Watch: Renato Hickel on the return of Cloudbreak and turning pro surfing into golf

Stu Nettle picture
Stu Nettle (stunet)
Swellnet Dispatch

Here we go...most times the WSL is harder to get info out of than the KGB. They put the walls up, refuse to answer emails causing an information vacuum that gets filled with scurrilous gossip and innuendo. Then every now and again we get a blast of data that often corresponds with the supposed conspiracy theories being floated. To date, the punters haven't been far off the mark and the same is the case with the latest data breach from WSL HQ.

Once again it's from Renato Hickel and we've got Stephen Allain from Brazil's Moist magazine to thank for it.

The Pay Per View thing? They've been planning it since ASP days.
Contests bankrolled by Less Developed Countries? The Fijian government pulled their support.
Turning surfing into tennis or golf..? Yep, you betcha.

While we gotta admire Renato's candour some elements are worrying, especially using the wavepool to leapfrog into the mainstream, and the tennis and golf thing. Aside from professionals, who really wants that?

Comments

boxright's picture
boxright's picture
boxright Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 10:52am

No-one really wants that yet we all watch the webcasts anyway so why complain?

blindboy's picture
blindboy's picture
blindboy Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 12:40pm

It was one of the great failures of professional surfing that they had so little imagination all they could aspire to was to turn surfing into just another boring mass pastime. To take something that was so intrinsically interesting and was so much about personal expression and aspire to turn it into golf or tennis was profoundly insulting to those of us who had different aspirations. But money talks, so here we are down the track, paddling around our favourite break with fifty people, most of whom would actually be much more productively engaged playing golf or tennis because, sure as hell, they can't surf.

dastasha's picture
dastasha's picture
dastasha Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 8:51am

Awww come on... those fifty people at your break are now stoked.
That guy sure seems stoked too.
Its not fair that people want to keep all the stoke for themselves. Share the stoke.
Hang on haven't I seen that in an ad somewhere

memlasurf's picture
memlasurf's picture
memlasurf Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 3:15pm

Dasta (if your taking the piss disregard this), no problem with people who want to do it but most of the morons who get in the water after seeing it on TV are dangerous and have no idea of etiquette. Bali is a case in point, there are dead set dickheads from Europe (these are the worst offenders) who have no idea about priority, dropping in, ability, brains, respect for others and they make the line up a nightmare. There should be a gate on entry where those who have no idea get a softy and play in the white water. I wouldn't pay per view if the surf was rubbish and I think there might lie the rub for the whole concept. Fuck me, golf, tennis go play them but don't try to turn surfing into either as the issues they have with both at the moment at the pro level are crazy. Golfers don't even turn up unless they get a squillion up front. And remember Hickel is only doing it to get richer for those involved at that level, zero is going back into anything else, perhaps a fund to educate European dickheads who wanna surf man could be a start.

dastasha's picture
dastasha's picture
dastasha Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 6:22pm

Disregarded.

It's not just Bali.

Sat on the cliffs at Ulus 25 years ago and watched a guy paddle out. You could tell by the way he paddled he was gonna get smashed. Had a laugh with the boys as he got washed toward Padang.
Funny until word got back later that a guy had drowned. Sobering.

Paddling to the ocean with limited experience in inherently dangerous. Ocean surfing is 95 percent paddling. It takes commitment and dedication yes, but it's mainly paddling.

It's not for everybody.
Despite what the marketing gurus would have people believe.

I don't know how to enforce the gate on entry but I'm all for it.
I don't know who has the money in Brazil but here its marketed toward the Boomers, cash in your super and share a wave with 50 others, everyone wants to "get the feeling" and move to Summer Bay.
I'm just afraid the Boomers might get the key and lock everyone else out.

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 12:54pm

Completely agree BB.

(Digging up an old HB will take you right back to personal expression... it's so radically different to what surfing has become)

"I wish that when they asked me 'What is surfing,' I would have said it's an art, and not a sport, because that is what has put us on the wrong track." - paraphrasing Nat

velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno's picture
velocityjohnno Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 12:59pm

I can see the future now: a young kid wins his local event in a wavepool in Arizona, goes to the North Shore where he falls under the wing of a reluctant legend - meets a rival, a girl, gets thoroughly beaten because he learnt in a wave pool... He matures and finds his stride in big surf with spirit & zen, gets a magic board the legend's young glasser has been hiding from the world, wins the event and gets the girl! Stop me if you've heard this before...

savanova's picture
savanova's picture
savanova Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 2:52pm

all sound like another language to me. he could be explaining his shopping list for all know

blindboy's picture
blindboy's picture
blindboy Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 3:06pm

I'll hazard a guess that it doesn't make any more sense in English savanova.

Fliplid's picture
Fliplid's picture
Fliplid Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 6:02pm

Be careful what you ask for, plenty of info re: hype on the way soon

http://www.thebusinessofsurf.com/will-chignell-joins-wsl-cmo/

savanova's picture
savanova's picture
savanova Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 6:27pm

Is it me does his photo look uncannily like KS with hair and blue contact lenses?

rees0's picture
rees0's picture
rees0 Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 9:56pm

kind of a slater schwarznegger hybrid imo

Ash'sLashes's picture
Ash'sLashes's picture
Ash'sLashes Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 11:07pm

Maybe T1 or T2 or T.. Something!!! KS does not seem to age whatever or wherever he appears! Must b the star trunks!!! Minus the air on top!!!
BTW Savanova & Rees0 is this a East C (gong) thing or am I just 1/2 correct???

WazzlePop64's picture
WazzlePop64's picture
WazzlePop64 Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 10:06pm

BB, I Agree, Our local breaks are blocked with wannabes, Heroes who own the latest [retro,performance,hybrid,whatever] boards. They, like the aspirations of WSL will wash up on a foreign shore, depleted and seen as complete rubbish.
Surfing is not mainstream, not always fair or equal, each wave, each peak, each break, makes a great surf.

Iconic breaks for those who surf, should always be in the system. Pipe is the End of Ends.
Change That, Change Dreams, Change Hopes...
Surfer's Don't Like Change, They Like The Local..
The People, The Sand/Reef, The Feel
WSL Can't replicate that..................

Billyw's picture
Billyw's picture
Billyw Thursday, 18 Jan 2018 at 10:08pm

That's heartbreaking stuff. Surfers don't want any of this.

Ontheroad's picture
Ontheroad's picture
Ontheroad Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 12:11pm

fuck surfball

tbasstreble11's picture
tbasstreble11's picture
tbasstreble11 Sunday, 21 Jan 2018 at 6:09am

^ nailed it

mick-free's picture
mick-free's picture
mick-free Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 12:29pm

Pretty fascinating the whole media landscape at the moment and how businesses are making money or just trying to break even. Netflix, Stan are bashing Fox, who are struggling for content and customers paying their monthly subscriptions. Then you have Amazon throwing grenades. The Australian, AFR have paid subscriptions and we have free content from their competitors.

Whereas WSL own it all and can lock it down.

While not a fan of the surfing population increasing. The strategy is on point and given the unlimited bank funds there is no doubt the breakthrough to the mainstream will be achieved. Whether that develops a core group of consumers in the mainstream is the big question. But given the x factor that surfing has, the pure joy of riding waves, the dreams of surfing XL waves, the Olympics and the chance of making it as a career as a competitor suggests to me that it will go.

Ultimately I see the tour wouldn't be at any of the current natural waves. They would be at 12 cities worldwide with wave pools. Events like Pipe would be for freesurfers and actually may mean there would be less events. They would package up a 1 hour special on the backdoor shootout and be part of highlights package available for the networks or consumers to download. Specialty events, BWWT and the individual events would have their place but ultimately something like the QS would die a death.

It's coming to prime time whether you want it or not.

mick-free's picture
mick-free's picture
mick-free Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 12:29pm

preferably without Joe Turpel and Martin Potter

batfink's picture
batfink's picture
batfink Sunday, 21 Jan 2018 at 5:08pm

I like Potts, and can learn something from him. He's an astute commentator.

And I've become accustomed to Joe Turpel. They need someone to keep them on point. The other guys are great, real cred, Peter Mel, Rosie - wow, sweet. The guy that paddles out, can't remember his name, real surfers, happy with them.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 1:00pm

What if wavepools mirror the rise and fall of the water slide theme parks ?

They used to be everywhere . Most regional Aussie towns had one then they disappeared . Now even the large ones are struggling . Does Sydney still have one ? I drove past one one the goldy the other day and not one ride going in peak season Xmas holidays.

If the wavepools don't work out then you can kiss your " unlimited bank funds " goodbye.

And that's before the AR revolution has reset the reality of people's entertainment. You reckon it's a struggle to get a kid outside now , wait till they can shoot aliens in space or surf pipe through a head set and it feels utterly real.

If the various government funded tourism boards around the world weren't propping up this house of cards at the moment then Dirk Ziff would take his fancy elsewhere ASAP.

Fact is that the user is paying for it right now.

Most events funding comes from users (taxpayers).
Public event locations provided by users ( taxpayers).
Event entrance money provided by users.

eel's picture
eel's picture
eel Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 1:45pm

Sydney has WetnWild and it is packed all summer long. Ridiculously packed. I've been there once and the slides are actually really cool

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 1:54pm

Nice work.

I always had a lot of time for waterslides as a pubescent. Great place to meet chicks when you're a leering grommet.

blindboy's picture
blindboy's picture
blindboy Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 2:45pm

Professional surfing has never been independently viable. It has relied on very charitable interpretations of its marketing value by the major brands for most of its career and is now relying on pure charity. How an increasingly divided and uncertain media landscape is supposed to change this is not clear to me. I expect it will struggle on in some form or other but in my judgement it will never compete with the established pro sports. If you put it in a pool you remove one of the few dramatic elements it has going for it, which is the uncertainty of the waves. Surfers tend to suffer from a familiarity fallacy about this, they find it exciting and assume others will too, which the history of the sport tends to disprove.

Blowin's picture
Blowin's picture
Blowin Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 2:57pm

I can't wait till it's as big as tennis.

And then when surfing's answer to Nick Kyrgios is pouting , looking disinterested and purposely fluffing takeoffs on the day of the year at Northpoint because he's bored .....then we'll see the people rise up and burn down Dirk's big tent and throw it into the recycling bin.

Fleazool's picture
Fleazool's picture
Fleazool Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 3:25pm

However questionable pro surfing has been, at least at it's core it was based on putting the best surfers in the best waves (sponsorship pending) to work out (pretty well actually) who is the best surfer of the time.
Now it appears it will go down the road of the dream tour, in the eyes of the owners which means whatever sells ads & pay per view subscriptions. Two week waiting periods, scratch them off the agenda.
In five years time instead of pipe as the title showdown it'll be at a pool in Brazil with 100,000 screaming fans cheering on their latest bunny hoppers.

Nick Bone's picture
Nick Bone's picture
Nick Bone Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 9:13pm

How did you people translate this?

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 7:41am

Strangely, some people are getting the subtitles and some aren't. If you're not getting them you need to watch the video in YouTube (click on the video title to do so), then click the 'subtitles/closed captions' icon bottom right.

blindboy's picture
blindboy's picture
blindboy Friday, 19 Jan 2018 at 9:24pm

Que?

kashmir's picture
kashmir's picture
kashmir Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 10:17am

Yep,fucked!

inzider's picture
inzider's picture
inzider Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 12:45pm

Unless it's absolutely pumping I would rather watch lawn bowls or croquet.
Pro surfing is such a yawn fest it beggars beyond belief that tax payers put up with subsidising a failing industry.

simba's picture
simba's picture
simba Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 2:08pm

yeah poor Kelly having to endure this ......

inzider's picture
inzider's picture
inzider Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 2:22pm

that is just plain disturbing.

many-rivers's picture
many-rivers's picture
many-rivers Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 5:23pm

If they put a curved metal plate further back on the wave creating “train” could they get two fairly identical waves going?
Two waves at the same time , surfers then need to compete in real time.
The increased energy cost might be less than running the device twice?
The general attitude or response from long time surefers revolves around the perceived unnatural feeling on this mechanism.
Once the tech gets going though and more are built surely a gnarly 15 footer is only a question of $$$?
This could evolve, as another comment described above , into Surfball though.
Think of the possibilites of an athletic contest with obstacles and innovations like blockers and slalom course points to pass.
Just what Consumers love , conflict!
Home from work or at the stand up all day work hub , surfers doing battle for ratings.The merchandising possibilities alone are enormous dude!

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet Saturday, 20 Jan 2018 at 6:17pm

Not possible. Kelly uses soliton waves that can only be created off the front of a displacement hull.

many-rivers's picture
many-rivers's picture
many-rivers Sunday, 21 Jan 2018 at 2:28pm

If the displacement hull goes fast enough waves propogate off the front of the object- thanks for introducing the soliton definition to me by the way.
My comment was being facetious but it is in fact possible to generate up to three or even more waves though perhaps this is not desirable in the current configuration.
Loads of explanatory videos on the youtube - https://m.


The other wave type , the Kelvin wake might also be generated by appropriately placed bumps off the the back of the displacement hull though? This way there could be a different type of wave generated so the uniformity of the single soliton is placed in contrast to it , giving surfers a chance to vary their performance.
I tell you what , once the nerds get going on this the possibilities are endless!

stunet's picture
stunet's picture
stunet Sunday, 21 Jan 2018 at 2:51pm

Greg Webber has the patent for Kelvin wakes so if we're to see multiple waves from single hulls it'll most likely come from his design.

batfink's picture
batfink's picture
batfink Sunday, 21 Jan 2018 at 5:21pm

Surfing is still pretty niche in sporting terms. Anyone with the money can play tennis or golf.

Soccer is the biggest game in the world because all you need is a ball and it's pretty safe. It isn't because it's a good game to either play or watch.

Surfing requires the ability to swim (discounting 2/3rds or more of the planet*) money, beaches with waves (discounts 9/10ths of the planet*), weather, and even at entry level extracts a price in terms of commitment that no other sport requires. It's gone mental in terms of numbers of people who do it, and it still doesn't scratch the surface of other sports in terms of participation.

But there are few sports so regularly used in advertising, at least in Australia. Aspiring to be like golf or tennis is a lame arse ambition.

* figures totally made up!