All Things Religion Thread

Balance's picture
Balance started the topic in Sunday, 29 Mar 2020 at 2:13pm

Here you go optimist

Not sure my motivation...my instinctive need to stick up for the underdog...my secret desire to be one day honoured rightfully with the role of Forum moderator (expecting a call any day)...

But anyway I couldn't help but read your troubles on another thread...unfortunately I found myself siding with everyone's posts...other than your own...except for the part where you were told you can't post here!

So I put my low IQ mind to coming up with a solution that suits all...and here it is...a safe place if you like

You can post anything you like about your beliefs...and no one has to read it unless they want! Easy peasy...

maybe you could even get Jesus, fat Buddha, Mohammed, and friends to converse in adult conversation here

Solving the world problems, one at a time...call it taking a shovel as a way of moving that mountain

All the best...brother

PS...I actually was born again once, but I grew up, and grew a brain of my own...and realised it was all a load of shit!

Jelly Flater's picture
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Jelly Flater commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 12:49pm

It does make perfect sense if u wish to draw that conclusion...
good luck with that ;)

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 12:57pm

Freeride...so can faith in medicine. It can also lead to death.

My partner’s best friend was told by a doctor that she would die in 6 months time. She underwent the chemo , the radiation treatment etc.

She died on the very day 6 months later. Her belief that she’d die in 6 months was set in stone the second the doctor told her a nominal date.

It was belief that killed her without a shadow of a doubt.

The Doctor basically pointed the bone at her.

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 12:56pm

We each lead our own lives and can confront mortal situations in any way we see fit. You don’t want to think that belief affects your life ....then don’t believe.

I do place a lot of stead in the power of belief. More so due to reasons that I don’t really want to describe on the internet. My life is what it is due to my confidence in the power of belief. I see no reason to think that any part of my life is excluded from the power of my belief.

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:02pm

yeah, maybe.

My mate up the road was also given a bad diagnosis and is now better.

belief may or may not have played a role.

it can as easily lead to delusion and bad outcomes as good outcomes. I've seen heaps of people with rock solid beliefs chase them down rabbits holes to their and their families detriment.

Steve Jobs played every belief card under the sun and cancer still got him.

depends what you believe in.

Pops's picture
Pops's picture
Pops commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:03pm

I think there's something to the power of belief in that sense - the placebo effect would seem to be evidence for it.

But I wouldn't put the house on it being infallible.

He who hesitates is lost

Blowin's picture
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Blowin commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:04pm

Belief ain’t going to ever stop the clock or make you immortal, but when the coin is tossed and the outcome is yet to be determined, I reckon that belief can definitely weight your call of heads if you want it badly enough.

udo's picture
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udo commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:14pm

The Biochemistry of Belief is a good read

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:17pm

Who's that by udo?

He who hesitates is lost

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:24pm

for sure Blowin, and I'm not discounting the power of the mind at all.

as Pop alluded to, the placebo effect is very real.

belief can be smashed on the rocky cliffs of reality though if it's untethered to anything objectively real.

brutus's picture
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brutus commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 1:56pm

Pops if people really were open minded and would watch or read the book , life changing because the facts are irrefutable and for us the conclusions are logical , then add a touch of faith......

The lack of education on most peoples part , comes down to not knowing or wanting facts to support their position on God and Jesus......
he read the b
Funny true story about a guy in the UK wanting to get a PHD in Atheism from Cambridge , during his interview he was asked had he read the Bible, to which he answered no. He was then asked what he didn't like about Jesus...to which he replied don't really know much about him, to which the Professor responded....you can't be an atheist , but you could be a moron!

Cromwell's picture
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Cromwell commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 2:01pm

"The lack of education on most peoples part , comes down to not knowing or wanting facts to support their position on God and Jesus......"

And here I was thinking it was the widespread near total ignorance of even the most basic science! Good to hear from you brutus.

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 2:04pm

Brutus, yep, he really does lay out a powerful case.

I've often found atheists reject God due for emotional rather than intellectual reasons. Not always, but often.

I've heard that story before too. Of course, there're also atheists who have read the bible (though perhaps not understood it), and plenty of christians who haven't fully read it, nor fully understood it. But yeah, it is sad how many people dismiss the whole thing out of hand due to preconceived ideas and never let themselves investigate with an open mind.

He who hesitates is lost

freeride76's picture
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freeride76 commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 2:08pm

"I've often found atheists reject God due for emotional rather than intellectual reasons. Not always, but often".

Often found?
Any high profile examples spring to mind?

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 2:20pm

No, not high profile. I don't move in high profile circles.
Friends and family. Hard to gather the underlying motivations/questions behind the questions of people you don't know. You can guess, but you can't be sure.

He who hesitates is lost

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 2:29pm

My father in law was an atheist all his life because a Roman Catholic priest kicked him in the shins when he was young. He missed out on a lot because of one idiot representing a very questionable church. He saw the light just before he died.

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 3:19pm

Hey guys, I found this 3 min video for you to watch regarding the worlds kingdoms and where we are from and where we are heading. Most of the worlds false religions came from Babylon. Its the dream King Nebuchadnezzar had when he was king of Babylon. It was interpreted by a young captive man named Daniel .The bible book is named after him. This dream and the image in the dream was around 600 - 700 BC. History of future empires explained before they even appeared. We are now in the unstable feet of iron mixed with clay and the ten toes being the ten kingdoms of the new world order. Its undeniable that this was foretold so long ago and has been so accurate to this day...Enjoy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwg5m9DTfrI

Balance's picture
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Balance commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 6:38pm

Sorry to change the subject optimist

Just a quick update
First thanks so much for the well wishes thoughts and prayers, genuinely appreciate it

Got the best news possible today. Mum had a PET scan, which came up negative for any spread of the cancer

She is a fit and healthy 69 year old and will undergo a major operation on friday...they take out half the pancreas, some liver, stomach...think that's it...then it's a heavy 3 months of rehab...if she gets through that...which she will, she can have a good few years well spent.

Side note the RPA nurses are a gift from God
Cheers

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Wednesday, 22 Apr 2020 at 6:56pm

Great news Balance, My wife and I will continue to pray for your mum daily
for a great outcome...God bless yas.

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Pupkin commented Thursday, 23 Apr 2020 at 2:15am
Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Thursday, 23 Apr 2020 at 12:49pm

Hey Brutus I found your movie on you tube for free. Its got sub titles but I'm watching it now and its got me in. Cheers for that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99bbBKSrZfE

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Thursday, 23 Apr 2020 at 6:15pm

Brutus, That Movie was excellent. Reminds me of Lew Wallace who wrote the story "Ben Hur" one of my favorite movies.

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Thursday, 23 Apr 2020 at 11:25pm

Optimist! Most sorry that your Father in law fell well short of your expectations.
Thankfully God oversaw yer lousy reference...not judging...Share the Love!

Cromwell, that cancer is a scary ride & crew wish yer wife good health.
We all send our best to Balance & his Mum with the cancer & operation!

Also happy to hear Optimist was healed & tbb will share a similar Cancer anomaly.

tbb's daughter was treated with Chemo for her cancer.
One day she did that whole convulsing Exorcist thing...Terrifying it was!
Doctor : Chemo never worked! Cancer is now bigger...book her in for Radiotherapy!

At this point! tbb was beside himself...it's a twin thing!
Started questioning & directing the very order of the World & for it to be restored.
All the while being reminded that my daughter could forget about family planning.

Feel free Optimist, to insert the correct scripture for a Dad facing the Abyss.

2 days prior to the 1st dose...Doctor says: "Good News! The Cancer is all Gone!"

Hang On! Wasn't the Cancer growing bigger & didn't we just cry our eyes out?

Turned out my daughter had unusually picked up a cold during the chemo.
The Cold showed up as glitch on Lymphoma Scan indicating a false cancer mass.

[ a ]"It was like, as if an Angel was watching over daddy's little girl."
[ b ] Knock yourself out Optimist
[ c ] Most would just tick 'Mysterious Ways' & simply move on...

PS: Despite the Happy News the Family were a bit mean with Qld Health for a bit!
Only cause you can't scare folk like that...Daughter passed the 5 year all clear! Yeah!

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Optimist commented Friday, 24 Apr 2020 at 5:24am

Well Truey she definitely had something and now its definitely gone so I'd be definitely grateful and don't be hard on the poor hospital staff who tried to explain it away while scratching their heads. Very good news indeed.
Regarding my Father in law,I loved him very much, great fun bloke and I never judge anothers freewill choices, but I love to share my experiences which are many.

Balance's picture
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Balance commented Friday, 24 Apr 2020 at 9:59am

Oh boy, just caught up on some great reading here, really enjoyed it

Those post are all-time optimist, am really happy to hear about your positive experiences

Jelly really sorry about your sister in law. I have a similar story about my best friend dying of cystic fibrosis. He had really turned to God in his final year. Was with him about 8 hours in hospital at the end, and it has scarred me for life

Now pops...you have given me a George Costanza mother moment...when she finds out about Donna Chang..." You're not Chinese???!!!"
Here I am thinking I am getting wisdom from a grandfather type fella! Ha, wish I had your knowledge at such an age...well I wish I had it now actually

Best wishes all

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Pops commented Friday, 24 Apr 2020 at 10:09am

Haha yeah, sorry about that Balance, I'm barely more then a grom!

On reflection I can see how the alias "Pops" might send the wrong impression... It's actually just the name that everyone who knows me calls me - typical aussie shortening of my surname.

Classic scene that too. All-time greatest sitcom?

He who hesitates is lost

views from the cockpit's picture
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views from the ... commented Friday, 24 Apr 2020 at 10:30am

Great news TBB and I would select option(C).
Reckon most with long experience in the day to day medical world- ie GP's, some surgeons, professors clinicians and specialists plus many Nurses, Sisters, Matrons would concur.

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Sunday, 3 May 2020 at 7:42am

If your ever interested in reading the Bible, Its like putting on a dive mask and jumping into the pacific. So much to see and the depth huge. Remember though, that its not a book, but a book of books. All written at different times in history. There is no glossing over the bad bits of peoples lives to make it look religiously appealing, but a raw account of mankinds walk in a fallen world with the hope of a new beginning reset by God Himself through the Christ. There are 39 books in the Old testament and 27 in the New testament. One means the "Old Deal" the other the "New deal". First the Law, then the Grace and freedom from the Law which is now fulfilled not by the written code, but by a new code written on the hearts of transformed men. A spiritual awakening which transforms an enforced discipline of the law to a naturally occurring one. We now only have two rules, Love God and Love people. This fulfills all the laws because if you love God you won't upset Him and if you love people you won't offend, cheat ,steal, murder, lie, adulter, screw up your environment etc etc. Always start with the New testament, which will give you Jesus teachings and adventures. Then after He has left, we read the acts, the mail (letters) and adventures of the disciples afterward. Its a great read no doubt, and even if your not a seeker of God, its a great history lesson from start to finish.

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Optimist commented Sunday, 3 May 2020 at 6:42am

A bit of scripture for Sunday, this, often read at weddings.
1 Corinthians 13 ...New International Version (NIV)
1) If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2) If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3) If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.
4) Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5) It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6) Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7) It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8) Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9) For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10) but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11) When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12) For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13) And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Thursday, 7 May 2020 at 1:03am

Hillsong Overboard.

[Body 1] (Brian's Dogsbody)
PM Scott Morrison invites Hillsong Brother OZ President Brian into the cockpit of Shark 1 ($250m Airbus) on route to State dinner with Trump. More recently PM Morrison delays 500 limit (SD) crowds until Oz President Brian coloured Sydney with 3,000 Hillsong troops. Hillsong were then excused as Essential front line workers and soon flew across all Oz border blockades spraying ungodly Graffiti over all Oz Cities just as AEC had previously failed to see Hillsong's VOTE NO in the Sky.

[ Body 2 ] ( Body Snatchers)
Lib (Bagman) $b Water Diviner strikes it rich MP Angus Taylor of (Hillsong) forges account documents to falsely accuse Sydney City Official of $1m Helloworld Rorts and is investigated by NSW Police Commissioner Hillsong brother Mick Fuller who recieved a phone call from Hillsong brother (His Bin Man) Scott Morrison PM after which brother Mick Fuller found nothin' untoward about brother Angus who has no case or copy machine or paper to answer for.

[ Body 3 ] (Part A...Hit Rock Bottom in the Harbour)
Hillsong MP Alex Hawke escorts Hillsong inlaws from Ruby Princess which triggers WWIII . Hillsong Brother NSW Police Commissioner Mick Fuller heads up 'Ruby Princess Police Investigation' & can't recall brother Alex or fellow Hillsong brothers & sisters acting suspicious about the docks on that particular day when not Hillsong but likely some random Chinese spreader may have accidentally on purpose opened the Gates To Hell.

(Large body of evidence goes missing...)

[ Body 3 ] (Part B...Heads roll as Big Wig lets fly)
Hillsong PM Morrison clears exonerated Pell of 2 weeks Quarantine so Pell can breach all travel embargoes to deliver Easter Message in some other Oz State. Pell's QC (Son of a Preacher Man) just made it across town in time to Head up Scomo's Mistress's Ruby Princess 'Inquiry'. PM today instructed Pell's QC that mere Christian mortals have no right meddling in Higher order Hillsong affairs & to just back off now & stop asking questions about onboard doings...Nuthin' Suss & had little do with Hillsong passengers that were highly unlikely to have been anywhere in the vicinity of Ruby Princess, now been well established, are we all clear on that Mr QC.

Mysterious ways or just yer everyday pure evil Pentecostal Demons running riot?

http://cityhubsydney.com.au/2020/04/hillsong-link-to-ruby-princess-claimed/

http://denisevans.com/murder-on-the-ruby-princess/

LOCALIST's picture
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LOCALIST commented Thursday, 7 May 2020 at 1:54pm

i suppose this is where this goes.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8294783/Cardinal-George-Pell-Re...

typical fucking scumbag

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Sunday, 17 May 2020 at 6:05am

ALOHA...I love that word and the deep meaning. To be present in the breath of life.
Its also a code to live by. The kahuna David Bray interprets this code as "Come forward, be in unity and harmony with your real self, God, and mankind. Be honest, truthful, patient, kind to all life forms, and humble." He also stated that to the Hawaiian of old, Aloha meant "God in us."
When Jesus came, God became "with us" as well. He taught us how to live, how to love and how to trust in God and His plan for us and our worlds both Earthly and Heavenly. Everyone is welcome to connect with God ....Jesus says...
“Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
and again...."Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me."
Once the spirit of God enters you by your invitation and only by your invitation, you see and feel things as new. ...Jesus..."But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear"...Then, the only true Evolution begins, we transform from one life form to another, from a temporal way of life to an eternal one.When Jesus rose from the dead, His new body was the first of its kind, both human and eternal and a preview of what we will become who trust God and put their faith in Jesus and what He did on the cross for all of us...
.TRUST.....Faith has many facets,but I think the most brilliant is trust. Trust is something you already have, you just have to decide where to place it. For me, I put my trust in the one who has the track record and has delivered for me in the past. That person is Jesus the Christ.
Where are you placing your trust today? Your job? Your bank account? Your natural talents or your track record? Your friends? Yourself?..All these things are temporal and subject to change but the only one who doesn't change is God..."For I AM the LORD ..I change not". Why not start the conversation with God and see where it takes you...Be honest and hide nothing...."For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light."
Giving yourself to God is like standing on a big black stage then all of a sudden the floodlight comes on and your standing there naked. There is nowhere to hide and everything is revealed...Remember these words.." No matter where you are and no matter what you have done, ask God to forgive you from your heart and He will", ask it in Jesus name.
ALOHA to you all, this is my last post and I'm returning to my little seaside shack as my wife has retired now too and will no longer be working full time. I'm going to have a very simple and inexpensive natural life. May God richly bless you and I hope and pray that somehow Ive been able to inspire you to to..
" Seek ye the Lord while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. Isaiah 55:6....Love and Blessings to my surf brothers and sisters, hope to see you on level 2.......Optimist.

truebluebasher's picture
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truebluebasher commented Sunday, 17 May 2020 at 11:19am

Sunday School Paper + Bonus Liftout

Pell's release + Religious Quarantine exemption through Covid -19 lockdowns.
tbb thinks that the High Court & Homeland security were nailed to the cross.

Note: Cardinal Pell is a Dual Citizen but an extraordinary one at that.
Could be that the Pope exploited s44(1) Foreign Power/s to save face.
This is not fanciful as Oz parliament cowers to a God daily, before all proceedings.

1973: Quote: "Australia established diplomatic relations with the Holy see/Vatican City State is a Foreign Power, like all other Foreign Powers with which Australia conducts diplomatic relations."

file:///C:/Users/Owner/Downloads/Sub%200065%20Jenny%20Warfe_Redacted.pdf
Note: Vatican asserts Governance over all World Catholics.
Vatican represents Highest World Order...(Above) United Nations.

How?

Vatican can shift from being Religion to a World Power beyond reproach.
Meaning it hides from all law & can't be held under any! Answerable to only thyself.
The Holy See as a Supreme body of government with an Oz embassy.
It is a sovereign juridical entity under International Law + Observer state of the UN.

And guess What?
Australia is detaining The Holy See 3rd Rank Official.

This explains the short sharp unanimous (Overrule) verdict...
Less about Saving Pervert Pell but Vatican flexing it's muscle cometh the hour
On the back of lazy Oz Citizenship fiasco The Vatican discovered it created light.
A Vatican official being held at Easter escalates into diplomatic sovereign crisis.
This Orb blinded our High Court & God frees Pell from both Jail & quarantine.

tbb is saying that Oz constitution is putty in Gods Hands...Pell can't be held!
Catholic (Entity) must be transferred into the nearest Catholic Holding House...
That being the Carmelite Monastry to await Transfer to the Vatican's Big House...
Pell now serves out default Vatican time-out at 'The Good Shepherd Seminary'.
This was no agreement but simply an Oz backdown to a Higher Power...

tbb: Further points out that Federal Police Unit were sent to observe changeover.
Not to deal with Pell's Graffiti concerns or Bolt's Police harassment mantra.
Let's be honest with ourselves...crew can be yer own Nation's Judge.

A team of 4 Federal Police / 4 suits file into The Good Shepherd Seminary .
https://www.smh.com.au/national/online-threats-spark-police-visit-to-geo...
(a) To storm Fugitive Pell's hideout & serve pedo papers. (TV version)
(b) To respond to Pell's Troll threats & Graffiti...(8 Police? tbb: Highly plausible!)
(c) To film a mock up vid for Bolt's new TV show "Kill Pell" (Most Likely)
(d) Carrying out strict orders from The Vatican...(This explains the Fed entourage!)

If you wanna see the sunrise again punk, don't pick (d)
Scomo: Are we all good now! Sorted

Aftermath...
From this overarching interpretation Scomo powers up Halo.
Scomo holds back the Corona wave long enough for the Easter Bunny Parade.
Hillsong God Squad soared above the heavens showering Oz in a Covid -19 cloud.

Pell's immaculate resurrection was likely spawned from verse s44(i) God said So.

tbb & all would then need to replace 'corruption' as God's mysterious ways.

Dale -Cooper's picture
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Dale -Cooper commented Thursday, 28 May 2020 at 10:43am

“The dog leg. That dog had four legs. One you found in my trunk. The other three went out with the information you're thinking about right now. Two people you don't want coming around here if anything bad happens to me.”

Optimist's picture
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Optimist commented Wednesday, 23 Dec 2020 at 5:17am

Merry Christmas and hopefully an optimistic new year..
God bless Yas...
Luke 2:8-11 (New International Version)
And there were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night. An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified. But the angel said to them, “Do not be afraid. I bring you good news that will cause great joy for all the people. Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord.
And our future.....after the coming darkness that will test mankind...
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace...Isaiah 9:6

Look up,..consider the ant.. expand your scale of thinking...read what Jesus said....
Love people...Love God...have a great and eternal future...

brutus's picture
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brutus commented Wednesday, 23 Dec 2020 at 8:46am

Hi Optimist , thank you for your blessings and Gods messages in these times of hopelessness.....the truth is here to be seen........reading "The book that made your World/ how the Bible created the soul of Western Civilization by Vishal Mangalwadi.....stunning read , empowering to say the least!

Pops's picture
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Pops commented Wednesday, 23 Dec 2020 at 9:17am

Optimist, brutus, good on you both and merry Christmas.
Couple of things to ponder as the year draws to a close...
Heb 2:18
Rev 21:4

He who hesitates is lost

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Optimist commented Wednesday, 23 Dec 2020 at 5:49pm

Wow Brutus, he's a cool guy...like him alright...I just watched this 5 min clip by him.
https://www.revelationmovement.com/videos/1-why-the-west-attracts-immigr...
Thanks Pops, great scriptures..much appreciated.

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frog commented Thursday, 24 Dec 2020 at 12:26pm

If you read the Dead Sea Scrolls, you will see many early threads and themes of the Bible. But you will also get an overwhelming impression of it being the writings of a bunch of elders and busy bodies trying to control every aspect of the villagers' lives through rules and taboos. The poor women were subject to many of the controlling rules including being banished from sight (and sometimes even the safety of the village) once a month as being unclean. The lists of do and don'ts described in the scrolls is endless, tedious and often petty. Much of this thinking made its way, after much refinement and with better story telling, into the various books that guide some of the world's major religions.

Spirituality is one thing. Religion is often something different.

Scratch the surface and you will see that much of religion is about control. The emperor Constantine discovered that he could confiscate a vast amount of property under his newly adopted religion from the unbelievers. Papal Rome discovered, after previously, in the Roman empire building days, having to rely on vast armies to conquer and control, to their delight, that they could now control Europe without an army and actually get paid for it through tithes and donations.

On a micro scale, an English adventurer Benedict Allen lived with a tribe in New Guinea. Back to nature and freedom in a simple life he thought. But no. The tribe's "witchdoctor" controlled virtually every aspect of life through fear and a complicated array of taboos. Tribe members had to do this, could not do that and lived under the watchful eye of the somewhat malicious "spiritual" leader. Even when he was not watching, he had the "spirits" to do the watching work for him. When on a quiet morning stroll gathering water well away from the tribe, a tribe member with Benedict, felt under surveillance and worried about Benedict having done something that was breaking an inane taboo and that somehow the "witchdoctor" would know.

Tribal leaders, kings and many ambitious people have found through the ages that their taboos, words and rules have so much more power and meaning if they are backed by the authority of a mysterious supernatural entity(s). So when the guru or spiritual leader speaks, always think - "what is the underlying intent and who benefits?". The message may be good advice or guidance, or more often, it may be just a carefully crafted means to control you or the group.

Frogg

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Optimist commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 4:09am

The kids are buzzing with excitement, mums and dads are stoked, families united together, gifts are exchanged, old wounds forgotten for a day a least, the feasts are partially prepared, enemies stop fighting and from Russia to America, from Africa to Europe and all the Western world there is world peace for a day.
Jesus the Christ, His influence still today still bringing peace. Even though most have forgotten Him, the Prince of Peace still has a legacy everyone loves.
If CHRISTmas is so good, can you stretch your mind and imagine what His heavenly kingdom is like. Have a Merry Christmas and if your like me and having a tough one away from your family, may the spirit of peace which comes from above be with you, in Jesus name.

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H2O commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 7:14am

Happy Christmas Optimist and all crew. Peace be with you.

H20

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Pops commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 11:29am

Well said Optimist.
Merry Christmas swellnet

He who hesitates is lost

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batfink commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 3:55pm

First look at this thread. I’ve always thought that religion and surfing don’t mix. ;-)

Brought up a catholic, mostly a true believer for that time, but always curious. Could never reconcile how many churchgoers were utter bastards in real life, most particularly the brothers and nuns who taught and devoted their lives to it, and the priests, the godawful priests.

In 20s took up with a meditation group, Hindu based as they all are, convincing spiel etc, but learned so much along the way. The practice of meditation over 8 years will do that to you, plus a useful way to de-indoctrinate oneself, which I did.

30 years later and widely read and much considered. Come to the conclusion that I’m fine with others believing whatever they like, but proselytising is really for the birds, but bound up in basic psychological drives.

Best way to keep your mind open is to eschew the concept of ‘belief’. The freedom from religion is a great boon, but freedom from having to believe (or disbelieve) is greater again. You can waste so much time and energy worrying about whether you should believe or otherwise. So I’m happy to take any idea on board and roll it around in my head if it has anything to offer, without needing to believe or otherwise. I live with the idea that all belief (and disbelief) ideologies can co-exist, and largely go in the same basket - interesting stories, unlikely to lead much of anywhere, may be true.

What I cannot consider possible is that one, and only one, is correct and right. So the ‘Chosen People’ mythos. It’s unsustainable intellectually and profoundly anti-humanist, and great evils have come from it.

Re the Bible, a fairly boring book with a ripper opening and apart from a few skirmishes, stories from the gospels and John’s whacko DMT trip. But if you want an interesting book with much more content and depth, the Mahabharata slays it.

I’m glad that part of my search is over, don’t need to spend more time on it. Quantum and standard physics and mysticism are so much more interesting. Possibilities of other dimensional beings, time being entirely a construct, what we experience being entirely governed by a very thin filter we call the human brain, infinite possibilities, circular time, free will versus pre-ordained, mathematical conjecture.

There’s an interesting world out there, you lose a lot by buying into one true philosophy.

Find that arch atheists are as crazy as fervent believers. Neither hold a tenable position. Agnosticism is true freedom and the only truly intellectually arguable position.

H2O's picture
H2O's picture
H2O commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 8:49pm

Religion for mine, is a man made creation with all that entails, and is distinct from the spiritual and moral teaching which was its source. What frog said above is largely true - man has often fucked with this for his own ends. Got to separate the teaching from the dogma.

H20

shoredump's picture
shoredump's picture
shoredump commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 9:27pm

100% fellas..
I label myself a buhddest but I’m in fact so far from it.
The teachings are to lead you to a moment of clarity. That’s all. If you think wearing some beads, chanting a mantra, and focusing on you breath is it, then you’ve missed the target.

Acute awareness of experience is god, for those that want to give it a name

Religion is meta

From there, nothing can ever fuck with you again

Merry Christmas dickheads ;)

goofyfoot's picture
goofyfoot's picture
goofyfoot commented Friday, 25 Dec 2020 at 10:03pm

It’s not for me but whatever floats your boat. Just keep it to yourself and your like-minded friends and don’t try to push your beliefs on other people.
Merry Christmas Swellnetters

Vic Local's picture
Vic Local's picture
Vic Local commented Saturday, 26 Dec 2020 at 7:24am

If I was given the keys to the Australian government for 30 seconds, I'd retract Hillsong's tax free status and announce a royal commission into those Evangelical grifters who protect pedos and enrich themselves via the cult.
And to all the real Christians out there, hope you had a merry Christmas.

"angry online, smiley in the brine"

ringmaster's picture
ringmaster's picture
ringmaster commented Saturday, 26 Dec 2020 at 8:11am

Religion? Fairy tales for adults IMO. Life is too short to spend it bogged down and obsessing over whichever 'brand' you choose or have inherited. If there is some sort of afterlife I'm quite happy to find out all about it when I'm dead.

Closest thing to a bible that I've ever read (and believe) is a book called 'Sapiens' by Yuval Noah Harari. Highly recommend!

Merry Christmas.

brutus's picture
brutus's picture
brutus commented Saturday, 26 Dec 2020 at 8:57am

yeah Pops , blessings to ya for another great year on planet Earth , there is one law and only one law..God's Law.. !
Optimist , what a great word picture of your Xmas .........it's amazing how many people dismiss the Bible and the Gospels....and have never read or understood what being a Christian means ...certainly not about Religions who have crafted themselves into the middleman between God and yourself.......the idea of ,a fellowship of like minded Christians directly praying God without all the rich trimmings of mega churches and their ownership of people and physical assets......simply mazin!

brutus's picture
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brutus commented Saturday, 26 Dec 2020 at 9:04am

Frog....so there is only man;s intellect , and nothing more?

udo's picture
udo's picture
udo commented Saturday, 26 Dec 2020 at 9:30am