kirra & tweed sand pumping jetty

nope's picture
nope started the topic in Thursday, 26 Aug 2010 at 12:17pm

opinions on fingal, deebs, froggies, snapper and kirra?

ftl's picture
ftl's picture
ftl commented Thursday, 26 Aug 2010 at 10:25pm

can't have it all good from what I can tell from the time i've spent there visiting family but I'm no expert. all hail dbah.

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope commented Thursday, 26 Aug 2010 at 11:03pm

yep,
fingals slightly better due to consistancy but stupidly crowded.

dbah is shit now!(with fingals new found popularity this is a bigger loss then kirra)

froggies and snapper always have sand.

cooly went from a somtimes wave to the final extention of snapper-rainbow-greenmount.

and kirras empty but not as good.

does it balance out?

i recon all this ´save kirra´ shit is from outta towners, promoters of ´cooly´, people looking for jobs and of course the many , many sheep.

every year since appart from 2009 there has been longer barrels(snapper to kirra) and almost as or as heavy barrels(snapper(not as perfect or long but))then kirra.

i saw in kirra pub ´save kirra´ on the shitter wall with a needle under it. classic. bring back the kirra smackies!

i wanna hear the arguments for ´saving´ kirra

radbone08's picture
radbone08's picture
radbone08 commented Thursday, 26 Aug 2010 at 11:58pm

will kirra come back? i heard that the government were going to stop the sand pumping....

Peace out Zac

my_opinion's picture
my_opinion's picture
my_opinion commented Friday, 27 Aug 2010 at 2:43am

They wont stop the pumping, at least I hope not.
a) the Tweed bar is usable
b) D'bah is not too bad (apart from recent beach rejuvenation has straightened the bank out
c) Froggies is good fun when its good
d) Snapper is the best its ever been
e) Superbank is epic on the right swell, crowds are what they are
f) Kirra is ok, but I reckon it would be best (and easiest) managed by extending the breakwall back out

On a side note, I'm all for more pumping outlets, like maybe one at North Kirra for instance. And a couple more artificial reefs (ones that actually work as a surf reef). I think if surf crowds are going to continue to grow at this rate, we need to use man-made structures to increase the number of decent waves. Only in places that have minimal impact on natural structures though...

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope commented Friday, 27 Aug 2010 at 1:53pm

im with you my_op.

but... deebs is shit now. sure its had an occasional set up. but it used to be like straddie with a consistant structure to the banks.

now its doomed. think of how many times they have ´rejuvenated´ the beach. itd be long gone by now if they hadnt.

re extend the groyne!!!
kirra went weird 5 YEARS b4 the sand pumping when they took a 1/3 off the big groyne!
also b4 the jetty the dredge took the sand from the left bank infront of the bar and filled in the outside of kirra and snapper.

more sand pumping for sure!!! instant shallow banks!

and i do LOVE the shifts in banks(but for new deebs) like the sand ´bomby´ we had a few sessions at snapper years ago.

even when all the sand was pushed outside greeny last year. every one was complaining about nothing at snapper but it was so much better then it looked.

pablo's picture
pablo's picture
pablo commented Saturday, 28 Aug 2010 at 9:58am

I wonder if they put the sand outlett a bit further out to sea at lovers if you wound get a bank linking up Snapper from lovers.This area also picks up a heap more swell than snapper but is wind affected at times

carobu's picture
carobu's picture
carobu commented Sunday, 29 Aug 2010 at 2:29am

http://www.tweedsandbypass.nsw.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0014/60521/icce_conference_paper.pdflink text
Here are the actual government details, I find it weird that New South Wales got permission to send the sand over the border, I miss Kirra the good old days.

gcsurfer's picture
gcsurfer's picture
gcsurfer commented Sunday, 29 Aug 2010 at 11:17pm

Kirra can almost come back within 3 cyclone swells its doesnt take much to get ride of the sand but soon as we do get a cyclone they panic and pump more sand again, dont understand that but when kirra had a big strom swell its still can break as gud as it did a few years back perfect barrels and fast sections, its just a camel ride back to ur car lol.

pigdog's picture
pigdog's picture
pigdog commented Monday, 30 Aug 2010 at 10:47am

hi guys im from vic i dont know anything about this kirra saga but my close friend told me (a chippy) today that a buildings shadow has to be a certain distance from the ocean thats the reason the all the sand is there! some one wants to build more appartments is this true or just chinese wisper?

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope commented Monday, 30 Aug 2010 at 11:20am

wouldnt put anything past them money chasing bastards pigdog!
they wanted to turf the beach too!
peter turner -surfer turned money/property hound- was saying in the local paper if the beach was turfed it would help bring back the point.
no explanation on how though. id say cause there isnt one!?

alva's picture
alva's picture
alva commented Tuesday, 31 Aug 2010 at 1:38am

yeah theres no doubt there is some pigs rolling around feeding on their money filth..but there isnt much we can do as far as i know...as too the bring kirra back argument, all of you who want kirra back, think about it; you get your famed kirra point back, rock up early only to find theres no parks..eventually you find a park look out and its crowded as fuck..the crowds from snapper have some how cramed themselves into the point setup (a much much smaller setup then snapper to cooly) and there all wankers and you dont even ge a wave? whats the point of this? you can fit alot more people on the superbank then on kirra point. when its good everyone will fuck off there and youm might score a few sneaky ones on your old kirra point, i do.

localsonly's picture
localsonly's picture
localsonly commented Sunday, 5 Sep 2010 at 12:32pm

you fucking idiot snapper super bank are the same break

my_opinion's picture
my_opinion's picture
my_opinion commented Sunday, 5 Sep 2010 at 10:29pm

Could someone be assed explaining to 'localsonly' why that last statement is wrong?

wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson commented Monday, 6 Sep 2010 at 12:48am

they need to put an artificial reef in the middle of palmy - a big a-framed peak in the middle of the beach. and also put a reef from bilinga to tugun about 20 metres off the beach and pump out all the sand deeper than it. then there could be a super-bank 2. then put numerous a-frames reef from miami to surfer's with slightly differing angles to catch different swells and pump out all the deep banks off surfers. then change the name to surf city like on the buses.
- the nerang river used to come out near broadbeach and half of tweed used to be river. the areas is already naturally fucked anyway so why not?!?!?

ftl's picture
ftl's picture
ftl commented Monday, 6 Sep 2010 at 7:27am

Could someone be assed explaining to 'localsonly' why that last statement is wrong?

By: "my_opinion"

no, except to say he's wrong. and he's wrong.

alva's picture
alva's picture
alva commented Tuesday, 7 Sep 2010 at 12:30am

"snapper rocks" has been there long before the super bank you dick heads, so has rainbow bay, greenmount and cooley..they were just all seperate banks working on their day..now its one linked up "superbank" just my opinion..when did i say they were seperate breaks anyway

born-bred-goldy's picture
born-bred-goldy's picture
born-bred-goldy commented Thursday, 9 Sep 2010 at 11:30pm

Fuck people losing kirra just isnt about the wave though surfed it many many times in its epic life we also lost a very valuable part of our surfing heritage.
All hail the "Supa Wank" fuck get over it its a con and a farce it comes down to money
NSW sells sand to Qld started at $3.15 pcm (thats per cubic metre) and now it sits around $8.75pcm
As for you NOPE your an Idiot your uniformed and probably work for McConnell Dowel or the X Councilor that rip down part of Big Groyne so he could build his high rise surf shop
Facts are important
Nope you talk about blow ins your ignorance is saying your either never seen kirra break or your the blow in
I know the crew that started the whole save kirra campaign i can say that they had the whole communities interest at heart NOT JUST THE SURFING FRATERNITY
Money Talks People

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope commented Friday, 10 Sep 2010 at 12:54am

deebs is a bigger loss. kirras a farce compared to what was and what is sheep are easily led....surfers are the biggest sheep i know but then i pretty much only know surfers. ´born and bread goldy´-boy. go live in cavil with your goldy mates and leave cooly politics for locals.

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope commented Friday, 10 Sep 2010 at 1:05am

sand comes and goes kirra wasnt always what it was 20-60-100 years ago you need to get over it ´boyo´ and be happy with whats still the best small wave location in the world. what ive seen anyway.
id love to see the big groyne extended. not for coin, i surf and think moneys for sheep.
when they took the top off is when it first fucked up 5 years b4 the sand system. granted itd still be fucked with the sand by-pass.
and dude chill out. too many late nights in caaaviil aavve on the gear maybe?

i just wanted to hear some different opinions on my local.

wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson's picture
wax-on-danielson commented Friday, 10 Sep 2010 at 5:35am

kirra is the past. we need artifical reefs for the future, with sick surf as an objective. kirra was an unintentional fluke when the different breakwalls were built for other purposes. why not make reefs with the intention of creating sick surf as well as trying to stop beach erosion?

my_opinion's picture
my_opinion's picture
my_opinion commented Friday, 10 Sep 2010 at 9:29am

wax-on-danielson, thats gotta be the smartest thing I've read on here for a long time. Not that I've been reading shit on here for years or anything, but yep I reckon thats spot on. Should put the 'surfers paradise' back into surfers paradise by actually creating some decent waves around the joint, aside from the hundreds of other benefits for surfers (more/sick breaks) and the environment (stop erosion etc), think of the added tourist/industry dollars to what is already a half billion dollar industry on the Goldy. Because the bottom line is thats the only way they justify expenditure or even actually bother to do shit = THE ALMIGHTY DOLLAR!!

djbtak's picture
djbtak's picture
djbtak commented Thursday, 16 Sep 2010 at 3:55am

Why is it that people like born-bred-goldy keep saying how important facts are and then veer off into stupid conspiracy theories? The kirra surf retailers probably suffered most from the changes to the wave, as it made cooly much more the centre of surf activity and that's where most of the people making the retail money are.

As someone who grew up surfing Kirra in the 80s, a lot the current debate is just feeding off negativity and misplaced nostalgia. For sure it was an epic wave and I had some of the best surfs of my life there (little groyne 87.... yew), but the reality is -

1) The groynes were built to hold the natural sand flow for the benefit of beachgoers, and in time surfers got a great wave out of it. The flipside is that combined with rockwalls and no dune system, there was a lot of beachside property that sometimes didn't have an actual beach where you could swim between Kirra and Bilinga surf club. If you really thought this group of property owners weren't going to get something done you're dreaming. Especially using the argument that the council was responsible for their lack of beach in the first place. We're just lucky the marina proposal got taken down (where the "let kirra be kirra" slogan came from)

2) From my memory, the big groyne shortening was the compromise / low-impact attempt to let more sand flow north before the sand pumping (which everyone was very nervous about surf-wise). But remember that when big groyne was built it actually fucked kirra for a couple of years and everyone said that building it was a disaster. And even back then we had the crew who said Kirra was better before the groynes anyway (more with blurry photographic evidence and the mists of time - most of the more serious surfers agreed it was way more consistent with the groynes).

The point is that things change and no-one really knows what the answer is if you want to keep the totally artificial southern gc beaches in place. Personally I'd like to see them rip out the tweed breakwall, groynes and seawalls and let the beach go back to its natural shape which would mean that all the buildings along musgrave street would eventually fall into the ocean. But I'm not under the illusion that this is ever going to happen.

3) The surf on the southern gc overall handles more people and is more consistent since the pumping - I think that's pretty hard to argue with. The refraction means that you often get a 1-2 wave on S swells in snapper/greenmount where it would often be a lake when Dbah was 3 ft.

4) Totally agree with wax-on-danielson that the gold coast could be greatly improved with artificial reefs. A lot of the southern goldy just needs banks. But the only way this is going to happen is if the surf community gets organised around it, and frankly most surfers would rather go surfing and bitch on the internet than actually lobby the governments and councils. Remember that the Palm Beach reefs got sunk when a shitfight broke out, partially fostered by an unsuccessful competitor to the bid. Politicians will run a mile at that stuff. We can talk about the economic benefits all we like but until surfers get together and present a coherent message it's all pipe dreams.

mowgli's picture
mowgli's picture
mowgli commented Wednesday, 29 Sep 2010 at 10:27am

djbtak: "We can talk about the economic benefits all we like but until surfers get together and present a coherent message it's all pipe dreams."

Probably the most accurate thing anybody has said in this discussion.

However, whilst more artificial reefs seems like a good idea on paper, there are a few things that require investigation.

The first one being that, some here have mentioned the various negative and positive (depending on where you're standing) impacts of the various groynes, beach restorations, jetties etc that have been constructed over the years on the GC. Wouldn't you think similar outcomes will occur if artificial reefs were to be placed infront of beaches that don't naturally have them? (i.e. result = negative and/or positive outcomes). I can already think of one potential issue being the obstruction of sand travelling northward to other locations (Straddie, Moreton, Sunny Coast). Granted, this would probably only occur on a noticeable scale if there was a substantial number of reefs put in.

Also, it seems to me that one factor contributing to the increase of surfers both on and flocking to the GC has been the international attraction that is the superbank itself. Can you imagine if there was a whole bunch of reefs to spread everybody out? It would probably work for the first year or so. But then the GC's reputation as a surfer's paradise would increase dramatically as there would be the photographic proof for all to see. You don't need to go to some far-flung developing country to get perfect reef waves. The Goldy has them all! The end result. Even more surfers on the Gold Coast. Thus the solution then re-enforces the problem......I think the word for this is 'ironic'.

And the most important point of all is that we do not understand everything there is to know about how the hydrology of the coastline encompassing Nthrn NSW and SEQ works. Without this knowledge we can never be certain if any proposal is a good or bad thing, and what impacts this may have economically, environmentally and socially.

“Life is a long lesson in humility.”

pete_79's picture
pete_79's picture
pete_79 commented Wednesday, 29 Sep 2010 at 9:54pm

mowgli wrote:

Also, it seems to me that one factor contributing to the increase of surfers both on and flocking to the GC has been the international attraction that is the superbank itself. Can you imagine if there was a whole bunch of reefs to spread everybody out? It would probably work for the first year or so. But then the GC's reputation as a surfer's paradise would increase dramatically as there would be the photographic proof for all to see. You don't need to go to some far-flung developing country to get perfect reef waves. The Goldy has them all! The end result. Even more surfers on the Gold Coast. Thus the solution then re-enforces the problem......I think the word for this is 'ironic'. Quote:

Nailed it Mowgli,
I've travelled around south America a bit and as soon as you say you're from Australia they all know the same few words in english: "Ahhhh SUPER bank!!!!" and "Barrells!!". I heard this so many times and I never mentioned the Gold Coast, just said I was from Australia. What was "ironic" was that I heard this while we where surfing a wicked point break with awesome barrels realing down the headland and there was not a sand pumping system in sight...

Alot of the surf web sites in other countries live stream the snapper web cam and to people in these countries this is their dream wave. That's why snapper is so packed with people that can only say "superbank" and "barrels", no matter how good the waves are anywhere else they only want to surf the superbank, all day, every day...

mowgli's picture
mowgli's picture
mowgli commented Friday, 1 Oct 2010 at 2:06am

A lot of that would be attributable to the fact the superbank is ridden by past, present and future world champions. People want to wear the shoes, use the racquet, have the boardies, and in the case of surfing, ride the waves, that the professional athletes do. It happens in every other sporting endeavour, why not surfing? I know when I was more naive when it came to the world of surfing, I wanted to go to places like Cloudbreak, G-Land, or Bells, just because, you know, "that's what all the heeeaaaapppss cooool pro's are doing Dad!"......although I think I still want to surf Bells but only now because it's one of the spiritual homes of Australian surfing and I think every Australian surfer should surf it at least once.

Also, it wouldn't be helped by the fact that the first stop on the world tour is Cooly. A place where you can wear boardies for most of the year, see hundreds of sun-kissed beauties in bikinis with their jiggly bits begging for your attention, see the cooly kids in action, go partying every night, get on the drugs (if that's your thing) and never be put in jail or given the death sentence, and surf a variety of un-threatening sand-bottomed waves.

If you were some kid who had to sneak past the gun-toting gangs of Rio to get to the beach everyday, or a garbage man in Newcastle in the UK surfing in Arctic-like waters, or even a farmhand from a long ling of farmhands searching for something different in land-locked Switzerland, well, the Gold Coast would look like surfing heaven to you wouldn't it?

“Life is a long lesson in humility.”