Submitted by goofyfoot on Tue, 01/15/2019 - 12:06
Hoping for some persuasive discussions on either a Landcruiser Troopy or Landrover Defender.
I’ll be buying a second hand one in a few months time. Both have there pros and cons for me so I’m looking forward to hearing others opinions on them. Diesel of course
Will be a surf mission / family beach car that you just chuck the dogs, kids and whatever in without really stressing about it
Les Hiddins always drove a defender
I spent a few months hanging with a German microsurgeon who had a state of the art Defender. Literally bespoke made machine . Amazing set up of which he was very proud. Land Rover would send him parts for free and pay for labour costs to get any repairs done as his car was semi famous . He’d get it shipped from country to country on his global jaunts.
He was the first to bemoan its shortcomings though . Shortcomings which were hilariously framed as representative of the personal shortcomings of the English race. Being German , he took much pleasure in this.
The problem with the defender is that it’s way too small internally,very cramped. It was also underpowered and the seals were fucking hopeless. Poor fella was just about OCD with his anal retentive cleaning regime .
Big ask keeping a poorly sealed car clean when you’re living in a desert during a drought though. Watching his attempts at defeating the intrusion of red dirt was where I derived much pleasure.
Anyway , bottom line being , he actually admitted the troopy was superior, but he just had a hard on for his bespoke vehicle and he’d never part with it.
I thought it was an impressively outfitted hoax myself. Rattling , slow and uncomfortable.
Troopy every day of the week.
Troopy for sure, build quality and ergonomics are better, and as far as I can work out, drivelines and engines in the Toyota are stronger too.
One thing I know, don't tow in fifth or things will start to come apart. Popping out of fifth is the first sign.
Personally I'd prefer a mechanically injected straight 6 to a common rail 8 if you're in it for the long haul, less to go wrong, more tolerant of suss fuel and way cheaper to repair.
Blowin you have reminded me what my mate says about Defenders from his Navy days, he says the last thing considered was where to fit the driver and passengers, forget comfort he would say .... the Bush Tucker Man didn't say that thou.
Further, a couple of years ago the motor auctions were selling ex armed services Defenders absolutely dirt cheap, like under $10k cheap. So the choice may come down to what you have to pay. I was talking to a guy who got one for around $7500 (I think) and can't remember exactly but I think he said his had an Isuzu diesel engines in it.
Grays online do the ex army vehicles
Some of the Series III Landies had the 3.9 litre four-cylinder (!) Isuzu.
My mates one sounded like a tractor, drove like a tractor but you couldn't kill it and the torque was impressive.
Did a trip from Melbourne to SW WA in a customised Troopy with some ridiculous 6 litre Diesel V8. Drove down to Cap Le Grand from Norseman, on some crazy dirt track. The thing was absolutely mental. The guy I was with had it loaded to the max but it would still absolutely fly. We had to slow down when the temperature on the road hit 50 an hour later it dropped to 15 with a southerly change. Great trip!
Apparently some blokes did the same trip as you did , BB. Exact same trip ....even left on the same day.
They’re still bogged at Cape Le Grand.
There’s a reason that most of the country was built using Toyota 4WDs....strength and reliability.
I'm with AndyM, if you can find a 6 cylinder Troopie without too many kms. Those with 4.2 6 cly factory turbos are gold.
Landrover, any model ... you couldn't pay me and I was brought up with them on farms. Poms never did quality control, ask any experienced mechanic.
Toyota also do great parts and servicing and most older mechanics know the 4.2 6 cyl troopies, lots of parts out bush. No debate for me.
If you’re going for a 6 cyl diesel troopy don’t stress too much about km’s. As long as the previous owner kept up maintenance and servicing it’ll go forever.
If you’re not in a rush to get one and you’ve got the $$, search out a later model factory turbo 6 cyl troopy. They are the pick and you’ll get your money back if you decide to sell.
The old man had one of the first 2.8L (non-turbo) diesel Troopies back in the mid-late 80’s for work. It was a mission getting up Willunga hill but it kept going and going. Probably clocked over 500-600K kays in the end, if I recall correctly.
I’d love to get one of the newer models but these days would be hard to justify its presence. Would definitely get one if I was living back in South Oz though.
Troopy - with a caveat. The later V8 ones are $1K per injector, tend to get dust in them too. I've heard of shredded turbos? About 20K for V8 diesel rebuild. Also, the wider motor necessitated wider front track compared to rear track, so you are pushing more sand with this one iirc.
The earlier 6cyl diesel 1Hz was indestructable, the turbo version was the duck's guts. Will go on for a very long time. We did Oz in a 60 series with the 2H diesel, that was unstoppable too. RV version of Troopy has 5 seater layout with forward facing seats. My bro had 79 series ute and got to drive it on railway lines in the NW with special attachments! Typical Cruiser, you will end up getting leaks at the front hubs over time, overall maintenance is a bit more than a normal car, keep changing oil every 5000. Buying it once and keeping it well is better for the planet than trading in lots of times. I'd love another FJ73 or BJ74 myself...
Landrover, it pains me to say, but nah.
A Troopy shits on a Defender , hands down. The Defender is a wannabe army truck/ Daktari safari machine. It's failed in it's quest to even become a poor mans Hummer , and is mainly sold to people who really dislike scrub scratches messing up the paintwork ., And given it's turning circle it was never going to be a winner with the grey nomads for example.
Don't know much about Defenders but LR has traditionally been streets ahead of Toyota when it comes to the package of off-road ability and on-road comfort.
Toyota is only just working out TC now and sort of gets it. But IMO LR has paid a price for leading the market but without enough quality control = reliability issues.
As they say.....the best truck is a Defender built by Toyota. Ha :)
Tbh though. If your getting a well looked after 2nd hand example and are not intending on remote travel then I doubt LR peculiarities will cause you grief.
If you want reliability.....get a Toyota....if you want some fun including how to learn how to become a home mechanic....get a Landy.
Don't say I didn't warn you!
Aaaaaactually HappyasS, there kind of was a Defender built by Toyota. Sort of. In the 1980s, LR Australian assembled (I think!) the County wagon and used the Isuzu 3.9 as its diesel powerplant. So LR 4x4 design (and quirks) with Isuzu reliability (remember, it was Isuzu who designed the 2H 4.0 diesel in the Landcruiser at that time). Auto history lesson over :)
Edit: also, the TD4 in the first generation Discovery was pretty reliable (and economical) too. My last trip back to country WA, I was stunned to see more Series 1 Discoverys still on the road compared to 80 Series Cruisers or Patrols which came from the same time. Maybe the rust spared the mostly alloy LandRover (their major advantage).
Fair to say the almighty Troopy is coming out on top.
I’ll keep doing my research and there’s quite a few good 4wd forums that are good reading.
I was on a job site with a guy last week who has just gone all out and bought a new v8 Troopy Ute with all the fancy tyres, winch, exhaust etc and the thing is a farken beast!
That’s way out of my budget and not to mention not what I want, but impressive machine none the less.
Thank you for the advice swellnetters
Didn't realise they had 6WD options! This thing is a beast.
Wow that’s a weapon
So how do troopys go on fuel,thirsty or not?
At 2.5 tonne unladen anything is thirsty. Probably find the lighter defender goes better on the beach.
Thirsty. I’ve got a 2006 1HZ 4.2 diesel naturally aspirated Troopy . It sure does love it some fuel.
Goes amazing on the beach. I’ve never been bogged in it without being able to get out just by letting the tyres down lower. That’s the key : get good tyres. I’m currently running Goodyear Wrangler Duratrack. Best tyres I’ve ever seen.
We used to take my Troopy to the boggier beaches because the German’s Land Rover was so fucking hopeless.
Great thread GF. I've been asking same ???
And getting about the same responses in return.
I have owned quite a variety of vehicles (including 4X4's) in my time and have stuck with the cruisers. I own a HDJ79R ute and a HDJ100R wagon. Obviously both have the 1HD-FTE engine (6 turbo diesel) and are absolute work horses. nearing 300,000kms on both and still in great condition as long as you keep the services up on them. Have never let me down and I won't get rid of them until they die (which by records will be well over 500k+ kms) still holding their value too as they are well sort after. Regularly get asked if I want to sell them when in the carpark! Depending on how hard you drive them, average around 12L/100km.
For me, as long as I can afford them, can't go wrong with a cruiser!
And let’s not forget the Love that Is Not Named.....troopy love.
I suppose it’s the same for many iconic vehicles, such as Kombis , Minis and probably defenders too , but when you are in your troopy and you see another one coming down the road you know there will be enthusiastic waving directed at you and it’s rude not to wave back.
A few times I’ve come in from the surf and found Troopcarriers Australia Facebook invites tucked under my wiper blades. Probably a very useful resource if you wanted to find out what’s going on with your car. Some crew rock the troopy stickers on their car like its offering them thermonuclear protection.
Got to admit I have seen some awesome troopy setups as extended surf travel rigs.
I lived out of mine for seven months last year.
Went to some crazy places in complete comfort . Best bed I’ve ever slept in.
Photo sent to me to post. So here it is.
What sort of person ruins a perfectly good surf shot by putting his car in it?
It’s actually a photo of my English mate fresh off the plane from a Northern winter. Having the time of his life !
He’s lying in the middle of the photo in white speedos on a white towel.
Yeah , he’s certainly doing those high cut speedos justice.
Gary G would .approve
Spent many an hour in the workmate turbjo v8's driving through bulldust up to your armpits. The torque i n low range is epic. Fuel economy no towing cruising at hundy is pretty good at round 10 litres per humpty
Old mates v8 landy was a beast but was at the mechanic a bit
Toyota for sure, but why not get a good wagon instead of the troopy? I had a '91 HZJ80R GLX wagon 4.2 factory turbo 5 sp manual. Sold it at 600K klms. Went like sports car in the dirt and fast safe highway cruiser. I imagine more comfortable than the troopy which helps on long hauls and would be just as good off road (maybe with a snorkel?). Parts/ service all over Australia. No competition IMO.
The wagons are good too. As said above we ran the manual HJ60 around Australia, it was a brilliant car and in 18 months I think one wire frayed, 4 flat tyres. And this was going remote, everything from surfing it over undulating dunes down to the head of the Bight to navigating single lane mountain tracks (propped up by 44 gallon drums full of rocks on the corners) on West Coast Tassie mountains in snow! The kids loved it and climbed all over the mattress style roof rack, they would check the motor/air filter/oil etc with me each morning and still remember finding a Huntsman spider in the air cleaner box...
Kms - 285 when I bought it, 440+ when we were done, so it had reached Lunar distance and was on the way home.
auto or manual troopy?
Ive never driven an auto 4WD but can’t imagine they’d be any advantage when you want to rev the arse out of it in a lower gear.
auto or manual ?? Give yourself an uppercut desoutc
By all accounts autos are the way to go in the tough stuff.
Not that they make 70 series with autos!
Ive driven both. Manual is shit offroad. Modern auto boxes are so good these days. More capable and more fun.
They must be good. Can’t really fault a manual. You never know till you try though I guess.
Nah, just joking. Manuals are fine. Especially a troopy. Although once you've driven auto offroad you'll never go back. Still reckon manual is better for towing but many would disagree.
Autos are better for towing.
Manuals are better for real off-road. Better gear selection. Ability to rock back and forward when stuck. And more fun driving.
Yes but with constant power to wheels in auto (when changing gears), you are less likely to get stuck in sand. Not impossible though, you have to stop eventually. Rocking back and forth is good if you can't just throw the max tracks down.
Velocity Johnno will work out who I am with this comment.
If you ask a mechanic the same question about choosing a Landrover or a Toyota, after they stop laughing, they will let you know if it isn't a Toyota or a Nissan it just isn't worth the repair bills. Reliability and if they do break down, availability of parts, trumps everything.
I already do! Bro tried Defenders up in the NW until 3 of them busted diffs and then it was back to Toyota for his company. We will need more Tojo 4wds if we make this upcoming holiday a regular thing.
Auto v manual, being properly 4wd trained for work then let loose on the continent, the rocky track stuff, steep inclines I'd go manual, there are some clever mechanical tricks you can do with them.
but, these days, the 4wding I will want to do mostly will be sandy after getting to a place, auto and a nice torque converter all the way.