again in Sept...

Scomo : "We've rationed a low cost 1st dose Vax paper cut with yer 2021 Vax'n'Crash Census Pack!"
Dutto : "2nd dose > You just lick the Vax gum as you transfer yer DNA onto the Census reply Envelope."
100% DIY ( Zero Cost ) Rollout Sorted!

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shortenism Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 7:06pm

Delta waves are associated with deep sleep.

Delta strain is associated with deep sleep.

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thermalben Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 7:47pm
shortenism wrote:

Delta waves are associated with deep sleep. Delta strain is associated with deep sleep.

Is that all ya got?

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Supafreak Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 8:06pm

@indo , that was a interesting podcast , I only started watching Brett Weinstein a few weeks ago after coming across his dark horse podcast before and dismissing him with out really having a closer look at his background or trying to find anything to back up what he was saying. I agree with the other guy about how some scientists come across and that they’re not very good sometimes in how they present themselves or what they’re trying to say . The FLCCC live feeds can be terrible in as far as professional presentation ,but I’ve watched because their field is medicine not Hollywood . I read somewhere that Facebook would be dead within 5 years and thought no way too many people love it , but if a alternative came along for both Facebook and you tube like they were talking about , well it’s entirely possible . What gets me about the you tube censorship of ivermectin is there is so much crap about other non covid related subjects that is totally left alone. Here’s a article that may interest you

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Supafreak Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 9:22pm

Anyone got shares in moderna ? Gone from $23 to $219 , not bad considering pig pharma wasn’t making much of a profit , someone said they were virtually giving it away lol

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shortenism Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 9:54pm

Yep supa, the mounds of comments on here showcasing the blind backing and defence of the parties and strategies underpinning the biggest conspiracy going around.. Its fascinating to observe.

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Supafreak Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 10:23pm
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shortenism Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 10:34pm

Not sure of your interpretation Thermal but always an honour to have the big dog online! My point was that 'Delta strain' is related to those in a deep slumber. I.e. Those blindly taking in this garbage.

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AndyM Monday, 28 Jun 2021 at 11:33pm


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JackStance Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 5:28am

I don't know if it will help in any way, and I appreciate the very wide spectrum of opinions out there. However, attached to the ABS link is the latest 'cause of death' data spreadsheet from the Australian Bureau of Statistics.

I accessed it this morning.

here is the link:

- the graph on the ABS page is not clear to read, but the downloadable spreadsheet at the bottom of the webpage is irresistibly clear.

It shows covid has caused 1 death in Australia since the 1st of November 2020.

According to Doctors for Covid Ethics, it was an 80 year old man in QLD. - any death is tragic. However, the propaganda shitstorm, according to the government data, would indicate that the fear mongering is unwarranted. In the same period, more than 11,000 deaths from cancer. more than 3000 of deaths from heart attack, and more than 2000 deaths from stroke. Versus 1 death from covid. - according to the ABS.

And how many from suicide?

I have no idea what is going on, however, the face value of what is going on, in my mere opinion, is that at minimum there are misrepresentations going on.

Where is the public discourse on vaccine risks? Can we, as a society, not just have transparent discourse? Of course not. Assange is in prison for acting in such a manner, AND, Australians have been propagandized for years to not be able to have conversations around family dinner tables about vaccines: see Professor Brian Martin's 2018 book: Vaccination Panic In Australia.

How can we, in Australia, have a rational public conversation about vaccines when we are downstream from a psychological propaganda shitstorm.

The same holds true for foreign policy.

Clearly we have a problem with the information environment we're living in.

Transparency for the powerful, and privacy for everyday folk is probably the panacea, hence the Assange case is the most important case of our generations.

A short story: a fella whose son goes to school with my son, and who worked for the Obama, Trump and now Biden administrations, and has staff in Washington and is legit.. told me, fasley, that the 2008 Nobel Prize winner, French virologist Luc Antoine Montagnier said that everyone who has the vaccine will die within 2 years.

So I raced home and search it, and all I find is fact checking debunking on the veracity of the claim, and trashing Montagnier's standing.

What I also found was pretty much every video on this fella is banned from youtube, and he's Nobel prize laureate.

I went through and found that Prof Luc Montagnier is who he claims to be, and that his nobel prize is on topic. Here is the source:

This description of his work and its consequences, in my mind, deeply positions Montagnier with authoritative standing on the relevant issues.

However, due to my bias, I could be wrong, therefore I really want to know what you think of my assessment of Montagnier's standing based on this:

Here is the video of Montagnier debunking the false claim (everyone dead in 2 years) attributed to him:

The transcript of this short video also contains very upsetting claims that appear to be rooted in science.

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Supafreak Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 8:07am

No jab no job for aged care and quarantine workers, not even willing to consider giving them the choice of ivermectin, what happens to immune compromised ? Dole cue or compensated ? The aged care is the most vulnerable and have been treated appallingly so far but will this decision make things worse if people leave this sector ?

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indo-dreaming Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 8:15am

Yeah saw that on TV news this morning about Covid vaccination being mandatory now for aged care workers(which my wife is and has no issue in getting the vaccine) but again she told me about how her two bosses in the office both registered nurses, are opposed to Covid vaccination and even think Covid is fake or some BS. (even opposed to flue jab)

Obviously not all staff in aged care are going to be like that, but it still goes to show that there are these people in aged care even at management level. (and other than that, its quite a good work place)

I think its a great idea covid vax in aged care staff is mandatory makes 100% sense, but you do have to wonder how many workers they will lose from doing this and its such a hard area to get workers for as it is, low paid and not easy work.(literally wiping old peoples arse's etc)

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shortenism Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 8:21am

They stated yesterday that only 16% of aged care workers had had a the jab. Just force through the remaining 84% they reckon... They've all had the opportunity and clearly didn't want it. A very stressful time for employees of that sector.

Let this be a clear message to all of you on here that reckon this whole vaccine agenda is a great idea. When you go down this path of forced anything your day will inevitably come where you're on the wrong side of whatever is being forced upon you. It starts with a little lockdown to flatten the curve and the next thing ppl are being forced to make big decisions about their careers, livelihoods, passion.

Of all the crew on here that have been calling out the conspiracy idiots on this topic surely you can see the tip toe totalitarian state creeping up on you now. Who and what is next? A dangerous precedent.

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gsco Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 8:44am

AZ vaccine now available to everyone:

There is now no excuse to not get vaccinated.

There is now no need for Australia to keep going into lockdowns or to shut itself off from the world.

Any unvaccinated person suffering from financial or mental health hardship from lockdowns now only have themselves to blame.

Equally to blame are people pushing conspiracy ideas like there is no virus threat or need to get vaccinated, and hence encouraging people to not get vaccinated.

Australia should now be rolling out initiatives like free movement, free and unrestricted domestic and international travel, exemption from lockdown, etc, for vaccinated people.

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donweather Tuesday, 29 Jun 2021 at 9:47am
gsco wrote:

AZ vaccine now available to everyone:

There's a reason the Gov has now opened AZ up to everyone. It's because we manufacture it here in Australia. How can they say one week it's for only over 60's and then the next week it's safe for everyone down to children. It's laughable at best.