2022 Election

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blindboy started the topic in Saturday, 13 Nov 2021 at 7:46am

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 8:01am
indo-dreaming wrote:
Supafreak wrote:
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:
GuySmiley wrote:

Everything?
Really?

Everything that matters. Whatve they done that’s worth taking the time to type it?

I reckon getting rid of the indue card is worth taking the time to type it .

Yeah If you are a paranoid nutter that believes everything they read on social media and think's pensioners are going to be forced onto income management.

But yeah seeing you posted no stop for two years about how Ivermectin was some Covid miracle drug with no evidence to support it, I'm not surprised.

If you care to look back through the thread indo you will find you actually supported some of the views about ivermectin that were put up , yes you did it’s all there have a look you hypocrite. And for the record you sad little man I never said it was a miracle cure for covid and neither did any of the doctors/professors supporting it . I believed in the doctors/professors that actually treated patients . Borody and Clancy are no lightweights in the medical field. Once again you bring up ivermectin on a different thread trying to discredit me , knock yourself out ya pathetic weasel. A bloke that tells everyone that LNP are the better economic managers and that howard and morriscum are the two best PMs Australian has ever had has no credibility .

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 8:40am
indo-dreaming wrote:
flollo wrote:

Maybe. I do live a pretty average, boring life. Three kids, sports, local public school…I don’t drink alcohol so no drinking in pubs with mates etc. I mainly interact with people through work, uni connections, kids birthday and sports, family gatherings, neighbours chats…I don’t know, everyone seems to be flat out busy and not have the time to think about things too much. Yeah, there are things pissing people off but wanting blood? That’s a pretty big call, I’m not seeing it but I could be wrong I guess.

If there is such thing as normal you are it (although most would enjoy an odd beer or wine), but you would be in the majority.

It's a very small minority that have views of "wanting blood" for anyone no matter what side of politics you are on.

Most people right now are thinking more about things like rising living cost, price of petrol, interest rates etc

Indo the statistician once again explaining how the majority of Australians think .

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andy-mac Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 8:40am
indo-dreaming wrote:
flollo wrote:

Maybe. I do live a pretty average, boring life. Three kids, sports, local public school…I don’t drink alcohol so no drinking in pubs with mates etc. I mainly interact with people through work, uni connections, kids birthday and sports, family gatherings, neighbours chats…I don’t know, everyone seems to be flat out busy and not have the time to think about things too much. Yeah, there are things pissing people off but wanting blood? That’s a pretty big call, I’m not seeing it but I could be wrong I guess.

If there is such thing as normal you are it (although most would enjoy an odd beer or wine), but you would be in the majority.

It's a very small minority that have views of "wanting blood" for anyone no matter what side of politics you are on.

Most people right now are thinking more about things like rising living cost, price of petrol, interest rates etc

Yep, the LNP really left a mess to be cleaned up! Labor's fault they haven't fixed 10 years of neglect, corruption, and incompetence in less than 6 months.
If ya not angry, then you haven't been paying attention. They LNP fingered Australia and Australians, but hopefully karma in the form of an ICAC is coming to sort them out ...
If ya still pushing line of LNP being better economic managers, then sorry to say you are ignorant of the historic data and living in a delusion....

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andy-mac Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 9:12am
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flollo Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 9:33am

@andy-mac I don't know if your above commentary about LNP/Labor was directed towards me or not. In any case, yes these are the issues Labor is committed to improving on and I wish them the best of luck. And by no means would I expect them to address all of these in a few months. It would be a good achievement if they make progress during this term. I'm not pushing any lines, that would be foolish. But I stand by my observation that I'm not seeing people wanting blood in real day-to-day life (outside of the online world).

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AndyM Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 10:00am

Flollo, I've spoken to a lot of people over the past few years (thousands??) and the degree of anger against Australian politics and the LNP specifically is huge.
People want change, they want honesty, they want accountability and they want to see these crooks face the music.

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andy-mac Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 10:19am
flollo wrote:

@andy-mac I don't know if your above commentary about LNP/Labor was directed towards me or not. In any case, yes these are the issues Labor is committed to improving on and I wish them the best of luck. And by no means would I expect them to address all of these in a few months. It would be a good achievement if they make progress during this term. I'm not pushing any lines, that would be foolish. But I stand by my observation that I'm not seeing people wanting blood in real day-to-day life (outside of the online world).

Not necessarily aimed at you flollo and was not having a go. I just think with all the corruption and mismanagement displayed by previous government with more and more coming to light, that you really would have to be totally oblivious to situation not to be upset. The money they have wasted is our taxpayers money and the previous govt treated it as their own for their own benefit, not the national interest.
Another example as I write...
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/sep/29/australian-taxpay...

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 11:17am
flollo wrote:

@andy-mac I don't know if your above commentary about LNP/Labor was directed towards me or not. In any case, yes these are the issues Labor is committed to improving on and I wish them the best of luck. And by no means would I expect them to address all of these in a few months. It would be a good achievement if they make progress during this term. I'm not pushing any lines, that would be foolish. But I stand by my observation that I'm not seeing people wanting blood in real day-to-day life (outside of the online world).

@flollo , what do you think I meant when I stated “ the public want blood “ ? It was not supposed to be taken literally . Surveys were taken before the election on what issues people were concerned about and corruption rated highly. Some like indo d don’t really see corruption as a problem and treat it as though it’s just part of politics and everyone does it so it’s ok. I hear you when you say you don’t experience people talking about it in your world. Social media platforms like Twitter are a place for people to vent their frustrations and anger at the corruption that has been obviously happening . Australian has slipped from 7th to 18th under the previous government In corruption ratings . https://tradingeconomics.com/australia/corruption-rank By me saying “ the public want blood “ I meant that the public wanted corruption addressed and dealt with with the harshess penalties applied. It may not be the number one issue at the moment but it certainly is an issue of importance to some of us .

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 1:27pm

C8-C4-FC73-C0-CA-4-C11-851-C-E2-A4-CA0082-F8

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flollo Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 2:41pm

Ok, let me elaborate a bit more. For example, the crew that walked around in anti-wax/mandates (whatever they are) protest with Dan Andrews gallows wanted blood. They were very explicit about it. I don't even remember their requirements (did they even have any?) but I do remember the gallows. So they wanted Dan Andrews' blood and they marched the streets to get it. Similarly, families were broken on this wax/freedom issue and I noticed deep, extreme polarisation in my immediate surroundings. People felt threatened and they wanted someone's head chopped off to feel safe. These people are in minority and I definitely don't share their views but we need to somehow live together. I definitely noticed their frustration, anger, and desire for blood. And it's such a difficult problem to resolve.

So, in this scenario, I would say that people (a minority) wanted blood. 'Wanting blood' can lead to extreme polarisation (as evidenced) as it divides people into those who want blood and those who don't. So, it needs to be used sparingly and as a last resort.

On the other side, wanting things done to a higher standard is good and it's not the same as wanting blood. That's one of the strengths of this society - we always want things to progress to higher standards. And yes, on most of the issues being discussed we want them to be better - ICAC, climate change, health etc.. And when I talk to people they express their desires for better outcomes. That is absolutely the case. But do they want someone's head chopped off to get there? Absolutely not. Are there families broken up on these issues? No.

So I wouldn't be using terms like wanting blood unless that is absolutely the case. It can create problems that are worse than the original ones intended to be fixed. People can disagree with me on this but this is where I currently stand based on the observations of my immediate surroundings.

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 3:26pm

@flollo , thanks for responding . Agreed it was a poor choice of words on my behalf , really didn’t expect others to take it like you did but there ya go . Maybe I should have just said “throw the bloody book at them “

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andy-mac Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 3:55pm
flollo wrote:

Ok, let me elaborate a bit more. For example, the crew that walked around in anti-wax/mandates (whatever they are) protest with Dan Andrews gallows wanted blood. They were very explicit about it. I don't even remember their requirements (did they even have any?) but I do remember the gallows. So they wanted Dan Andrews' blood and they marched the streets to get it. Similarly, families were broken on this wax/freedom issue and I noticed deep, extreme polarisation in my immediate surroundings. People felt threatened and they wanted someone's head chopped off to feel safe. These people are in minority and I definitely don't share their views but we need to somehow live together. I definitely noticed their frustration, anger, and desire for blood. And it's such a difficult problem to resolve.

So, in this scenario, I would say that people (a minority) wanted blood. 'Wanting blood' can lead to extreme polarisation (as evidenced) as it divides people into those who want blood and those who don't. So, it needs to be used sparingly and as a last resort.

On the other side, wanting things done to a higher standard is good and it's not the same as wanting blood. That's one of the strengths of this society - we always want things to progress to higher standards. And yes, on most of the issues being discussed we want them to be better - ICAC, climate change, health etc.. And when I talk to people they express their desires for better outcomes. That is absolutely the case. But do they want someone's head chopped off to get there? Absolutely not. Are there families broken up on these issues? No.

So I wouldn't be using terms like wanting blood unless that is absolutely the case. It can create problems that are worse than the original ones intended to be fixed. People can disagree with me on this but this is where I currently stand based on the observations of my immediate surroundings.

If a politician on either side of politics has been shown to break law with ICAC, then they should be receiving same consequence, jail if appropriate as any other citizen....

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 4:18pm

I think you’ll find that gallows was a theatrical device.

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 5:28pm

OK Guy Smiley and Co…..here’s your indisputable proof that the ALP are shits with not a single concern for anything beyond accomodating corporations. The Australian public matters not beyond how far they can be reamed before they expire.

If you don’t understand what this means then please ask. This is the biggest betrayal by an Australian government of all time.

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2022/09/albos-cowards-lock-in-immense-e...

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 5:29pm

Hard to exaggerate the scale and scope of negative effect this will have on Australia.

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Supafreak Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 6:01pm

@DSDS , so is the article basically saying gas will be more than 3 times the current price ? Sounds like political suicide.

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flollo Thursday, 29 Sep 2022 at 6:02pm
andy-mac wrote:
flollo wrote:

Ok, let me elaborate a bit more. For example, the crew that walked around in anti-wax/mandates (whatever they are) protest with Dan Andrews gallows wanted blood. They were very explicit about it. I don't even remember their requirements (did they even have any?) but I do remember the gallows. So they wanted Dan Andrews' blood and they marched the streets to get it. Similarly, families were broken on this wax/freedom issue and I noticed deep, extreme polarisation in my immediate surroundings. People felt threatened and they wanted someone's head chopped off to feel safe. These people are in minority and I definitely don't share their views but we need to somehow live together. I definitely noticed their frustration, anger, and desire for blood. And it's such a difficult problem to resolve.

So, in this scenario, I would say that people (a minority) wanted blood. 'Wanting blood' can lead to extreme polarisation (as evidenced) as it divides people into those who want blood and those who don't. So, it needs to be used sparingly and as a last resort.

On the other side, wanting things done to a higher standard is good and it's not the same as wanting blood. That's one of the strengths of this society - we always want things to progress to higher standards. And yes, on most of the issues being discussed we want them to be better - ICAC, climate change, health etc.. And when I talk to people they express their desires for better outcomes. That is absolutely the case. But do they want someone's head chopped off to get there? Absolutely not. Are there families broken up on these issues? No.

So I wouldn't be using terms like wanting blood unless that is absolutely the case. It can create problems that are worse than the original ones intended to be fixed. People can disagree with me on this but this is where I currently stand based on the observations of my immediate surroundings.

If a politician on either side of politics has been shown to break law with ICAC, then they should be receiving same consequence, jail if appropriate as any other citizen....

Absolutely. And I’m quite happy that Labor is following on their promise to set something up and get things moving. It doesn’t need to be perfect, it’s version 1.0 that will get enhanced in the future. It’s pretty rare for anything in life to be perfect for the first time. So yeah, good time to be alive, I’m happy rather than angry. I might be angry with what they find in the future but I’ll leave that for the future, haha.

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indo-dreaming Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 8:51am
andy-mac wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
flollo wrote:

Maybe. I do live a pretty average, boring life. Three kids, sports, local public school…I don’t drink alcohol so no drinking in pubs with mates etc. I mainly interact with people through work, uni connections, kids birthday and sports, family gatherings, neighbours chats…I don’t know, everyone seems to be flat out busy and not have the time to think about things too much. Yeah, there are things pissing people off but wanting blood? That’s a pretty big call, I’m not seeing it but I could be wrong I guess.

If there is such thing as normal you are it (although most would enjoy an odd beer or wine), but you would be in the majority.

It's a very small minority that have views of "wanting blood" for anyone no matter what side of politics you are on.

Most people right now are thinking more about things like rising living cost, price of petrol, interest rates etc

Yep, the LNP really left a mess to be cleaned up! Labor's fault they haven't fixed 10 years of neglect, corruption, and incompetence in less than 6 months.
If ya not angry, then you haven't been paying attention. They LNP fingered Australia and Australians, but hopefully karma in the form of an ICAC is coming to sort them out ...
If ya still pushing line of LNP being better economic managers, then sorry to say you are ignorant of the historic data and living in a delusion....

Look mate we will never agree, and you will never be happy no matter what, even if you moved to some socialist utopia (utopia in your head) you are basically just a Jordie's zombie, he says one thing and you spit it out here.

The reality is in the last 30 years we have gone through one of the most prosperous periods in Australian history by any kind of measure and only just over 6 years of those 30 years have been under Labor.

Early 90s saw us go from a true recession (under Labor)with super high interest rates and super high unemployment to an amazing period of growth and opportunity.(under LNP)

Im certain you are old enough to remember what this period and recession was like for everyday Australians.

We went from a government(Labor) that was in debt to a government(LNP) that saw us go into surplus which was the first time since the early 70s and hadn't happen again and unlikely too possible ever happen again.

Then we then had the global finical crisis, border control problems(still a big current political issue in USA & Europe) and terrorism.

So how did we fair through these issues?

As much as i cant stand Krudd, credit where credit is due, while many experts say we would have come through it unscathed thanks to our strong economy and stricter lending practices he did the right think with stimulus packages it was a good safe measure, even if it did see us go back into debt.

Krudd completely fucked up on border control though which has cost us billions and been a political mess with what to do with those in offshore detention, luckily LNP did the hard work on border control and its not an issue anymore because we have a system in place, again this is unlike the USA and Europe where its still a mess and as we saw recently even saw a right wing government elected in Italy.

Terrorism, all Aust governments have done an amazing job on this issue preventing any real attacks, while USA, UK, Europe and countries in Asia like Indo and India saw real attacks and then off course NZ had a big gunman shooting that would be unlikely to happen in Aust these days because Howard changed gun laws.

Next major issue Covid, again no matter how you look at things we faired better than most of the world, low infection/death rate, health system under much pressure but didnt collapse, one of the highest vax rates in the world, we were predicated to go into a recession some saying even a depression and so called experts predicting housing prices to plummet and building industry collapses, instead we technically went into a recession for a brief period bounced back and housing and building industry boomed.

If you want to throw Climate change in there as an issue, despite being a country historically pretty much reliant on coal and natural resources that equals high emissions with a high immigration rate constantly adding more demand to energy every year.

We are doing pretty good compared to he majority of the world, emissions are falling, and per capita we lead the world for solar and fourth for wind generation and up there for storage.

We havent done good as a country in the last 30 years, we have done fucking amazing, anyone that thinks otherwise has completely unrealistic expectations and is living in la la land.

The future?

Well it hasn't looked so uncertain for a long time most of the uncertainty is fuelled by global influences and all the issues we are seeing, inflation, rising interest rates to curb inflation, energy security issues, housing and rent affordability are also being seen in not only developed countries but developing countries all around the world.

You might be confident of Labor and Albo being in power during this time of uncertainty, but sorry I'm not.

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Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 9:00am

How Australia blew its future gas supplies No one went hungry at our place.

My father killed our meat, grew our vegetables and was a champion at bartering. A leg of lamb was worth a tub of crayfish to fishermen down the coast. My mother always had chooks, and there were warm eggs collected every morning. The old boy would snort at the idea of selling a paddock of sheep or cattle without first selecting a fat lamb or a fine steer for the table and the freezer. When Mum took eggs to market, there were plenty put aside for our frypan.

It doesn't bear contemplating, now they're gone, what they might have thought about a country that allowed its entire store of gas to be flogged off without first setting aside enough of the stuff to ensure the nation's power grid continued humming and that consumers could afford to turn on a light switch. They'd have been plain flummoxed to know that in the excitement of hawking off Australia's natural resources to China, the initial sale contract set a bargain price that couldn't be negotiated upwards.

But that is what Australia's governments allowed.

It's been a scandal for too many years, and no recent government can escape blame.

I was in the Canberra press gallery in 2002 when prime minister John Howard called a press conference to announce, with the widest grin he could manage, that after years of negotiation, Australia's mining interests had pulled off a $25 billion deal to supply China with liquefied natural gas. It was, crowed Howard, Australia's biggest single export deal. Ever.

"Needless to say, I am absolutely delighted. It is so good for Australia," he said. "This is the kind of outcome that will underpin the economic strength of this country." It was, he said, growing more expansive and breathless by the minute, "a gold medal performance". It wasn't, though.

By 2015, it was being called the worst deal ever done. The Chinese by then were paying about one-third the price for Australian gas that Australian consumers themselves had to pay ... and they were guaranteed to continue doing so.

The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.

Howard, visiting China in 2007, was pedalling as fast as his little legs would take him from the idea that his government should take responsibility for the fiasco. It wasn't for his government to interfere in pricing. No sir! "I would never encourage the idea that governments should negotiate LNG prices," he said. "At no stage was the Australian government directly involved in pricing issues in relation to the $25 billion contract."

A few months later, in the dying days of his government, Howard was back in China to witness the signing of a new, $35 billion liquid natural gas deal. The Chinese were so thrilled they made a gift of two giant pandas to Adelaide's zoo. The deals kept coming after Australia changed governments.

The Labor administrations of Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard were only too pleased to keep announcing huge exports of LNG to China, Japan and South Korea. The gas price for most of these deals was linked to the price of oil. All along, not one of these governments ever thought to require exporters to set aside part of their bounty for the use of Australian consumers. The whole thing was up to the market. And the market, as always, couldn't give a stuff about who paid, so long as payments kept flowing from somewhere and no one in power was demanding anything different.

Which, with Australia's energy market currently suffering policy paralysis, is why Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull has been forced to arm-wrestle big gas-producing companies into agreeing this week to provide enough supply for the Australian market to avert a predicted shortfall - with consequent price hikes - over the next two years.

These are, of course, the same companies that previously expressed outrage that a government would require them to consider the needs of the nation from which they extract the gas in the first place. These are the same class of geniuses that have been praised for their "gold standard" behaviour even when they negotiated contracts that, if they'd been small-town snake-oil salesmen rather than multinational big shots, would have seen them ridden out of town on a rail.

Ah, but now they've been threatened by a government that previously abhorred market intervention, they've suddenly found extra gas from where there was none before and, glory be, they're promising to improve transparency about how they put a price on the stuff.

Yet things remain so dire that there is talk of importing gas, either the Australian stuff on sale so cheaply overseas, or supplies from one of our competitors, Qatar.

Back on the farm, our parents, who knew how to provide without running out of anything, would have been scandalised almost beyond words. https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 11:47am
Supafreak wrote:

How Australia blew its future gas supplies No one went hungry at our place.

My father killed our meat, grew our vegetables and was a champion at bartering. A leg of lamb was worth a tub of crayfish to fishermen down the coast. My mother always had chooks, and there were warm eggs collected every morning. The old boy would snort at the idea of selling a paddock of sheep or cattle without first selecting a fat lamb or a fine steer for the table and the freezer. When Mum took eggs to market, there were plenty put aside for our frypan.

It doesn't bear contemplating, now they're gone, what they might have thought about a country that allowed its entire store of gas to be flogged off without first setting aside enough of the stuff to ensure the nation's power grid continued humming and that consumers could afford to turn on a light switch. They'd have been plain flummoxed to know that in the excitement of hawking off Australia's natural resources to China, the initial sale contract set a bargain price that couldn't be negotiated upwards.

But that is what Australia's governments allowed.

It's been a scandal for too many years, and no recent government can escape blame.

I was in the Canberra press gallery in 2002 when prime minister John Howard called a press conference to announce, with the widest grin he could manage, that after years of negotiation, Australia's mining interests had pulled off a $25 billion deal to supply China with liquefied natural gas. It was, crowed Howard, Australia's biggest single export deal. Ever.

"Needless to say, I am absolutely delighted. It is so good for Australia," he said. "This is the kind of outcome that will underpin the economic strength of this country." It was, he said, growing more expansive and breathless by the minute, "a gold medal performance". It wasn't, though.

By 2015, it was being called the worst deal ever done. The Chinese by then were paying about one-third the price for Australian gas that Australian consumers themselves had to pay ... and they were guaranteed to continue doing so.

The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.

Howard, visiting China in 2007, was pedalling as fast as his little legs would take him from the idea that his government should take responsibility for the fiasco. It wasn't for his government to interfere in pricing. No sir! "I would never encourage the idea that governments should negotiate LNG prices," he said. "At no stage was the Australian government directly involved in pricing issues in relation to the $25 billion contract."

A few months later, in the dying days of his government, Howard was back in China to witness the signing of a new, $35 billion liquid natural gas deal. The Chinese were so thrilled they made a gift of two giant pandas to Adelaide's zoo. The deals kept coming after Australia changed governments.

The Labor administrations of Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard were only too pleased to keep announcing huge exports of LNG to China, Japan and South Korea. The gas price for most of these deals was linked to the price of oil. All along, not one of these governments ever thought to require exporters to set aside part of their bounty for the use of Australian consumers. The whole thing was up to the market. And the market, as always, couldn't give a stuff about who paid, so long as payments kept flowing from somewhere and no one in power was demanding anything different.

Which, with Australia's energy market currently suffering policy paralysis, is why Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull has been forced to arm-wrestle big gas-producing companies into agreeing this week to provide enough supply for the Australian market to avert a predicted shortfall - with consequent price hikes - over the next two years.

These are, of course, the same companies that previously expressed outrage that a government would require them to consider the needs of the nation from which they extract the gas in the first place. These are the same class of geniuses that have been praised for their "gold standard" behaviour even when they negotiated contracts that, if they'd been small-town snake-oil salesmen rather than multinational big shots, would have seen them ridden out of town on a rail.

Ah, but now they've been threatened by a government that previously abhorred market intervention, they've suddenly found extra gas from where there was none before and, glory be, they're promising to improve transparency about how they put a price on the stuff.

Yet things remain so dire that there is talk of importing gas, either the Australian stuff on sale so cheaply overseas, or supplies from one of our competitors, Qatar.

Back on the farm, our parents, who knew how to provide without running out of anything, would have been scandalised almost beyond words. https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

Fark. :(

Maybe time to nationalise industry or change terms of contracts. Sovereign risk after submarine fiasco might not be such a factor. It's Australia's gas.
¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠⊙⁠_⁠ʖ⁠⊙⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

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Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 11:58am

Little Johnny must be so proud.

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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 12:28pm
Supafreak wrote:

Little Johnny must be so proud.

Such a wonderful legacy!

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:02pm

WTF does John Howard have to do with any of this?

Albanese and King just signed off on a Heads of agreement which now sees the East coast has price at $80/GJ. With a stroke of their pens they could’ve implemented the exact same Domestic gas reservation model employed by Western Australia which is providing WA with gas at $4.50/ GJ.

That’s trillions of dollars worth of Australian,only being syphoned by foreign multinationals who pay zero tax. China- Australia’s strategic competitor/ threat- is getting 70% of our gas whilst Australians go without.

This isn’t just a direct rape of Australian wealth, the scale of which is almost impossibility to conceive, it’s also an incredible inflationary burden on every Australian commercial and domestic activity. The price of gas dictates the price of electricity for every household, bakery, factory, farm and office. The price of gas dictates the price of fertilisers for agricultural, the cost of food and water supply and everything else.

Manufacturing will cease. Households already struggling with mortgages and cooked wages , will have cost of electricity destroy their ability to survive.

And the, .the icing on the cake of this ALP corruption and ineptitude , is the fact that the government will then borrow billions of dollars to subsidise the cost of electricity which will come out of taxpayer’s pockets and at the expense of our health, welfare and education sectors as well as every other government provided social service.

Fuck the ALP . Fuck Albo. Fuck Madeline King.

Absolute pack of cunts.

And then King will do the Martin Ferguson post-politics stroll into her board positions in the energy industry, which is her reward for arse raping Australia. Big round of applause for Maddy.

And while all this and much, much more unfolds, you get utter clowns such as this bleating their partisan party boosterism rubbish. They need to be thrown in a burning dumpster alongside Albo and King:

GuySmiley wrote:
“I see the usual naysayers, doomsayers, conspiracy theorists and devotees of self flagellation are again out salivating with excitement about how the Labor government has sold out the country all in 4 months.”

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velocityjohnno Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:31pm

tbf nothing has changed since my Aussie grandfather was slaving all day selling his cane for 4 pence a tonne, then buying at great markup the sugar products after they'd been refined offshore and re-imported so Nana could bake a cake.

After a while you become hardened to the stupidity of it all

You want to change things? Value add, yourself.

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Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:34pm
Supafreak wrote:

@DSDS , so is the article basically saying gas will be more than 3 times the current price ? Sounds like political suicide.

@DSDS , I asked you this yesterday , also I can’t find anything from other news sources which seems a bit strange , why the silence ?

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:50pm

East coast under the newHeads of Agreement by ALP will be paying net back price (international price minus transport costs). Western Australia has domestic gas reservation.

East coast price = $80/ GJ ( todays price rates)
WA price =$4/Gj

You think it’s strange that the MSM isn’t broadcasting the Government corruption? Lol. They’ve got covid Wuflu isolation mandate stories to fill up the first three pages instead.

Here’s the SMH with their extensive one article coverage of the biggest rort in Australia’s history

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/gas-giants-government-strike-dom...

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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:53pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

WTF does John Howard have to do with any of this?

Albanese and King just signed off on a Heads of agreement which now sees the East coast has price at $80/GJ. With a stroke of their pens they could’ve implemented the exact same Domestic gas reservation model employed by Western Australia which is providing WA with gas at $4.50/ GJ.

That’s trillions of dollars worth of Australian,only being syphoned by foreign multinationals who pay zero tax. China- Australia’s strategic competitor/ threat- is getting 70% of our gas whilst Australians go without.

This isn’t just a direct rape of Australian wealth, the scale of which is almost impossibility to conceive, it’s also an incredible inflationary burden on every Australian commercial and domestic activity. The price of gas dictates the price of electricity for every household, bakery, factory, farm and office. The price of gas dictates the price of fertilisers for agricultural, the cost of food and water supply and everything else.

Manufacturing will cease. Households already struggling with mortgages and cooked wages , will have cost of electricity destroy their ability to survive.

And the, .the icing on the cake of this ALP corruption and ineptitude , is the fact that the government will then borrow billions of dollars to subsidise the cost of electricity which will come out of taxpayer’s pockets and at the expense of our health, welfare and education sectors as well as every other government provided social service.

Fuck the ALP . Fuck Albo. Fuck Madeline King.

Absolute pack of cunts.

And then King will do the Martin Ferguson post-politics stroll into her board positions in the energy industry, which is her reward for arse raping Australia. Big round of applause for Maddy.

And while all this and much, much more unfolds, you get utter clowns such as this bleating their partisan party boosterism rubbish. They need to be thrown in a burning dumpster alongside Albo and King:

GuySmiley wrote:
“I see the usual naysayers, doomsayers, conspiracy theorists and devotees of self flagellation are again out salivating with excitement about how the Labor government has sold out the country all in 4 months.”

My take is that Howard set up initial deal where this situation started? You may be correct or not, I don't know whether Albo could have changed the deal with strike of pen? I'm guessing it's a little more complex than that. Probably a lot of ramifications that would stem from such an action. I don't know, but yes it does seem we are being taken for ride.
I wrote in my previous post though that Australia should be taking a serious look at situation such as changing contracts or tax set up as I have in past.

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Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:53pm

So it’s already moved from $23 to $80 ?

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:58pm

Here’s the SMH article:

Major gas producers have promised to offer all available LNG supply to Australian buyers before shipping it overseas in a deal with the federal government to prevent a predicted shortfall on the east coast next year.

But Australia’s gas buyers are disappointed the agreement fails to address the soaring gas price, warning high energy costs are pushing some manufacturers to breaking point.

The competition watchdog last month forecast a shortage of 56 petajoules in 2023 – about 10 per cent of domestic demand – escalating concerns over rising costs for gas-reliant manufacturers, and prompting Resources Minister Madeleine King to threaten unprecedented export controls if the industry failed to boost domestic supply.

Queensland producers Origin Energy-backed APLNG, Shell’s QCLNG joint venture and Santos’ GLNG committed on Thursday to offer the 157 petajoules that won’t be tied up in export contracts to the domestic market before overseas clients over the next 12 months.

King, who had renewed warnings exporters would face penalties in recent days, hailed the deal as a win, saying it included several measures that would “put downward pressure on prices” for local gas buyers.

The agreement requires producers to provide more information to the market on the amount of gas produced and volumes available at any given time.

LNG companies have also committed to offering gas contracts to local buyers at no more than the cost of the export spot market less the price of processing and shipping, known as the netback price.

“This agreement will ensure Australians continue to have access to secure and reliable gas,” King said.
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Australia’s trading partners, which are grappling with gas shortages due to a global energy crunch caused by a ban on Russian exports, have been pressuring the government to ensure export contracts are not disrupted by domestic policy.

King said the heads of agreement ensured LNG companies’ export contracts were not affected.

But Andrew Richards, the chief executive of Energy Users Association of Australia, which represents gas users such as food processors and brickmakers, said the deal “ignored the elephant in the room, which is price”.

“It seems to further entrench the link between international spot prices and domestic gas prices, which at the moment are trading at up to 600 per cent above the cost of production,” he said.

King said she was “not willing to see any business close” due to gas price pressures, arguing the deal would provide more price certainty for buyers that had been holding out for government price caps.

“We are in an open international market. We made this country face the world in the 1980s and it has been responsible for a great deal of prosperity. The flip side of that is when there is an international price crisis like now, we do get those knock-on effects,” she said.

“I expect manufacturers now to be able to start negotiations that they might have been putting off [due to their] somewhat unfounded expectation that there might have been a very low price cap put on what is an open market and has been for some time.”

Australian Petroleum Production and Exploration Association chief executive Samantha McCulloch said the deal confirmed the LNG producers’ commitment to the domestic market and avoided the government imposing export controls.

“The industry has always been committed to delivering reliable and competitively priced gas supplies to the domestic market,” she said.

The government is still reviewing its power to impose export controls and has left open the prospect of creating a trigger mechanism that could be pulled sooner than every 12 months if the gas companies fail to honour their agreement. Export controls can be imposed under the current Australian Domestic Gas Security Mechanism, whose rules King is updating.

Wentworth MP Allegra Spender said on Wednesday LNG companies had held the Australian market to ransom by refusing to offer gas at a fair price and urged the government to impose price controls.

“The answer isn’t more fossil fuel projects. The government must consider domestic price caps and a super-profits tax,” she tweeted.

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 4:59pm
andy-mac wrote:
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

WTF does John Howard have to do with any of this?

Albanese and King just signed off on a Heads of agreement which now sees the East coast has price at $80/GJ. With a stroke of their pens they could’ve implemented the exact same Domestic gas reservation model employed by Western Australia which is providing WA with gas at $4.50/ GJ.

That’s trillions of dollars worth of Australian,only being syphoned by foreign multinationals who pay zero tax. China- Australia’s strategic competitor/ threat- is getting 70% of our gas whilst Australians go without.

This isn’t just a direct rape of Australian wealth, the scale of which is almost impossibility to conceive, it’s also an incredible inflationary burden on every Australian commercial and domestic activity. The price of gas dictates the price of electricity for every household, bakery, factory, farm and office. The price of gas dictates the price of fertilisers for agricultural, the cost of food and water supply and everything else.

Manufacturing will cease. Households already struggling with mortgages and cooked wages , will have cost of electricity destroy their ability to survive.

And the, .the icing on the cake of this ALP corruption and ineptitude , is the fact that the government will then borrow billions of dollars to subsidise the cost of electricity which will come out of taxpayer’s pockets and at the expense of our health, welfare and education sectors as well as every other government provided social service.

Fuck the ALP . Fuck Albo. Fuck Madeline King.

Absolute pack of cunts.

And then King will do the Martin Ferguson post-politics stroll into her board positions in the energy industry, which is her reward for arse raping Australia. Big round of applause for Maddy.

And while all this and much, much more unfolds, you get utter clowns such as this bleating their partisan party boosterism rubbish. They need to be thrown in a burning dumpster alongside Albo and King:

GuySmiley wrote:
“I see the usual naysayers, doomsayers, conspiracy theorists and devotees of self flagellation are again out salivating with excitement about how the Labor government has sold out the country all in 4 months.”

My take is that Howard set up initial deal where this situation started? You may be correct or not, I don't know whether Albo could have changed the deal with strike of pen? I'm guessing it's a little more complex than that. Probably a lot of ramifications that would stem from such an action. I don't know, but yes it does seem we are being taken for ride.
I wrote in my previous post though that Australia should be taking a serious look at situation such as changing contracts or tax set up as I have in past.

There’s no ifs, buts or maybes…Australia is being rorted, raped and robbed. ALP are overseeing it all. Nothing to do with Howard.

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 5:04pm

+
Does Mad King even know what she’s done?
By Houses and Holes , Macrobusiness

The MSM is full of celebration today for the triumph of Mad King, basically just reproduced from her press release:

Australians will be paying historically high gas bills for years despite the government striking a deal with major LNG producers to prevent domestic supply shortfalls, with experts warning the early closure of coal-fired power plants would put the stability of the electricity grid at risk.

Resources Minister Madeleine King warned on Thursday that gas prices would not return to pre-Ukraine war levels of less than $10 a gigajoule despite LNG ­exporters agreeing to provide an extra 157 petajoules for the domestic market in 2023.

With the government facing pressure from the Greens and ­environmental groups over new fossil fuel projects, Ms King also cast doubt over the future of new gas developments in Australia and backed greater investment in ­renewables to deliver the nation’s future energy needs.

Announcing a deal with east coast LNG exporters to shore up domestic supply next year, Ms King said the heads of agreement – signed by Australia Pacific LNG, QGC and Gladstone LNG – would ensure “Australians continue to have access to secure and reliable gas”.

“Given the agreement means the projected shortfall will be avoided, I am satisfied I do not need to take steps to activate the Australian Domestic Gas Security Mechanism,” she said.

She added there was no doubt that prices were “very unlikely to return to the low points of like $6 or $8 or even $10”.

“I do expect with the increased supply that there will be downward pressure on prices,” she said.

Well, Mad King, you’re going to be disappointed, and the fact that you say prices are going to fall strongly suggests that you have no idea what you’ve actually done.

The added supply is material and would lower prices if it were definitely going to remain in the east coast market. But there is no reason for it to do so.

As the new ADGSM stands, the cartel only has to offer the gas at LNG netback prices, so it will be offered at LNG netback prices. There is no competition to deliver any price falls.

That price is today at…wait for it…$80Gj (up from today’s $20Gj):

No manufacturer is going to pay that price. They will go under. Electricity producers will have to pay and the NEM will once again be suspended by all kinds of gaming as gentailers try to limit the damage to margins with power prices back to $600, $700 or $800MWh.

At some point, it is going to dawn upon state governments what has just happened and they will move in with subsidies for businesses and households. So, Australia will be borrowing heavily to subsidise the energy bills that fund the energy cartels. Another outrage that has already begun:

“The new Gas Heads of Agreement agreed to by the Federal Government may avoid a shortfall of supply but leaves east coast Australian industry facing back-breaking gas prices for the foreseeable future,” Innes Willox, chief executive of the national employer association, AiGroup, said today.

“The agreement is crushingly disappointing for Australian industry reliant on gas to make the products that Australians need. As they roll off existing gas contracts, Australian manufacturers of bricks, chemicals, plastics, paper, aluminium, steel, fertlisers, cosmetics, gloves and masks will increasingly face crippling energy bills they will have to pass onto consumers.

“The Heads of Agreement seeks to ensure that local prices are no higher than international levels. But there is nothing in it that will see local prices fall below international levels either. In the wake of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, the cutoff of Russian energy exports to Europe and Europe’s desperate efforts to secure replacement gas around the world, international gas prices have soared to unprecedented levels. Eastern Australia is completely exposed to those prices. Our wealth of gas production and our long-standing bipartisan national energy policies provide no shield against them whatsoever.

“The ACCC export parity metric recognised in yesterday’s Heads of Agreement currently indicates local spot gas prices of between AUD$60 and AUD$70 per gigajoule over the next year. That would be around 20 times the average price before East Coast exports of Liquefied Natural Gas began, and around 8 times the previously expected export parity range.

“Most gas is bought on longer contracts, not spot, and those prices will be somewhat lower. But even so, we are looking at serious and deeply painful increases in the cost of many basic products, of heating homes in winter, and of much of the firming capacity on which our electricity system currently relies.

“The Government’s ambitions for managing inflation, growing industry and transitioning to clean energy are threatened by these gas price rises.

“The agreement may have sidestepped the gas supply shortages for 2023 foreshadowed by the ACCC. This is welcome. However, more risks open up later this decade, and more action will be needed both on supply and on demand efficiency and substitution to respond.

“High Australian gas prices have now been locked in. As a result, the Government will need to take the kinds of expensive but urgent steps we are seeing in Europe to financially support energy users – to help them weather the storm and reduce their exposure to the costs of gas. That will not be cheap. The costs of inaction will be higher,” Mr Willox said.

I expect that the RBA will also be forced to “look through” the utility bill shock because not doing so will destroy the economy entirely. The inflation spillovers will still be a big problem.

I have no idea what’s going through Mad King’s head, nor the bureaucrats that allowed her to sign this Australian economic death warrant, but the new ADGSM agreement explicitly spells out only that the Evil Gas Cartel has to make the gas available at LNG netback.

And now that Mad King has triumphantly secured Australia’s own gas at prices that nobody can afford through a laborious policy process, the government will be all the more hesitant about revisiting the issue.

In the final irony, there won’t be a gas shortage because demand will collapse with the economy.

andy-mac's picture
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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 5:07pm

Since I've been outed as the Jordies Zombie!!

https://m.

andy-mac's picture
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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 5:09pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:
andy-mac wrote:
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

WTF does John Howard have to do with any of this?

Albanese and King just signed off on a Heads of agreement which now sees the East coast has price at $80/GJ. With a stroke of their pens they could’ve implemented the exact same Domestic gas reservation model employed by Western Australia which is providing WA with gas at $4.50/ GJ.

That’s trillions of dollars worth of Australian,only being syphoned by foreign multinationals who pay zero tax. China- Australia’s strategic competitor/ threat- is getting 70% of our gas whilst Australians go without.

This isn’t just a direct rape of Australian wealth, the scale of which is almost impossibility to conceive, it’s also an incredible inflationary burden on every Australian commercial and domestic activity. The price of gas dictates the price of electricity for every household, bakery, factory, farm and office. The price of gas dictates the price of fertilisers for agricultural, the cost of food and water supply and everything else.

Manufacturing will cease. Households already struggling with mortgages and cooked wages , will have cost of electricity destroy their ability to survive.

And the, .the icing on the cake of this ALP corruption and ineptitude , is the fact that the government will then borrow billions of dollars to subsidise the cost of electricity which will come out of taxpayer’s pockets and at the expense of our health, welfare and education sectors as well as every other government provided social service.

Fuck the ALP . Fuck Albo. Fuck Madeline King.

Absolute pack of cunts.

And then King will do the Martin Ferguson post-politics stroll into her board positions in the energy industry, which is her reward for arse raping Australia. Big round of applause for Maddy.

And while all this and much, much more unfolds, you get utter clowns such as this bleating their partisan party boosterism rubbish. They need to be thrown in a burning dumpster alongside Albo and King:

GuySmiley wrote:
“I see the usual naysayers, doomsayers, conspiracy theorists and devotees of self flagellation are again out salivating with excitement about how the Labor government has sold out the country all in 4 months.”

My take is that Howard set up initial deal where this situation started? You may be correct or not, I don't know whether Albo could have changed the deal with strike of pen? I'm guessing it's a little more complex than that. Probably a lot of ramifications that would stem from such an action. I don't know, but yes it does seem we are being taken for ride.
I wrote in my previous post though that Australia should be taking a serious look at situation such as changing contracts or tax set up as I have in past.

There’s no ifs, buts or maybes…Australia is being rorted, raped and robbed. ALP are overseeing it all. Nothing to do with Howard.

Nonsense, if a sovereign government signs agreement, they are bound to it. Howard signed agreement... Yes we are being robbed but has a lot to do with Howard. Darwin Port was another smart idea if Howard govt....

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 5:36pm

Bullshit. Our government can do whatever it wants. The ALP is too corrupt and spineless to disobey the energy corporations. Nothing to do with Howard. Stop it with the rubbish distractions from culpability.

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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 5:56pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

Bullshit. Our government can do whatever it wants. The ALP is too corrupt and spineless to disobey the energy corporations. Nothing to do with Howard. Stop it with the rubbish distractions from culpability.

Yeah maybe they can do whatever they want, but unfortunately they have no influence over the consequences that may occur. It's not as black and white or as simplistic as you make out.
Howard signed agreements as leader of
a sovereign government, so yeah nah there would be consequences. Whether these would be worth risking I have NFI.....

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:09pm

What risks?

Risks to Australia’s reputation as a trading nation ? Lol.
There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. There’s not a company on Earth which would consider a Dom gas agreement as indicative of Australia as a less secure and appealing investment destination. On the contrary the fact Australia could have the developed world’s cheapest gas and electricity means we would be an incredibly attractive investment destination.

There is no downside for an Australian Dom gas beyond a threat to the individuals who make up the ALP party and the profits of a few tax avoiding foreign owned companies.

The upside to a Dom gas reservation is incalculabley large.

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andy-mac's picture
andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:23pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

What risks?

Risks to Australia’s reputation as a trading nation ? Lol.
There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. There’s not a company on Earth which would consider a Dom gas agreement as indicative of Australia as a less secure and appealing investment destination. On the contrary the fact Australia could have the developed world’s cheapest gas and electricity means we would be an incredibly attractive investment destination.

There is no downside for an Australian Dom gas beyond a threat to the individuals who make up the ALP party and the profits of a few tax avoiding foreign owned companies.

The upside to a Dom gas reservation is incalculabley large.

Ok maybe? I have no idea.... But I reckon there would be consequences other than Australia's reputation.
Don't see how it could be threat to individuals in ALP, reckon if they could nationalise without any negative consequences, it would go down pretty well with electorate and the income would pretty much entrench any govt for years....
Are you saying that members of ALP are doing this for purely personal economic reasons after being in a position of power for less than 6 months? Geez quick operators....!

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Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:26pm

“There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. “ ………….so howard pandering to China was ok because …………… The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.
https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:35pm

When this topic comes up there's always an idea thrown about that we get nothing in return for gas sold OS, which just isn't true even when companies dont pay company tax they still pay a shit load in royalties and rents(hence why dont pay company tax), the income paid to government state or federal is said to be about 5 billion a year (not sure if that includes payroll tax), and the oil & gas industries contribution through employment, supporting other industries and facilitating regional growth, was measured by AGIT (Australian Gas Industry Trust) at almost $500 billion a year.

Hence why both LNP and Labor have encouraged foreign investment in the industry.

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AndyM Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:36pm

"encouraged foreign investment"

That's one term for it.

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:45pm
AndyM wrote:

"encouraged foreign investment"

That's one term for it.

Yeah that's what governments do, they try to encourage foreign companies to invest thats why they even pay them with subsidies for exploration ect.

Because these companies have the choice of investing anywhere in the world, them investing in the industry here returns billions to the government and the economy rather than to another country who have the same natural resources..

DudeSweetDudeSweet's picture
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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:49pm
Supafreak wrote:

“There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. “ ………….so howard pandering to China was ok because …………… The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.
https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

I don’t understand your point Supa. This isn’t a case of ALP vs LNP.

My point is that the ALP should never be given power again. I’ve explained why they are trash. Your bringing up of decades old historical whataboutism only serves to distract from the only message relevant:

Do not ever vote for either major party ….including ALP.

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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:51pm
indo-dreaming wrote:
AndyM wrote:

"encouraged foreign investment"

That's one term for it.

Yeah that's what governments do, they try to encourage foreign companies to invest thats why they even pay them with subsidies for exploration ect.

Because these companies have the choice of investing anywhere in the world, them investing in the industry here returns billions to the government and the economy rather than to another country who have the same natural resources..

Yeah , great point Indo.

These energy companies could’ve instead invested in that other politically and geographically stable developed nation with shit tonnes of natural gas….

Oh, that’s right. No such place fucking exists.

Supafreak's picture
Supafreak's picture
Supafreak Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 6:58pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:
Supafreak wrote:

“There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. “ ………….so howard pandering to China was ok because …………… The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.
https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

I don’t understand your point Supa. This isn’t a case of ALP vs LNP.

My point is that the ALP should never be given power again. I’ve explained why they are trash. Your bringing up of decades old historical whataboutism only serves to distract from the only message relevant:

Do not ever vote for either major party ….including ALP.

My point is that it’s been a fuck up from the start and both parties have contributed. Nobody has ever stepped up to the plate and done a deal that was securing Australia and it’s citizens future for years to come . If Norway can do it why haven’t we ?

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frog Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 7:07pm

Ah, but we doth but complain about such trifles, when those men and women of great standing and insight in the corridors of power of the exeptionals, have almost achieved the huge geopolitical goal over a decade in the making?

In that far off land of splendor, the celebratory cigars are lit and, crisp new gas contracts - at wonderful prices - have been inked.

With the recent nails in the coffin of nordstrom 2 pipeline as the final exclamation mark, European industry and peoples are now closer than ever before from to being free of the frivolous benefits of cheap energy from the tainted east. The empire remains strong. Many nations of the world must embrace the joys of inflation as it flows forth from such momentous events in all its goodness..

It is our great honour to see our vassal leaders set forth to visit the distant land where they are gifted the holy clean white Y fronts to give thanks:

andy-mac's picture
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andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 7:08pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:
Supafreak wrote:

“There’s not a nation on Earth which would voluntarily sell out its own national interests to pander to corporations in the manner Australia’s government just did. “ ………….so howard pandering to China was ok because …………… The Chinese had got the deal of a lifetime because the consortium of Australia's North West Shelf operators hadn't thought to insert a clause into the contract that would raise the price of gas from what was, in 2002, a historically low level.

As world gas prices rose and rose, the price paid by China for what Howard had called "a gold medal performance" stayed at rock bottom. Australia's gas exports of 3 million tonnes a year from that single agreement were contracted to stay at basement prices until 2031.
https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/how-australia-blew-its-future-gas-supplie...

I don’t understand your point Supa. This isn’t a case of ALP vs LNP.

My point is that the ALP should never be given power again. I’ve explained why they are trash. Your bringing up of decades old historical whataboutism only serves to distract from the only message relevant:

Do not ever vote for either major party ….including ALP.

With our preferential voting system, this is kind of impossible. ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯
Yes as Supa mentioned, I agree it is a tragic situation that we never set up a system to protect our resources such as Norway has. But hey they are socialist!!!!

DudeSweetDudeSweet's picture
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DudeSweetDudeSweet Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 7:24pm

We were a social democracy once too.

I don’t remember anyone getting a vote to cripple the system into dysfunction and hand the country over to the whims of corporations.

https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/546503?page=1#comment-855338

andy-mac's picture
andy-mac's picture
andy-mac Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 7:29pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:

We were a social democracy once too.

I don’t remember anyone getting a vote to cripple the system into dysfunction and hand the country over to the whims of corporations.

https://www.swellnet.com/forums/wax/546503?page=1#comment-855338

' cause Gough was tough til he hit the rough,
Uncle Sam and John were quite enough'

Oils.......

indo-dreaming's picture
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indo-dreaming Friday, 30 Sep 2022 at 7:42pm
DudeSweetDudeSweet wrote:
indo-dreaming wrote:
AndyM wrote:

"encouraged foreign investment"

That's one term for it.

Yeah that's what governments do, they try to encourage foreign companies to invest thats why they even pay them with subsidies for exploration ect.

Because these companies have the choice of investing anywhere in the world, them investing in the industry here returns billions to the government and the economy rather than to another country who have the same natural resources..

Yeah , great point Indo.

These energy companies could’ve instead invested in that other politically and geographically stable developed nation with shit tonnes of natural gas….

Oh, that’s right. No such place fucking exists.

According to this there is 50 countries with greater reservers and 3 other countries with the same amount, yes almost all these countries are not developed nations many with issues, which can be a negative but can also be a positive for getting a good price especially through corruption or just low cost of doing business with less hassle jumping through hoops and red tape, so id assume for these companies there is pros and cons they weigh up against many different factors..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_natural_gas_proven_re...