What is the objective when riding a wave?

benski's picture
benski started the topic in Monday, 9 Aug 2010 at 1:20am

OK so the banter between antifroth and roystewart over on the thread about the most expensive boards in the world got me thinking about something I’ve long wondered about.

What is the objective when riding a wave?

Seems a dumb question and the obvious answer might be to get barrelled or do some turns. But they seem to me to be intermediate things to achieve the main objective which is to ride the wave for as long the wave allows. Getting barrelled, doing turns etc are just moves to make sure you don’t end the wave too soon. If it’s going to barrel in front of you you’ve got to pull in so you can keep riding, otherwise it’s over unless you can shuffle your way round the section quick enough. If you get too far out in front of the curl, you’ve got to cut back into the pocket. And so on. But big deal, manoeuvres have a function, they serve a purpose, not exactly big news.

I remember in the 80s watching the world tour as a kid when length of ride was one of the judging criteria, I don’t think it is these days. And lately, watching the odd comp and generally out in the surf, I’ve seen people doing these big snap like cutbacks that create the most massive spray out across the face. Looks impressive, but it often causes the wave to section off too far in front of them and basically end their ride. It seems a stupid thing to do on a wave no matter how cool people think it looks. It makes me think of what the Campbell Brothers talk about with their Bonza tri fin designs, words to the effect of big spray being a waste of energy. That water should be channelling out beneath the tail of the board to increase drive and speed.

So what is the purpose of each wave? Is it to ride it for as long as possible, in which case how you do it doesn’t matter? Or is it something more aesthetic, like doing cool looking turns to impress people (including yourself)?

I’m far from a good surfer, so for me it’s about feeling the rush of the water beneath the board, the lift as you cruise along in as close to pure trim as whatever the board & wave will allow and the swift glide as the bottom drops out and the face steepens and (as I think Bob McTavish described) the opposing forces of gravity and water come into play to send you speeding along. The longer I can ride the wave, the more opportunity for all that to happen. Turns only help to create specific elements of the ride (including the barrel). Consequently, I think my surfing looks pretty ordinary to onlookers (the odd cut back, plenty of trim, top turns at certain times only etc) but I surf the wave to maximise the feelings that I like.

Maybe this is all stating the blinding obvious, I dunno. I think the flat spell here on the sunny coast has given me too much time to think and so maybe no one else cares, but just in case...What is your objective when riding a wave and how does that affect what you do on each one?

bombora's picture
bombora's picture
bombora Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 10:04am

Roy is part of the surf industry, whether he likes it or not.
And his intolerance of other people's ideas and attitudes to life single him out as the "odd one out". Which is how he seems to like it.

I too, take exception to having him tell me the surf industry has told me I must describe my surfing as fun.
What I especially take exception to is him telling me I can't define my surfing as "fun" because it means I've been brainwashed. Yet he is doing everything he can to brainwash us into "his" way of thinking.
Major FAIL Roy.

antifroth's picture
antifroth's picture
antifroth Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 10:53am

Spot on bombora!
Now back to the core of the original message in this thread.
It is to have as much fun as you can out of surfing and make sure you are aware of other people to have some fun in the water too.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 7:31pm

it.

I too, take exception to having him tell me the surf industry has told me I must describe my surfing as fun.

What I especially take exception to is him telling me I can't define my surfing as "fun" because it means I've been brainwashed.

Yet he is doing everything he can to brainwash us into "his" way of thinking.
Major FAIL Roy.

By: "bombora"

Actually I'm doing nothing of the sort.

I don't use scientific brainwashing techniques, as used in surf industry marketing. Scientific brainwashing tecniques ensure that you are not aware of the programming, that you feel that you are making your own decisions, and that you are the author of your own desires. Brainwashing hides itself.

What I do is direct and without subterfuge. Because of this you think I'm trying to tell you what to think but really I'm not, I have no expectation regarding how you think or whether or not you will change your way of thinking.

.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 7:39pm
"bombora" wrote:

it.

I too, take exception to having him tell me the surf industry has told me I must describe my surfing as fun.

What I especially take exception to is him telling me I can't define my surfing as "fun" because it means I've been brainwashed.

Yet he is doing everything he can to brainwash us into "his" way of thinking.
Major FAIL Roy.

By: "roystewart"

Actually I'm doing nothing of the sort.

I don't use scientific brainwashing techniques, as used in surf industry marketing. Scientific brainwashing tecniques ensure that you are not aware of the programming, that you feel that you are making your own decisions, and are the author of your own desires. Brainwashing hides itself.

There are billions of dollars spent every year specifically to control and determine the ways in which you think and feel. When you parrot the catch phrases used in such brainwashing it is evidence that it is working. 'Surfing is fun' is one such concept.

The marketing for 'fun' doesn't mean however that surfing isn't describable as fun, it just means that the majority of people will adopt that particular concept instead of other ones, it reduces variety and introduces a monoculture, it also virtually lobotomises people as they have a reduced ability to think for themselves.

What I do is direct and without subterfuge. Because of this you think I'm trying to tell you what to think but really I'm not, I have no desire to change your way of thinking.

.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 7:53pm

Roy, I will not refer to you as an acid tripper or anything else, but I am interested to how you describe what surfing is to you?

By: "mtw"

Surfing is arguing on the internet ;)

Seriously though it's a multifaceted activity, and sometimes when I ask myself why I do it, the answer seems to be no more or less than "because I do" or "because it is there".

Of course the health benefits to surfing are great, and it's fundamemtally pleasurable to mind, body, and spirit, but my emotions surrounding it are complex and varied, as well as being sometimes completely absent during the best sessions. . . almost as if it's like a 'no mind' hunting task, like being in the zone. At those times I ride waves and then can't remember them immediately afterwards. Surfing makes me feel predatory at times, at other times it's like a game of chess, other times like a dream. It's hard to explain and I'm sorry that I'm not doing a very good job of it.

.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 7:54pm

Aaargh two double posts, the posting's a bit slow, sorry.

mtw's picture
mtw's picture
mtw Wednesday, 18 Aug 2010 at 10:48pm

Thanks Roy!

That is a great description of the feelings you get. I agree that the rush you get is more in depth than just 'fun' but to describe it in one word you are out there for fun. Dont agree with all your points but can appreciate them now. I guess if we all agreed with everyones point, hey we would not have a forum.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Thursday, 19 Aug 2010 at 8:11am

Well it's just a few thoughts I'm sure that most people surf for recreation and that that can be broadly and vaguely described as fun but also that surfing involves a huge range of feelings. Also in the case of professionals they surf primarily to win. I have a surf to win attitude myself, self judged.

.

bombora's picture
bombora's picture
bombora Thursday, 19 Aug 2010 at 9:02am
"roystewart" wrote:
"bombora" wrote:

it.

I too, take exception to having him tell me the surf industry has told me I must describe my surfing as fun.

What I especially take exception to is him telling me I can't define my surfing as "fun" because it means I've been brainwashed.

Yet he is doing everything he can to brainwash us into "his" way of thinking.
Major FAIL Roy.

By: "roystewart"

Actually I'm doing nothing of the sort.

I don't use scientific brainwashing techniques, as used in surf industry marketing. Scientific brainwashing tecniques ensure that you are not aware of the programming, that you feel that you are making your own decisions, and are the author of your own desires. Brainwashing hides itself.

There are billions of dollars spent every year specifically to control and determine the ways in which you think and feel. When you parrot the catch phrases used in such brainwashing it is evidence that it is working. 'Surfing is fun' is one such concept.

The marketing for 'fun' doesn't mean however that surfing isn't describable as fun, it just means that the majority of people will adopt that particular concept instead of other ones, it reduces variety and introduces a monoculture, it also virtually lobotomises people as they have a reduced ability to think for themselves.

What I do is direct and without subterfuge. Because of this you think I'm trying to tell you what to think but really I'm not, I have no desire to change your way of thinking.

.

You are so much trying to influence my thinking you posted twice, the second one a modified version of the first.
Fun is fucking fun. Your claim re "billions of dollars" spent to influence my thinking insults my ability to think. I have spent more years than you've probably been alive working in industries which spend those billions so I know a fair bit about it all. You're just espousing another of your manifold conspiracy theories to get people to burr up. Doing a pretty good job of it, too I might add.
Except most "thinking" people just see you as a single minded pedant with his own hidden agenda.
Tell us again how much you want to sell that board for, Roy.

roystewart's picture
roystewart's picture
roystewart Thursday, 19 Aug 2010 at 10:01pm

You are so much trying to influence my thinking you posted twice, the second one a modified version of the first.

By: "bombora"

That's an illogical argument. I posted twice by mistake, not because i thought that a double post would influence your thinking.

e wrote:

Fun is fucking fun.

That's a tautology, it's meaningless.

e wrote:

Your claim re "billions of dollars" spent to influence my thinking insults my ability to think.

It's a fact that billions of dollars are spent every year on scientific brainwashing in order to control the way you think. Realising this is a necessary step in avoiding it.

Your ability to think doesn't seem to be above average.

e wrote:

I have spent more years than you've probably been alive working in industries which spend those billions so I know a fair bit about it all.

Working in an industry doesn't necessarily make one aware of the brainwashing.

e wrote:

You're just espousing another of your manifold conspiracy theories to get people to burr up. Doing a pretty good job of it, too I might add.

It's an indisputable fact that billions are spent every year on scientific marketing. That marketing exists solely in order to control people's thinking and behaviour. Calling that a conspiracy theory is ridiculous.

e wrote:

Except most "thinking" people just see you as a single minded pedant with his own hidden agenda.

There are at least two logical fallacies in that argument.

It contains an invalid 'appeal to belief'

It's also an example of the logical fallacy known as the 'biased sample'

e wrote:

Tell us again how much you want to sell that board for, Roy.

Which board would you like to hear about ?

At present we are building the 19 foot 'Sun board' which has a price of US$852,000

.

bombora's picture
bombora's picture
bombora Friday, 20 Aug 2010 at 2:12am
"bombora" wrote:

You are so much trying to influence my thinking you posted twice, the second one a modified version of the first.

By: "roystewart"

That's an illogical argument. I posted twice by mistake, not because i thought that a double post would influence your thinking.Yoy posted twice but the second one was a modified and expanded version of the first.

e wrote:

Fun is fucking fun.

That's a tautology, it's meaningless.tautology is also fun

e wrote:

Your claim re "billions of dollars" spent to influence my thinking insults my ability to think.

It's a fact that billions of dollars are spent every year on scientific brainwashing in order to control the way you think. Realising this is a necessary step in avoiding it.I didn't question the figure just your apparent assumption that I was not smart enough to be aware of it.

Your ability to think doesn't seem to be above average.Probably not. What's YOUR excuse?

e wrote:

I have spent more years than you've probably been alive working in industries which spend those billions so I know a fair bit about it all.

Working in an industry doesn't necessarily make one aware of the brainwashing. It does if you've been part of the development teams

e wrote:

You're just espousing another of your manifold conspiracy theories to get people to burr up. Doing a pretty good job of it, too I might add.

It's an indisputable fact that billions are spent every year on scientific marketing. That marketing exists solely in order to control people's thinking and behaviour. Calling that a conspiracy theory is ridiculous.

e wrote:

Except most "thinking" people just see you as a single minded pedant with his own hidden agenda.

There are at least two logical fallacies in that argument.

It contains an invalid 'appeal to belief'

It's also an example of the logical fallacy known as the 'biased sample'Roy, you are a "biased sample" all by yourself

e wrote:

Tell us again how much you want to sell that board for, Roy.

Which board would you like to hear about ?

At present we are building the 19 foot 'Sun board' which has a price of US$852,000
price of US$852,000
price of US$852,000
price of US$852,000

thelostclimber's picture
thelostclimber's picture
thelostclimber Friday, 20 Aug 2010 at 6:07am

This post has gone way off thread and enough has been said about opinions of the surf industry. So forgetting about all that

I surf for the adrenalin rush of taking the drop on big waves.

I surf because I love the feeling of time slowing down as I pull into a barrel.

I surf for the euphoric feeling of making it out of the barrel and into the channel.

I surf for the feeling of weightlessness as I begin the top turn of a floater.

I surf for the solitude (note I live in Tassie not Gold Coast) and being in tune with the ocean.

I surf to hang out with mates and do something we all enjoy.

I surf because I can.

seal's picture
seal's picture
seal Friday, 20 Aug 2010 at 6:51am

I surf for FUN and I don't need some fuck-stick telling me that it's not! Been surfing for more years than alot of people on here, about 40 years give or take.Started doing it for fun with mates and still surfing for fun with mates and my kids.Though, at times the crowds take the fun out of it but then that's when I think I am still having alot more fun than working or trying to sell hunk of shit for US$852,000! Now that wouldn't be my idea of fun but if he pulls it off then he will be having alot of fun wth the money and knowing some poor fucked up rich prick has been fully sucked in!
And as thelostclimber says, " surfing is an euphoric feeling" which you really have to be a surfer to comprehend. Thats my two bobs worth anyhow.

jaffa1949's picture
jaffa1949's picture
jaffa1949 Friday, 20 Aug 2010 at 12:34pm

Debate is over before it's begun.
The answer is lying like warmth from the sun.
The answer my son when all's said and done
to go out in the surf and have your own kind of fun.

But if you like serial arguing, to spite your own nose
delivered from great the wooden platform of modern olos.
Promulgation of your theories that no-one else knows
Then if you should sell one I really suppose,
reap the fruits of your labours, long since begun
match the smile in your beard as you take the money and run!

shaun's picture
shaun's picture
shaun Friday, 20 Aug 2010 at 11:44pm

I surf because it has become an addiction, I've looked for counciling but there's no goverment funding.

nope's picture
nope's picture
nope Saturday, 21 Aug 2010 at 1:33pm

depending on the wave.
the objective without a doubt is getting the most enjoyment or rush YOU can outta the wave you are surfing.

you should do what you want but i recon in general;

small and short try standing on a lid.

small and long a mal.

heavy and/or fast a shortboard

and when super heavy for those otherwise left out or wasting waves try a lid.

big waves a gun. boogs go like poo in big stuff. sorry but true.

hoot somone who´s stoked no matter what they did or do! some people suck the fun outta surfing with im too good to smile or claim attidudes (unless in a heat)

when waiting for your next wave smile and talk to people it will make you feel better about your fellow humans!

bombora's picture
bombora's picture
bombora Sunday, 22 Aug 2010 at 7:05am

hoot somone who´s stoked no matter what they did or do! some people suck the fun outta surfing with im too good to smile or claim attidudes (unless in a heat)

when waiting for your next wave smile and talk to people it will make you feel better about your fellow humans!

By: "nope"

Absolutely. I'm happy to say that's the vibe at my local - short boards, long boards, boogers, knee boards, skis and SUP's. There are some gooses on each of those but the majority just enjoy surfing, they have FUN. Cheer one another, even call someone else onto the wave from time to time. I surf in a great spot on the east coast of Australia and despite being a part of a crowded surf coast, it's manageable with the right attitude.

sesh's picture
sesh's picture
sesh Monday, 31 Jan 2011 at 11:49am

I guess the main thing for me is to get the adrenaline release... sometimes it all happens so quickly I can't always remember exactly how it all happened, but i roll off the back of it and start paddling out again looking for the same feeling or better.

more's picture
more's picture
more Monday, 31 Jan 2011 at 8:44pm

to have fun, to leave the stresses of life behind even if only for a while, to enjoy something that nature has created...

www.moresurfboards.com

batfink_and_karate's picture
batfink_and_karate's picture
batfink_and_karate Tuesday, 1 Feb 2011 at 5:00am

Good question benski.

Great response malibu_1963. :-) . I'm sure that's why some people surf. They kill the joy of it for me.

What is my objective. In a few words - Flow, drawing lines, going fast. The wave tells me which one takes precedence in any ride.

On the more spiritual side, for me it is now about moments of joy, most usually found on clear crisp mornings, offshore winds, soft morning light, rarely with a crowd. As often enough it comes in the moments waiting for the next wave.

Joy! It is actually a rarely experienced emotion, and tends to get harder to find up to a certain age.