Australia - you're standing in it
"This article tackles some issues but it is written in such hostile language that it's unreadable"
Considering that it's written with empathy for the average working person, I'd say it's got a right to be hostile.
I mean, "this toxic situation is pure economic gaslighting: a Fake Left government in bed with Fake Right business given zero accountability by a real estate-addicted media, and a central bank too scared to say anything" sums it up pretty well.
Which reinforces my statement that this is a populist article. The author is catering to specific demographics and is already set in his views. Then he puts a few shallow things together to form an article. It's not an analytical piece that drills down into the details and shares findings. The author's phrase of 'flow of warm bodies' is obvious evidence of that. Cheap, entertaining language (for some people) that is on par with burleigh's stuff in that other thread. We got a name for these 'warm bodies', humans or people is perfectly adequate.
velocityjohnno wrote:Ah.
Flollo's comment has got me thinking: if Australia is one of the hardest places in the world to get in to, how come we have one of the highest levels of population growth - for developed countries? It ain't local births > deaths.
Hardest doesn't mean impossible. There are many reasons but essentially, we have a good reputation and people want to live here. + We are a developed, multicultural country in Asia where most of the human population lives. Anyway, I asked chatGTP about the reasons for moving to Australia, we can start there:
There are many reasons why people want to move to Australia. Here are a few:
Quality of life: Australia consistently ranks highly in global rankings of quality of life, with high levels of safety, health care, education, and social services. The country is also known for its clean and beautiful environment.
Job opportunities: Australia has a strong and diverse economy, with many opportunities in industries such as mining, agriculture, tourism, and education. The country also has a relatively low unemployment rate.
Education: Australia is home to several highly ranked universities and has a reputation for providing a high-quality education.
Multiculturalism: Australia is a diverse and multicultural country that welcomes people from all backgrounds. This makes it a popular destination for people looking to experience different cultures.
Climate: Australia has a warm and sunny climate in many parts of the country, which is a big draw for people from colder or more temperate climates.
Adventure and outdoor activities: Australia is known for its beautiful beaches, stunning natural landscapes, and wide range of outdoor activities such as hiking, surfing, and scuba diving. This makes it an attractive destination for adventure seekers.
Overall, people are attracted to Australia for its high standard of living, diverse opportunities, welcoming culture, and beautiful environment.
Populism is not necessarily a bad thing, it's just framing the interests of the people against the elites.
Yeah it's a polemic but it's expressing a defensible view.
And I suspect the term 'warm bodies' is taking the piss out of big business and the whole mass immigration thing.
They don't care who comes in, as long as they can exploit them, keep wages and prop up so many other things.
This one's for Andy M
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-23/uni-students-lining-up-for-free-f...
Check the article: an actual student protest outside the RBA on 'economic' grounds. This one isn't one of the identity protests, this one is a geniune economic one. Never thought I'd see it. We've talked here before on the theme of being divided so much that no one protests the economic situation, well, here's change. I've also seen articles that foreign students are also having enormous difficulty finding accommodation too, so it's not just the local kids. What a shitstorm.
Blown away. This is the line for free food at UNSW — students and those on low incomes struggling with basics pic.twitter.com/sz3MSp93bV
— David Taylor (@DaveTaylorNews) February 22, 2023
velocityjohnno wrote:https://twitter.com/DaveTaylorNews/status/1628229747133276160
There’s an easy fix for this one. Uni ran, not for profit canteens with cooked meals and an allowance on student cards that they can use to eat there. They can even means test it if they want and those with maximum allowance would basically eat for free. It doesn’t fix all the life’s issues but it fixes the basics. We are a rich country that can easily afford this system. There are way poorer countries than us with this system in place.
We’ve got no hope if this is a year 7 question and they’re debating it on the radio show. It should be year 4/5 max and no debate required.
https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/politics/nsw-state-election-yea...
Agree on the canteens. There were comments that those waiting had really nice clothes, handbags, phones...
Anyway, here's the 8th Grade leaving test from Kansas in 1895:
https://newrepublic.com/article/79470/1895-8th-grade-final-exam-i-couldn...
We're getting smarter as time goes on, right?
velocityjohnno wrote:This one's for Andy M
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-02-23/uni-students-lining-up-for-free-f...
Check the article: an actual student protest outside the RBA on 'economic' grounds. This one isn't one of the identity protests, this one is a geniune economic one. Never thought I'd see it. We've talked here before on the theme of being divided so much that no one protests the economic situation, well, here's change. I've also seen articles that foreign students are also having enormous difficulty finding accommodation too, so it's not just the local kids. What a shitstorm.
Interesting VJ, despite the fact that the proverbial Titanic's been listing further and further for decades now, people, especially the young, have been infatuated with post-materialism.
Now, finally, the penny seems to have dropped that anyone earning less than the median income and a very large chunk of people earning more than that are facing serious material issues.
Of course, being a student in Sydney would be a long, long way below the poverty line if you were out on your own.
I do think the horse has bolted and from a legislative point of view the most we can expect is gentle tinkering around the margins while business as usual (fossil fuel exploitation, mass immigration, housing as an investment and an asset class) continues unabated.
As for "you've got our wealth and we're going to take it back", unfortunately I think he's kidding himself.
Politics in Australia needs the biggest shakeup it's ever seen for things to change.
On with the kleptocracy.
Can’t remember where the last posts were regarding Friendly Jordies so I’ll mention it here. Finally watched “Bruz” even though I’ve watched many post Bruz clips? and enjoy them very much.
It’s been censored in a couple of bits since Bruz’s defamation case but it’s no less effective, and wow, Bruz seems pretty dodgy. Hilarious, the last scenes exposing the filming location. For anyone that hasn’t seen it and might want to
seeds wrote:Can’t remember where the last posts were regarding Friendly Jordies so I’ll mention it here. Finally watched “Bruz” even though I’ve watched many post Bruz clips? and enjoy them very much.
It’s been censored in a couple of bits since Bruz’s defamation case but it’s no less effective, and wow, Bruz seems pretty dodgy. Hilarious, the last scenes exposing the filming location. For anyone that hasn’t seen it and might want to
https://youtu.be/ihoirTYqf2c
Classic ey. If ya haven't already watched Scovid and Fatty McFuckhead they are worth a viewing also.
Brutal take downs.....
https://m.
&t=1227shttps://m.
andy-mac wrote:Mmmmmm
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/24/an-economic-fairytale-a...
There's some simple graphs that seem to debunk the Australia Institute's war on company profits. I think the institute is losing credibility by continuing to wage its war on company profits and the RBA.
First, inflation is still going up-up-up while corporate profits are going down-down-down:
Second, and what do you know, corporate profits started going down-down-down when the RBA started increasing the cash rate:
Finally, and surprise surprise, what hasn't changed yet upon increasing the cash rate is consumer spending, which is tracking the 2022 inflation episode very closely:
So what can sensibly be argued here is interest rate increases are having strong impact on company profits, but they are yet to put much of a dent in consumer spending, which is a major driver of inflation, and hence is a major reason why the RBA has been and is still increasing interest rates...
People just need to reduce spending and accepting such high prices. We - every one of us individually - are in fact the main driver now of the ongoing inflation event since we just refuse to reduce our spending.
gsco wrote:andy-mac wrote:Mmmmmm
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/24/an-economic-fairytale-a...There's some simple graphs that seem to debunk the Australia Institute's war on company profits. I think the institute is losing credibility by continuing to wage its war on company profits and the RBA.
First, inflation is still going up-up-up while corporate profits are going down-down-down:
Second, and what do you know, corporate profits started going down-down-down when the RBA started increasing the cash rate:
Finally, and surprise surprise, what hasn't changed yet upon increasing the cash rate is consumer spending, which is tracking the 2022 inflation episode very closely:
So what can sensibly be argued here is interest rate increases are having strong impact on company profits, but they are yet to put much of a dent in consumer spending, which is a major driver of inflation, and hence is a major reason why the RBA has been and is still increasing interest rates...
People just need to reduce spending and accepting such high prices. We - every one of us individually - are in fact the main driver now of the ongoing inflation event since we just refuse to reduce our spending.
This may be the case, and I am fortunate that my family is in a position where I can handle the price increases etc.
However, I am seeing the direct effect this is having on some families that cannot reduce their spending as they are already at the limit with rent, mortgage, power and food bills etc. It is going to be devastating for some households when they are forced to sell their house at a loss and still be in debt, or for family's that have lived in an area their whole live forced to move due to rent rises. Problem for businesses also, Sunny Coast is having major issues I am told finding staff in hospitality sector, what they pay cannot support people to live in the area.
Temporary hike in tax GST on non essential items to deter spending? Could raise revenue also???
I don't know solution, but interesting times.
Yeah I’m fucked by interest rates and cost of living pressures, not my virtually non-existent discretionary spending. We’ve tightened the belt now even on things I’d previously considered non-negotiable (e.g shitty supermarket bread instead of quality fresh bread).
Not much I can do about ‘not accepting’ the price of basic living costs - we already only run one car and aren’t currently able to avoid/reduce bills via rooftop solar which I see as most folks only way of dealing with cost of living pressures.
Fuck, I’m even selling bits of my record collection to get by. And I’m in the 84th percentile for earnings with a fairly modest mortgage.
Something’s got to give. Even if corporate profits have taken a dip they’re still completely absurd.
Earnings by ABS. The full-time average weekly is ~$1,800 x 52 = $93,600/12 = $7,800 per month. Now, before people jump there is also a table with the industry breakdown showing big deltas. Mining is more than double of accommodation & food services. So, it's very subjective and contextual. People working in accommodation & food services are pretty much screwed.
This salary could possibly maintain a $3,000ish mortgage (and even that's maybe, taxes need to be deducted from $7,800). A couple could probably go a bit more. $3,000 converts to ~$600k balance. How many people have mortgages above $600k? Those are the ones that are most at risk.
Casuals have no chance.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/labour/earnings-and-working-conditions...
"Sunny Coast is having major issues I am told finding staff in hospitality sector, what they pay cannot support people to live in the area."
The first thing the Sunny Coast needs to do is take a leaf out of Byron's book - attract heaps of foreign workers, cram them into defacto hostels (i.e. share houses) and then exploit the fuck out of them.
flollo wrote:Earnings by ABS. The full-time average weekly is ~$1,800 x 52 = $93,600/12 = $7,800 per month. Now, before people jump there is also a table with the industry breakdown showing big deltas. Mining is more than double of accommodation & food services. So, it's very subjective and contextual. People working in accommodation & food services are pretty much screwed.
This salary could possibly maintain a $3,000ish mortgage (and even that's maybe, taxes need to be deducted from $7,800). A couple could probably go a bit more. $3,000 converts to ~$600k balance. How many people have mortgages above $600k? Those are the ones that are most at risk.
Casuals have no chance.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/labour/earnings-and-working-conditions...
I think you can pretty much throw that average wage figure out the window - the median income is ONE THIRD less than the average at around $1250 per week. Fuck me that's a big difference.
Now we can do some sums and talk about a working poor, or the permanent renting class, or modern serfdom etc etc.
$1250 is all earnings including casual. The above average is excluding casuals. Median full-time is $1,600 for men and $1,442 for women.
Source: https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/labour/earnings-and-working-conditions...
I've seen the corp profits fall in this reporting season on quite a few companies - some from abnormally good earnings last couple of years to be fair. So that is happening.
And thanks for teaching me 'post materialism'. I was thinking it was going to be quite bohemian, but it seems it's the replacement of material things with images of stuff posted online.
durutti wrote:Yeah I’m fucked by interest rates and cost of living pressures, not my virtually non-existent discretionary spending. We’ve tightened the belt now even on things I’d previously considered non-negotiable (e.g shitty supermarket bread instead of quality fresh bread).
Not much I can do about ‘not accepting’ the price of basic living costs - we already only run one car and aren’t currently able to avoid/reduce bills via rooftop solar which I see as most folks only way of dealing with cost of living pressures.
Fuck, I’m even selling bits of my record collection to get by. And I’m in the 84th percentile for earnings with a fairly modest mortgage.
Something’s got to give. Even if corporate profits have taken a dip they’re still completely absurd.
All the best @durutti
x2.
No beer, no coffee, no vices at all here.
Cut right back on all ancillary spending.
classic and collector cars go up in flames in northern Sydney:
https://www.9news.com.au/national/ingleside-building-fire-mona-vale-road...
freeride76 wrote:x2.
No beer, no coffee, no vices at all here.
Cut right back on all ancillary spending.
You need a pay rise
All the best, guys. Bloody not easy at the moment.
Not sure how the hell people are going to cope over here in NZ, but it's not going to be pretty.
flollo wrote:$1250 is all earnings including casual. The above average is excluding casuals. Median full-time is $1,600 for men and $1,442 for women.
Source: https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/labour/earnings-and-working-conditions...
I stand corrected.
And here I was thinking I was on the median income when fact I’m a fair bit below it.
Yay!
freeride76 wrote:x2.
No beer, no coffee, no vices at all here.
Cut right back on all ancillary spending.
Was it here on SN that I read that saving $27.50 a day adds up to $10K a year?
We’ve had some tough conversations in our household about what’s essential, what’s discretionary and what’s a luxury.
Ride my bike to work pretty much rain hail or shine, make a plunger coffee at work, take my lunch to work. Slowly getting the missus to drop the “I’m hungry, I’ll just buy a snack” mentality. It helps.
Good luck crew.
This one will also hurt, I still got $35k to pay off.
https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/jan/28/inflation-driven-...
Depressing reading tbh.
My wife wants us to move to Oz but i don't know how I can replicate the same standard of living there that I enjoy here.
On my last trip home I was gobsmacked on just how crazy expensive Oz is. I dunno how young people or just even normal people get by. My best mate is on $200k with a Sydney mortgage and he says he still has to count his pennies.
Worse, much worse, in NZ. We can't believe how cheap things are in OZ when we go there.
I feel your pain, Zen. I've pretty much given up moving back to Aus. I'm looking forward to an extended retirement playing gateball and shogi in the local park. Or perhaps moving south to one of the islands. It's hard to believe that when I arrived in Japan, everything seemed so expensive. What a role reversal.
A quick video on how Australia (or more precisely: Scomo) changed the world economy forever:
I scoffed a little but tremendously enjoyed the idea that the shoot from the hip request for the covid origins inquiry prompted such an angry and poorly thought out response that it effectively decoupled the world economy. The overall theme is by going through the trade war, Australia revealed it's customer as being overly dependent. Scomo stands as the most influential Australian PM on the world stage ever with that move, lol!
Time for a huge marble statue of Scomo next to the Opera House? Maybe along the lines of Michaelangelo's David - Scomo nude with ripped heroic dad bod and slingshot?
Brother Stewy.....
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/28/stuart-robert-sai...
The Hon. Stuart Robodebt is up tomorrow.
Watch him squirm here.
https://robodebt.royalcommission.gov.au/
andy-mac wrote:Brother Stewy.....
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/28/stuart-robert-sai...
suchas wrote:The Hon. Stuart Robodebt is up tomorrow.
Watch him squirm here.
https://robodebt.royalcommission.gov.au/andy-mac wrote:Brother Stewy.....
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/28/stuart-robert-sai...
Yep, I hope to be able to catch a bit of it!
Will be interesting...
The legality of Robodebt is one thing, but even more fundamental was the flawed logic of the scheme.
Averaging always includes results that are substantial variations from the mean. In terms of imposing debts in the real world, it flows automatically that the vast majority of people will pay too little or too much. The amounts levied will be predominantly wrong by default. No legal advice is required to make a judgement on how unfair that is.
How many people must have seen that as acceptable (or were afraid to speak up) from concept to implementation is astounding.
I once spoke to someone directly involved in the pink bats debacle. They said any negativity to the concept was ignored or deemed to be not team player behaviour and strongly discouraged.
Group think and single minded pursuit of objectives can be very dangerous.
#ColourMeSurprised
As expected, technological advancements produce more revenue at a lower cost base. The correlation between profits and wages doesn't really exist anymore. Or if it does, it is quite weak and getting weaker.
frog wrote:The legality of Robodebt is one thing, but even more fundamental was the flawed logic of the scheme.
Averaging always includes results that are substantial variations from the mean. In terms of imposing debts in the real world, it flows automatically that the vast majority of people will pay too little or too much. The amounts levied will be predominantly wrong by default. No legal advice is required to make a judgement on how unfair that is.
How many people must have seen that as acceptable (or were afraid to speak up) from concept to implementation is astounding.
I once spoke to someone directly involved in the pink bats debacle. They said any negativity to the concept was ignored or deemed to be not team player behaviour and strongly discouraged.
Group think and single minded pursuit of objectives can be very dangerous.
Robodebt was a nasty deliberate exercise from its inception by LNP... Scomo, Stewy, Tudge etc have blood on their hands, they are directly responsible for people committing suicide. They knew this was happening, but kept the program going.
Let that sink in....
This has now plainly been demonstrated through Royal Commission.
Today will be interesting to see what type of spin brother stuey comes up with. Will his memory be in tact ?
Stuart Robert MP explains in 2020 why we should NOT be having a #Robodebt Royal Commission. The amount of BS he spins is extraordinary. But time’s up. #RobodebtRC #IRemember pic.twitter.com/lg1xM6kSgs
— stranger (@strangerous10) March 1, 2023
Supafreak wrote:Today will be interesting to see what type of spin brother stuey comes up with. Will his memory be in tact ? https://twitter.com/strangerous10/status/1631033862511030272?s=46&t=5Rcz...
I can't recall.
I wasn't told.
I wasn't aware.
Someone who I cannot remember said it was legal.
Labor did it.
It's Labor's fault.
I'm a good Christian.
re the Profit and Wages index graph above, flollo is correct.
It doesn't make sense to compare wages to profits since increased profits may be due to other things than labour productivity.
It's more valid to compare wages to labour productivity:
United States
Australia
"In the United States, the productivity of nonfarm workers is measured as the output of goods and services per hour worked."
"In Australia, Productivity is the real value of output produced by a unit of labor during a certain time."
Why should people get paid more per hr if they don't produce more value per hr? Anyone reading this who currently or has ever run a business knows it's not sensible to pay people more if they're not adding more value by being more productive.
This is what's wrong with the current "wages growth" disinformation propaganda campaign getting spammed across the media. People seem to expect that wages growth should "be higher" because it's "fair" or something. The only sustainable long-term driver of wages growth is labour productivity.
I agree that the chart is correct but the metric itself as you said is not relevant. Productivity is a way better metric, that was my point without adding all the info you added.
Loyalty to the party made him act in this way , whatever happened to loyalty to serve the public with honesty and lawfulness ?
Unbelievable. https://t.co/arChXHkizP
— Barrie Cassidy (@barriecassidy) March 2, 2023
Yet another way in which our democracy is seriously compromised - pollies beholden to the cabinet or caucus first and foremost.
Constituents are a distant second if you're lucky.
Supafreak wrote:Loyalty to the party made him act in this way , whatever happened to loyalty to serve the public with honesty and lawfulness ? https://twitter.com/barriecassidy/status/1631101860320002049?s=46&t=5Rcz...
LNP knowingly lied to the Australian public. I'm shocked I tell ya!!!!!
“ A dutiful cabinet minister “ fark me he needs to watch this performance on the telly tonight. I feel another resignation coming and he’ll just walk off into the sunset , pension in hand .
#RobodebtRC Former DHS Minister Stuart Robert says he had a “Massive Personal Misgiving” about figures he gave in media interviews including to the ABC, but as a cabinet minister “That’s what we do”😳
— stranger (@strangerous10) March 2, 2023
Commissioner: “Misrepresent things to the Australian Public?”💥 pic.twitter.com/qL285ERgC2
Supafreak wrote:“ A dutiful cabinet minister “ fark me he needs to watch this performance on the telly tonight. I feel another resignation coming and he’ll just walk off into the sunset , pension in hand . https://twitter.com/strangerous10/status/1631108109057011712?s=46&t=5Rcz...
Staggering!!!
The "I can't believe it's not politics" thread.