Submitted by indo-dreaming on Mon, 08/22/2016 - 17:08
Don't know if anyone has been following this story, but I've got a feeling its going to be another case where we may never find out the truth but everyone will have an opinion.
All seems very fishy.
One minute the media reports she is to drunk to remember, next minute she had only a few beers.
Self defence?....more than 40 wounds? Drugs involved in some way? who knows?
Sentences been given.
He got six years, she got four.
Im always trying to defend Indonesia, but it's hard when they deal up sentences like this.
Yeah sure it was obviously not premeditated murder, but still the Balinese should go crazy over this.
Her sentence is okay, she obviously didn't kill him and it's totally believable she tried to stop him, but her actions after the crime (destroying evidence), make her guilty of a crime under 10 years for her sure no probs.
But him, fuck he killed someone and to make it worst a cop, bashed him with a phone and bottle (bit different to a fist), he should get a minimum ten years, more like 15 to 20 maybe 25 seeing it was a cop.
Quite obvious someone got paid, and fuck i hate to say that, because it's so cliché and not all Indo cops are corrupt.
For instance friends that have a villa in Bali told me this cop was actually really well liked among expats and regular Bali visitors that stayed in the area he patrolled, so extremely unlikely he was corrupt with the public.
Indo law , death sentence for drugs , 15 years for murder , ha , says it all , not much value on human life!
Poor ol schappelle . These couple fared a lot better with 6yrs for dj he must have been on good terms with the judge . the true story of what happened is unknown to the public i reckon
if 6 years is all thats required to ensure someone is reformed then the sentence is appropriate. there is no point locking someone up longer than required.
Who cares if he reforms or not ?
His rights cease to exist the second he takes someone's life through violence.
People can also get the death sentence in Indonesia for murder and occasionally they do, but it must be premeditated, in this case it's obvious it was not premeditated.
Yes people can also get the death sentence for drugs but it's very rare, its generally only for larger quantities , production or smuggling etc
The two from the Bali nine got the death sentence because they were the ones that ran the operation on the ground level, they basically used other gullible teens or just out of teens to do their dirty work, they even threatened them and their families with violence if they backed out, then ensured they took seperate flights to the mules to ensure they were not going to get busted with them, very calculated and gutless. (also known to have done previous runs)
In contrast the seven mules got prison sentences.
I have no problem at all with those sentences given.
I think the problem in Indonesia is more about not seeing a difference between pot and other drugs like heroin.
Anyway the important point is premeditation a planned and calculated crime is much difference to a crime that is spontaneous and based on irrational actions fuelled by emotions.
@Clam Do agree, "the true story of what happened is unknown to the public i reckon"
@Happyas, i guess it depends if you see the sentence as a punishment or rehabilitation?
I see it as a punishment, if you are going to base it on rehabilitation or the risk they would do it again, you would have to say just let them go now, as it would be extremely unlikely they would murder again.
indo. i do see it as rehabilitation but disagree with you on his likelihood to do 'it' [or] something close to 'it' again without support to fix his problem. what do you see the purpose of punishment?
How is a prison sentence going to rehabilitate?
Unless there is some type of program that goes along with the prison term to rehabilitate and show people there is a better way to live life without doing crime etc
Indonesia's prison system doesn't aim to rehabilitate, the two from the Bali nine rehabilitated themselves (kind off) because, they knew their only chance of saving their butts was to get the support of the Australian public to put pressure on the Australian government to put pressure on Jokowi to give clemency, unless they changed their lives and did some constructive positive things they would never have got support from the Australian public.
Im sure it would have been advised by their legal team, that's not to say in the end it was fake doing good things or getting involved in something like art etc can be addictive and change your mindset, but I'm 100% certain it was initially calculated with the aim I've pointed out in mind.
It's no coincidence the two Bali nine on death row turned their lives around to a degree while the other seven with prison sentences have not become artist or religious leaders.
Punishment is a deterrent, it's just like a fine, when I'm driving i try to stick to the speed limit not because i like going slow but because i don't want a fine.
indo, isn't it fact that Murder in Indonesia is a max 15 year sentence?
Drugs is a death sentence ?
So under the Indonesian law , the cop who was killed , was not premeditated , so less than 1/2 the max seems fair , but death sentence for drugs , and 15 years for murder does show that Indonesia thinks human life is not valued as we do!
Pretty obvious that if you were busted by a cop in Indo with drugs you might as well take your chances and kill the cop , and risk only 15 years!
it my understanding that punishment does not work as a deterrent for non premeditated murder. something to the effect of when such massive rage takes over the last thing on someones mind is the penalty. speeding down the street is different because your not in a rage and are able to comprehend your outcomes. as for the ability of the indo system to rehabilitate I agree with you, it probably doesnt do it very well. i dont think many prison systems do, but it should be the goal nonetheless in the absence of other solutions such as capital punishment. at the very least the period in jail gives the guy a great deal of time to reflect upon why he did this, and what about his personality is so fucked up, and give him the option/chance to turn his life around. having said this, im all for extending prison time indefinetely for crimes like this when the person shows continued poor behaviour in jail.
Hey @indo dreaming , hey @sharkman yeah thats a thought . I agree its the difference between the drugs they dont get it , ffs ! mushies are ok but grass isnt , what a crock . Are mushies now illegal what's the deal in indo now ? I had one time visit to kerobokan gaol & visited the now deceased Gabe rip (see "hotel kerobokan" book) and it wasnt fun place . Something about the law in indo is horrible , best to avoid all that stuff when your a Tourist especially .
That's an interesting point Sharkman wonder how that works, I'm sure others have thought the same when busted for drugs, although police in Indonesia also have no reluctance to shot a drug dealer either, drug dealers and terrorist regularly get shot in Indonesia in police shot outs or hunts for know criminals.
Indonesia law and justice system is far from perfect especially due to corruption, but i still think there are certain aspects that work, the proof is in the pudding when you compare Indonesia with other developed countries.
It's one of the most safe developing countries to visit in the world, drug cartels don't run the show making it dangerous like much of South America.
Violence in general is fairly low, i actually feel much safer walking a city street at night in Indonesia than i do Australia, knowing even if i got mugged id probably be able to joke and negotiate with the mugger.
The homicide rate is also one of the lowest in SE Asia, 20 times lower than PNG and Phillipines only countries that are lower in Asia are Singapore and Japan (developed countries) admit-ably though i cant see how they can be that low, must be a bit higher than that.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_...
Kidnappings are virtually unheard of unlike many other developing areas of the world like South America, Africa, PNG even Phillipines.
Yeah so despite problems with corruption etc, they are still doing something right because things could be much much worse.
All that said six years for killing a cop still sucks.
I feel much safer walking around Kuta than I do walking around Alice Springs.
Ha ha! Negotiate with a mugger.
Those Indos really do love to haggle:)
Hey mr, give me your wallet or I stab you..
How bout I give you 100,000
Ohhh cmonnn, 250,000
Nah, I'll give ya 200,000
Ok ya mr.
I read a story of an Indonesian that got mugged in Indonesia with their whole monthly pay cheque on them and they actually negotiated with the mugger to at least leave a certain amount so they can get by and the mugger let them keep some.
Almost everything is up for negotiation in Indo, especially if you do it with a smile and a joke.
@ Indo dreaming yes the bright side of the corrupt ways . So money equals power therefore the poor stay poor & the rich do whatever ?
Corruption is a problem in Indonesia and yes in the legal system and it's easy to just assume that there has to be corruption involved when you get sentences like this, but there is plenty of people in levels of authority that are not corrupt and some even strongly despise corruption, i have a few Indo cop friends so had this discussion with them.
Also many people think Indonesia has extremely high levels of corruption, which is true when compared to Australia, but on a world scale it doesn't even come close to the top of any corruption perception list, most middle east and African countries come higher and compared to other SE Asian countries Indonesia sits alongside places like Phillipines and Thailand with the poorer countries like PNG, Cambodia, Laos even Vietnam etc having much higher levels of corruption.
In regard to your statement, Yes that's true, but same goes in Australia, money equals power and you need lots of money to take advantage of corruption in Australia, like if you are a big developer or politician etc
Even though corruption sucks, at least in Indonesia there is times when it can be of benefit to the more common man not just the super rich like in Australia, like paying a bribe instead of a much more expensive traffic infringement, or paying extra to get some paper work done quicker, or paying to jump a long wait in line when you are feeling like crap lining up for an airport flight, or like when my wife got her drivers licence, her option pay the fee and do the test or pay double and pass and get your photo taken and licence printed.
Dodo learned after killing all those tourist by firing squad that it was bad for biz.
hence cop killers got lucky timing with lenient sentence.
i doubt there was much corruption,too high profile a case.
the convicted looked pretty poor.when the lady tried to give 2grand to the cops family,they would've been offended.
the pom would probably be a hero inside to all the criminals.
i was there when it happened but really havent paid much attention to it till now.
indo dreamn or
anybody else know info on if the cop was up to some shady shakedown???
Nah dont buy it, the executions had very little effect on tourism, from memory tourist numbers actually increase over the period and last time i looked Indonesia actually overtook New Zealand for the most visited country by Australians.
The legal system and any design made really has nothing to do with Jokowi.
Haven't heard anything shady about the cop, friends that have a villa in Bali actually told me he was well known and well liked among regular Bali visitors and expats.
BTW. I read yesterday an American on death row (the first ever American) was moved to Nusa Kambangun (Death Island) this week.
Is dodo the pres troppo D ?
Who knows really what sort of shakedown troppo id say yeah , maybe drugs involved, consumed, dealt, caught with or under the effects of .
@Indo dreaming thanks for explaining your above comment.
BTW that was suppose to read "decision" not design...damn auto spell.
Yes Jokowi Widodo is president.
But it doesn't mean he has time to mess around for interfere with the legal process or courts decisions, he has a country to run 34 provinces, 200+ different ethnic groups, 17,000 islands and many many more important issues.
I do agree there was possibly drugs involved, it really doesn't make sense that you would fight or beat up a cop or that a cop wants to get in a fight with a tourist.
Here is a possible scenario, maybe the cop did find her bag and maybe he looked inside and maybe there was drugs inside, they couldn't run because the cop would have her ID and maybe her passport, in that case they would really want to get the bag back.
Obviously the easiest thing would be to pay the cop off and walk away with the bag and drugs.
But what if the cop wouldn't accept a bribe, this could cause a panic knowing the shit they would end up in, so they physically try to get the bag from the cop.
This would explain how or why things got physical.
Maybe they then realised even if they got the bag from the cop he would report them and they would get busted trying to leave Indo.
Maybe they just wanted to knock him out like you see on the movies but ended up killing him.
Indo, would the court transcripts tell us the story ?
rite on.thnx for the update indo dreamn.
clam,i love that name!
the night the murder went down was a full moon n i went out n got off me chops!it was a crazy night.
i did the so drunk n stupid i lost me scooter.ended up @police station at 3a.m. telling them it had been ripped off,bali was not a safe place anymore!had everyone looking for it...filed a police report
5a.m.staggering home from tuban polsek found me bike miles away from where i remember parking it??
went back next day they all laughed at me and ended up buddies with the police chief.i love indo!
Thats a different perspective of a wild bulan pernama night troppo D
Prosecutors lodge appeal on Connors sentence
Really?...that's a risky and crazy move the sentence was super short and could actually increase not decrease.
Im putting my money on it that it will extended to what he received.
The prosecutors are appealing, ID.
They're asking to match his sentence.
Ok that makes more sense.
Info about appeal
The reason drugs attract a harsher penalty in Bali than murder is because they can affect many more people. One shipment of coke, ice or whatever can affect dozens or even hundreds of lives as well as the corruption along the way to distribute it , compared to a single murder . I'm not saying it's right, but that's their reasoning I think.
Yes [email protected] , and they dont categorize the different drugs very well .
It's more about premeditation
Murder can receive the death penalty in Indonesia if premeditated.
When your producing drugs or organise a big shipment or even smuggling drugs, it takes a lot of thought and time, you have months, weeks or days to reconsider your actions you should have a clear head the only emotion that can distort your judgment is greed and you have countless opportunities to not compete the crime, there is no excuses, you know what your in for if caught and you role the dice.
Same with a planned murder, even if you have feelings of jealously or rage, you have time to get your shit together and reconsider your actions.
But if it's in impulsive crime like a murder without premeditation, then that is different for instance in this case, even if the actions weren't made in self defence the time to reconsider the actions could have been seconds to minutes at best, obviously many uncontrollable emotions would have been in play and even possibly the influence of alcohol.
Will Sarah Connors Sentence be increased or not ? today in denpasar ...
Increased to 5 years.
Remember that couple that killed a Bali cop, the women involved only got 5 years and got out early today.
"Sara Connor Freed and Awaiting Deportation to Australia"https://indonesiaexpat.biz/featured/sara-connor-freed-and-awaiting-depor...
Sarah Connor,isn't she from terminator?
I was in bali but it wasn't me!i swear it!!
Word on da street from indonesian friends from indo[not white boys claiming lokal status].johnny law was korrupt.it was a shake down down that went wrong.
i dunno just telling ya what i heard......
Flying home on a Flight from Jakarta..to where ....WTF ?
A very murky affair indeed. I’m pretty sure there’s more to this than meets the eye.
This case was always a bit suss, like what was a traffic cop doing on Kuta beach at 3.00 am ? My local balinese friends reckon the army controls most of the drug trade in indo , and in indo you don’t fuck with the army , they don’t care for police they are a law only to themselves
I was in Sumatra once and I got this guy to drive me to the next town so I could get some cash. When we hit the outskirts of the town a cop starts following us with his lights and siren on. My driver just ignored him and continued on to where we needed to be. When we reached our destination the cop came up to the window and obviously pretty fired up asked my driver why he didn’t stop. My driver didn’t say anything and just pointed to an army beret on his dashboard. The cop apologised and left the scene in a hurry. My driver said that the van belonged to his brother who was in the army. Nobody fucks with the army in Indo.
I was in South Sumatra and had just done a big ATM run to get enough cash for the losman bill. Rounding a bend, I came across a police checkpoint that was shaking down road users. My heart sank, knowing I'd made a rookie error with 10 million rupiah in my wallet and no uang Kechil (small money) in the pocket.
Luckily the orang putih (tourists) were given a free pass. A quick selfie with the cop, and a thank you for wearing the Topi Keras (Helmet) was all it cost me!!!!
"angry online, smiley in the brine"
That would have been the same town I reckon. The one up in the mountains with the cop shop on the roundabout as you roll into town.
Ive only ever had one real run in with a cop in Indo in the Telos just before the first resort got built, i was only just married and had my wife with me but no wedding certificate with us (often need it to book hotels if not a foreign couple) and they thought she was a hooker id paid to take on holidays with me, she looks nothing like a hooker but is Javanese and was wearing city type clothes, plus we had her old man with us who is a bit of a cool cat and looks like a pimp cigarette holder wearing camouflage T-shirt and some hipster type hat..
Anyway had to pay $100 to get out of the cop shop and they held my passport until we wanted to leave the Telos, then when we tried to get it back the day we departed they wanted more money but we weren't going to pay anymore, luckily her old man is well connected with PDI political party and as soon as he mentioned that he would go find the local leader of PDI they gave it straight back.
But other than that touch wood ive had no issues actually had heaps of positive experiences with Indo cops and also with army guys they seem to always just want to make a connection with you and know about Australia and basically be your best mate, did actually become good friends with a Mentawai cop and his wife but sadly lost contact as he has been moved to another area.
Here he is and his wife
And this is a really old photo in Bali i took when you often use to have too stop and pay cops going up towards Ullus, love the pic if you look closely you can see the drivers wallet and his eyes in the rear side mirror and then the cops hand out..classic pic.
Man I miss Indo. Thought I’d bump this thread so people could share there crazy indo stories. It really is a place that knows how to extract the craziness out of already crazy people haha.
- Broke my elbow falling of the second story of a Nias losmen, the ones that have no handrails on the stairs. Spent a week there getting massages from the mother of the teenage Indo rat who would hang around and drink all your beers. I could tell something wasn’t right but kept convincing myself it will come good. They didn’t help by telling me everything was okay. Ended up back in Oz getting surgery with the doctors tripping on the fact I stayed so long haha. They just wanted me to keep getting “massages” as I was paying 100 grand a pop so I was just a dollar sign. Lesson learnt.
Smoking Sampoernas and sucking Binnys. Talking about the epic waves you scored and watching the carnage if you’re lucky enough to be parked in front of a pumping wave. Happiness abounds.