indo-dreaming, 1560491673

I agree Blowin.

But what i dont get is if he is involved with labor and takes so much interest in politics why cant he answer the questions we have or even attempt to answer them?

But yeah i guess that's what politicians do, avoid answering questions.


factotum, 1560493429

Hahahaha. Blowindo!

Jeez, how's my new job? ALP photocopy boy! My job list is ever expanding! Busy times!

Well, according to you.

Lucky you're both so full of shit or else I'd never get to go surfing.


factotum, 1560494200

And speaking of shit and shitty subscriptions and "inane garbage", B.I., you might want to look up "proscribed", comrade.

Hahahaha. "Countervail" that, you gormless gronk.


Laurie McGinness, 1560496265

In terms of the supposed privatisation of public education, I can only speak about the NSW system. The situation there has been essentially the same for many years in my experience. International students pay fees to attend NSW government schools and these fees are so substantial that they more than cover the costs involved. The fees go straight into the education budget increasing funding in an underfunded area. In some schools the increased enrollments also increase senior subject choices, advantaging local students. There is also an enormous benefit to language students in having a cohort of native speakers in the school. There is a link back there that explains how public education has been shafted by successive governments at both state and federal level. If you are actually interested in public education, that is the biggest problem it faces.


factotum, 1560498966

Meanwhile...

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/12/why-are-we-still-pretending-trickle-down-economics-work?CMP=soc_567&fbclid=IwAR3pWwkpPCmmiv8hKqLWWhexHsjmzFetkm-yCY6Af1yuQi8VwzR1wMdXd6o

Ya gotta laff...


factotum, 1560500319

Hahahahaha.

Fagto!

Stuffed and mounted like a prize crocodile flathead, B.I.

Again.


factotum, 1560500484

"Just go on the threads you want anyway. They’re still there. Dribble still occurs."

Hah! Bingo! And here it is! Cheers B.I.

"...the electorate faced the choice between the noose and the guillotine . The people picked their poison."

Well, apart from the mixed metaphors, no BECAUSE of them, and the hyperbole, this is meaningless.

A vote for Labor was death? Personal death or the death of the country? Maybe you could conceivably run with the latter if you're talking about the coalition, and/or Palmer & Hanson (whose preferences got the LNP over the line for a one seat majority in the HoR).

Discuss.

"Declaring the Australian collective as lazy and complacent isn’t hate speech?"

Yes. It isn't.

You could even add "dumb as a bag of hammers", but then we're not talking about the 'collective', are we? And not even the usual Lib and Nat 'true believers', but just the turkeys voting for Xmas?

I guess going by the aggrieved hyperbole of that statement and the sense of victimhood snowflakery, we know where you sit, B.I., you self-proclaimed 'working class hero'.

As for Laurie's comment:

"And when the economy tanks and all the economic illiterates in government have to offer is austerity, then what?"

I guess you missed the "WHEN the economy tanks" bit, hey B.I.?

Confident we won't see a bog-standard, via the UK model, austerity budget then? Hang on, we had the Hockey "lifters and leaners" austerity budget when we weren't in recession! And that was a bog-standard version of the UK austerity model in play at the time.

Well, there's something to look forward to then!

How good is Australia?

Don't answer that.

You're not supposed to.


factotum, 1560500589

Talk about jumping around like a flea on a hot skillet.

Or being all over the place like a mad woman's shite.

B.I. your conflation and hyperbole is hysterical. In all senses of the word.

"...here’s a nice little example of the bullet dodged when the ALP failed to make themselves electable."

Let that sink in for a minute. And then ponder what kind of munitions the Libs and their enablers represent in this goofy analogy.

Then spuriously jumping from 'discussion' about Federally funded tertiary education to State funded primary and secondary education via the MB subscription. Conflation much? What a flea circus.

Then this??

"You’re confusing international students here to achieve and learn with the farming of foreign students as a means of achieving work rights , permanent residency and access to the real estate market for their parents,

You’re talking about the 1 percent who try to learn and I’m talking about the 99 percent who just show up in order to gleam access to the benefits of our society."

Those figures are disturbing. Not the bullshit numbers - the content - but the intent.

Surprise?

And finally the full strawman 'fake left' shit-spray.

Directed to a bloke with years of engagement and knowledge and experience and expertise with the subject...

From what? An ex-FIFO scab, dime-a-dozen laptop 'share broker' with a Macro Bollocks sucker subscription?

Laughable, but then again, the laugh's on us. Look who our PM is! Cheers enablers!

How good is Australia?!


factotum, 1560504156

"There is a link back there that explains how public education has been shafted by successive governments at both state and federal level. If you are actually interested in public education, that is the biggest problem it faces."

There's the rub, Laurie. The MBers and the sucker subscribers and the pile-on pillocks AREN'T interested in public education and the biggest problem it faces.

So what's the real agenda?

Lemme guess...does it start with an I?


Westofthelake, 1560505292

So Trumpy the bankrupternator is giving a medal to a man who is responsible for creating a legal method for mass theft.

All in the name of responsible economic management.....and prosperity for all.

So apropros.

So fucked up.


factotum, 1560509784

And top-end tax cuts an integral part of the only policy our incumbents took to the election...

Yeah, but, yeah, but...Labor.

Ya gotta laff indeed.


Laurie McGinness, 1560510202

...... and of course they are playing dirty politics with them by refusing to split the bill so if Labor or any independent wants to vote against the tax cuts for the rich, they have to vote against them for those on low incomes also.


factotum, 1560511024

And in breaking "I really cannot begin to fathom how stupid you would have to be to believe" news...

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/06/the-gulf-of-credibility/?fbclid=IwAR2duN3uMt1Zqf9lw5wIF28_IElNnwKg-zcDHPNqSV0J-TbqySe2203HQ4I


Blowin, 1560554346

Laurie - No , mate , the fees international students pay aren’t substantial , they are woefully inadequate and it leaves Australians to heavily subsidise the education of foreigners whilst also diminishing the standard of education for Australians.

Average fee paid by international students in Vicco is just over $10K per annum. 500 students would be paying $5M in fees yearly.

To construct a school for 500 students in Melbourne costs upward of $30M for the most basic of schools. This cost does not include the purchase of land which would be closer to $50M.

Then there are the running costs of the school , the interest owed on the borrowed money needed to build the school and the massive infrastructure impost required to look after 500 students , their parents and sibilants who are entitled to migrate and probably will.

Already it’s apparent that the whole idea is a waste of taxpayers money , of which there is already not enough to go around by a very large margin.

The premise is that the education is classed as an export , but this is erroneous as the student’s parents , and often the students themselves , will then mostly work within Australia to pay the students fees. So it’s not an export at all as the money to pay the fees is generated within Australia.

The whole scheme is the result of vested , rent seeking industries lobbying a compliant government who wishes to externalise any expense it possibly can - even if the externalities are a blatant fraud and in reality non -existent.

It’s a paper shuffle and a slight of hand for the budget which is detrimental to the standards of Australian education and at the expense of money which is needed to service our population.

Lower Australian educational standards = The nation declines

Lower Australian tax dollars available = The nation declines

More and more people on our fragile continent = The nation declines

More and more people competing for infrastructure, housing, all services and living space= The nation declines.

The entire concept of fee paying international students is only considerable as an opportunity to diversify the culture of our students and to expose them to new ideas. The value of this concept is already negligible and completely redundant in a society whereby half of the population is foreign born anyway.

The scheme is a joke and the ALP should be opposing the privatisation of our public education system on principle even before the evidence reveals it for the imposing scam it is.

There isn’t enough space for Australian kids in the school system. Victoria has a shortfall of 220 schools in the next 5 years on current population predictions. Leaving a budget shortfall of $12B which has to be borrowed.



factotum, 1560556910

"So what's the real agenda?

Lemme guess...does it start with an I?"

BINGO!


Westofthelake, 1560558012

Re The Gulf ships, I was left speechless when the abc showed footage of alleged Iranian boat next to side of ship apparently removing a bomb that they apparently placed there!

If the US says it is true then it must be......not.
https://www.theguardian.com/global/video/2019/jun/14/footage-us-military-claims-shows-iranian-patrol-boat-removing-limpet-mine-from-tanker-video


Laurie McGinness, 1560567946

In relation to the costs of international students, I can only comment on NSW where many schools, particularly in wealthy areas close to the city centre, have spare capacity due to the large number of private schools in those areas. Local students always have priority, so if a school is enrolling international students it is because they have spare capacity. In such cases the extra students make little or no difference to the running costs of the school and the staffing formula ensures that the costs of any additional teaching staff are easily met from the fees. The areas in which new schools are necessary are often in newly developed areas further from the city centre. Any analysis that assumes the total cost of a new school should be accounted to students who will never attend it and who have not displaced those who will from other schools, is simplistic and almost certainly motivated by issues other than that which they are pretending to address.


Blowin, 1560571406

Sorry , Laurie, you must not be aware of the current shortfall of positions in Victoria’s public schooling system. Of course private international students will be displacing positions for Australian students.

It’s facile, simplistic and poor mathematics to estimate that the current 6000 international student intake could be absorbed within the very limited spare capacity available in Victoria,if indeed any spare capacity were to exist.

Would it be 100 private students at 60 schools or 200 private students at 30 schools that you think have spare capacity ?

These quantities alone reveal the error of your assumptions.

Of course there isn’t the spare capacity and of course the fees paid by these private students go nowhere near approaching the impost they incur on Australia. Let alone the impost incurred by their relatives who don’t even contribute fees.

And this is before the ALP has even instigated their policy to further privatise the public school system. Who knows what amounts of students they are planning on allowing?

Using the Tertiary school system as a guide , there is NO PLAN regarding how many fee paying foreign students can attend the public school system. As many as possible is the answer.

All accounts for requirements and costing of schools that I’ve provided stand . Australia gains nothing from this policy.

Thinly veiled and erroneous accusations as to motivations for providing such factual accounting are nothing more than a refusal to accept the truth and an attempt to elude it.

The plan by the ALP state government in Victoria to expand the privatisation of the public school system is just more of the same extreme neo-liberalism and corrupted and inept workings that Australians have come to expect from modern politics.

Australia needs true opposition to this corrosive style of government.


Laurie McGinness, 1560572740

The reality
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-01/international-student-freeze-in-victorian-state-schools/11061342


factotum, 1560573797

Third time's a charm again, Laurie. Well, if you count the MB wormhole cut n paste article they put up.

Jeez, flogging that MB horse or what, B.I.?! Gotta pretend to be getting your money's worth, I s'pose.

Go you good thing. I gotta sixer riding on ya next post.


factotum, 1560573963

Re: the gulf shonk, Westie, there's a sucker born etc etc. You know how it goes.


Blowin, 1560575151

The reality is that it’s PRIVATE industry- migration agents particularly- lobbying for the increase. The schools see the carrot of cash dangled before them , just as the universities did, and create a market .

Didn’t you read the article ?

What about this little snippet:

“Dale Pearce, principal at Bendigo Senior Secondary College, said his school had to knock back two Chinese students who applied to enrol later this year, despite having capacity.

His was one of several schools to travel to China earlier this year to recruit students, and Mr Pearce told the ABC it had been "a little difficult" for the families to understand why their children would not be accepted after the recruitment drive.

He said the impact on the school's budget was "manageable", but he was more concerned about the "loss of face" and the established connections in the city of Fuzhou.”

Who do you think paid for this public school principal to travel to China to convince two students to attend his school ?

It’s migration agents and the “ consultation fees “ they pay to compliant principals behind this insidious business. Apparently the school didn’t need the money - there goes the underfunded- by - the -federal- LNP theory you push.

A suburban principal travelling to China and worrying about his school losing face in China .......9000kms from his fucking school !

It’s nothing more than a business. The privatisation of public schooling. The article states as much .

The ALP want to increase the privatisation of our public schools. Which will lead to the exact same result as the privatisation of tertiary education ....reduced standards , ignorant population, people trafficking with residency the true sale.

I’m not sure how you can defend it , or even why you would feel compelled to defend it ?

Is it pure reaction to anything I suggest ? Automatic opposition ?

Well , that’s meant to be the role of the ALP in Australian politics- to oppose shit ideas such as this one.

Australia needs a new major party to combat the extreme neoliberalism of the ALP/LNP duopoly.



factotum, 1560575794

BOOM!

Carton.

Again.

Love your work, champ.


factotum, 1560575897

Not really.

Not a fan of animal cruelty.

Your nag's shot.


Laurie McGinness, 1560582403

So the schools and the government, who you claim are losing money on the deal, "see a carrot of cash dangled before them". Contradictory, confused, illogical? All over 0.5% of the enrollment in Victorian schools? Don't you have something more substantial to concern yourself with?


Blowin, 1560583327

It’s a starting point , Laurie. Thin edge of the wedge.

There was a starting point for the privatisation of government assets once. That first department they were convinced by rent seekers that could be farmed out . Providing a short term fudge of the budget bottom line and to appease their lobbyists.

Those lobbyists with their brown bags of cash can be very persuasive.

You know the lobbyists who convinced governments that banks , roads , hospitals, land titles registry’s and the like are better off in private hands with the pubic underwriting all expenses whilst the owners take the super profits.

All whilst the service itself deteriorates.

If you think the ALP encouraging and expanding the privatisation of our schools is inconsequential I think that says more about yourself and the modern remnants of the Labor voting base than it does about anything else.


Laurie McGinness, 1560584187

You have not supplied the slightest evidence that our public schools are being privatised. No matter how many international students they enrol they remain government owned public schools funded overwhelmingly by the taxpayer. A tiny percentage of fee paying international students does not change that.


Blowin, 1560584457

And if you think it’s confusing that governments would privatise departments and services even though it’s a financial detriment, then you’re really showing your knowledge shortfalls in both economics and politics.

Take the land titles registration board of NSW .....profit making business, serving the community perfectly. Yet the government sold it .

Why , do you think ?

Two reasons-

1/ Quick cash hit for a government. Even though the medium term returns from the registry would dwarf the immediate cash hit , and the cost to government of paying the now private registry to do its job would soon eat away all of that cash hit , the government wanted to bolster the budget short term to win votes and to be able to reallocate the funds from the sale.

Which leads us to point 2.

2/ Corruption. They get us - the taxpayers- on the sale , they get us on the spend of the windfall and they get us on the cost of providing a service we used to get for a much cheaper price with all returns going back to the community as wages , rather than profit to privateers.

Commonwealth bank. Land titles registry, Telstra.....and now the public school system.

If that doesn’t concern you then it’s time to take a walk in the hall of mirrors.


Laurie McGinness, 1560584481

........usual tactic, change the subject, move to some nonsensical generalisation etc etc. Now we are off the front page I really don't feel the need to correct the toxic bullshit you post anymore, since there's no-one looking to be contaminated by it. Your main contribution to these forums has been to destroy them as a place for rational debate.


Blowin, 1560585094

Huh ?

You couldn’t understand why the cash carrot would be dangled in front of a department which didn’t need it.

I explained why.

It also leads into how a public service morphs into public/ private then full private .

I’ve answered your question and I’ve done it in a completely rational manner. It seems that you get frustrated at not being able to have your erroneous opinions respected and you then get personal.

You think a concern for the privatisation of the education system is “ toxic bullshit “ ?

You tried to debate and failed to put forward a convincing argument. Either accept that you are wrong or think of another argument. It’s yourself who has delved into the personal attacks.


factotum, 1560596088

"Your main contribution to these forums has been to destroy them as a place for rational debate."

Ouch.

Anyway, B.I, can you please explain what privatisation is for us all again.

We're not getting it. Knowledge shortfalls and all.

One more time.

Cheers, mate.

Yew!


factotum, 1560644753

And...

"In today’s information age, the media have an extraordinary power to shape public opinion, and no one is exempt from their influence. The media are a veritable ‘fourth power’ in the state next to the traditional branches of government, controlling not only what is said and shown, but also what is not disseminated and, therefore, is withheld from the public. This enormous power comes with an equally enormous ethical responsibility."

https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/this-assange-supporter-excoriating-the-press-is-the-best-thing-youll-watch-all-day-b8c4f2460ee3


factotum, 1560644845

Meanwhile on the real world stage (a fellow Aussie's perspective)...

"Sometimes the things put out by the US State Department feel like they’re conducting experiments on us, just to test the limits of our stupidity."

https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/seven-reasons-to-be-highly-skeptical-of-the-gulf-of-oman-incident-48958389f53e?fbclid=IwAR0C4HMfO6rbiOFydq3JRLZJoOinqQlF_LmjEgO1YWyJByzw4lDKoO22RWQ


GuySmiley, 1560652877

I've checked out of day to day politics, by any objective measure the LNP should have lost in a landslide, yet, how wrong were Labor in reading the "aspirational" electorate or perhaps more accurately allowing itself to be open to wildly false scare campaigns. It's not going to end well, the country is in recession, wage growth is at historical lows, interest rates are at a point where the cost of borrowing money is almost free, we have a huge deficit and growing and a government driven by ideology and concurrently committed budget surpluses and the biggest tax cuts in Australia's history.

For me it's back to where it started, the government is deliberately working against the best interests of ordinarily people - the government, the Murdoch media and big capital all conspiring to divide and exploit.

.It was the Vietnam War that saw the masses last revolt here, what will it take for the next?


indo-dreaming, 1560654537

Interesting read from Noel Pearson:

"Can a cause for the right succeed in the long run if it is pursued through unrighteous means? Can causes for the good be selective in their adherence to science? Or do righteous ends justify unrighteous means?

This is the crisis confronting environmentalism. It suffered a grievous loss at the federal election and the Adani red line is broken. This may be a crisis of legitimacy. The question is whether political environmentalism is turning off voters and hardening attitudes against the necessary effective policies to secure future sustainability. Are the means employed by political environmentalism destroying the possibility of Australia achieving the desired end of sustainability through consensus? Or is consensus unnecessary because the morally right end means the maxim “by any means necessary” applies?

Political environmentalism is undermining the cause of sustainability because short-term expediency and tactical opportunism is trumping long-term strategic consensus-building. Environmentalism has degenerated into the binary of cultural war when it needs to transcend such wars. Its leaders have led the movement into a zero-sum game, where political victory in one battlefield is countered by loss in another.


We should first explain what we mean by causes for the right.

Political parties seeking power in government are not in the business of the right. Electoral politics are by definition ruthless, with few holds barred. Lies, half-truths, fake news, negative advertising and dirt files are part of the repertoire of power in politics. One party’s Mediscare is the other party’s retiree tax.

Former Labor NSW state secretary and federal minister Graham Richardson captured the ethos of politics in his memoir Whatever It Takes. Noble and ignoble things are achieved by marshalling political power.

While causes for power are amoral, there are causes for the right. Civil rights and the anti-apartheid movement are examples. Emancipation and antislavery are even older precedents. Such causes mobilise the political process and power for good ends. Conservation is such a cause. Few would dispute it is a moral duty of humankind regardless of political affiliation and preference.

Causes for the truth must be ethical, otherwise they suffer damage. Moral integrity is the great currency of righteous movements, but the political environmentalists have jeopardised the cause of conservation by allowing it to descend into the hyper-partisan battlefield of culture and politics.

It is exposed to the 51-49 per cent risk. When your party wins 51, then you may win tactical victories, but when it is 49 you have put your cause in peril. This is what has happened to Adani after the election.

I want to allege five profound mistakes the political environmentalists are making in Australia:

First, they are alienating the lower classes in their droves. This is the lesson of the 2019 election. The political environmentalists pushed climate policies that worked for the post-material middle class, but cared less about the economically precarious. More than the costs, it is the movement’s superior cultural attitude that pisses off the lower classes in such a visceral way.

Second, they are alienating indigenous peoples by pushing the costs of conservation on to those who have not created the crisis. Indigenous leaders such as Marcia Langton and Warren Mundine have highlighted the green lockup of indigenous lands from development.

These groups manipulate and exploit divisions within landowner communities. They divide and rule the same as mining companies do, setting up puppets that favour their agenda. We saw this in the campaign against the Kimberley Land Council. We see it in Cape York in relation to Wild Rivers and blanket World Heritage listing proposals.

Traditional owners supported conservation goals and helped create by agreement new national parks and other conservation tenures. But the political environmentalists are never satisfied. They want everything locked up.

They are making enemies of the country’s largest landowners because they use electoral leverage with governments to subjugate land rights. If they are alienating the land rights movement, which is more aligned to conservation than other sectors, what does that say about them?

A third problem is they are at the forefront of deploying so-called “new power” in their public campaigns. Through the diffusion of social media and decentralised campaigning, green groups began to seriously challenge the “old power”. GetUp co-founder Jeremy Heimans and Henry Timms explain this development in their 2018 book New Power.

Breaking the old power monopoly is welcome; however, the dilemmas of social media and its susceptibility to manipulation and its effects on civil society and democratic governance are troubling. Twitter and Facebook have just created online mob behaviour. Hardly platforms for moral causes.

And the political environmentalists have used the new power to promote conservation and climate change action in as cynical a way as the forces against which they are pitted. Getup and Sleeping Giants use the same tools of manipulation as deliberately as Breitbart and Cambridge Analytica.

A fourth problem is the political environmentalists are highly selective in their adherence to science, and in so doing bring science into disrepute in public policy debates. Who really believed the black-throated finch was the environmental issue of Adani? The poor critters were used as a proxy for opposition to coalmining.

Why the charade? The Queensland Labor government should have been honest with the public and said: the policy question we face is whether the Galilee Basin should be opened up to coalmining in the context of its contribution to the crisis of global warming. But because they wanted to walk two sides of the street at once — intimating to greenies they did not support Adani while intimating to regional workers that they supported coalmining — they did not bring the crux policy question to a head and provide their answer to it.

They lacked the courage of their convictions and simply did not have the leadership to untie the Gordian knot that expanded coalmining in the Galilee Basin represents. And now the May 18 loss sees them stampeding over the poor birds and anything else standing in the way of their electoral prospects next year.

The stances environmental groups take in relation to any number of issues — nuclear energy and aquaculture, for example — evince a selective adherence to science.

Does not environmental science tell us about the interconnectivity of the planet, and if nuclear power is used in Europe, Asia and the Americas, and contributes to lower carbon emissions, why is the debate on nuclear power not on the basis of science and the mitigation of risks associated with nuclear energy, instead of a green version of obscurantism?

The proponents of safer nuclear waste disposal in Australia (which included the late Bob Hawke) have got a point that is worth subjecting to science rather than outright prohibition. While the case for domestic nuclear power may not be strong, it is a substantial source of energy throughout the world, and as a uranium producer we are obliged to consider our role in the management of its waste. There are strong geopolitical arguments in favour of Australia assuming this responsibility and mitigating the large risks involved, which we are better placed to carry than most other countries. After all, it is the green­ies who tell us the planet is one and national boundaries are environmentally meaningless.

The fifth and most fundamental problem is the political environmentalists have aligned environmentalism with socialism rather than conservatism. Another way of saying this is they have aligned environmentalism with progressivism rather than conservatism.

There is a fundamental philosophical problem at the heart of contemporary environmentalism. I do not mean in respect of the appreciation of the natural environment. I mean in respect of where our motive must come from in order to conserve the good things we have been bequeathed from our ancestors for the benefit of our future unborn.

This is the motive that is unanswered by the utilitarian calculations of liberals and socialists. Not everything is about price. Conservatives understand that some things are valuable because they are priceless.

English conservative philosopher Roger Scruton’s 2012 book Green Philosophy is the starting point for a new conservative approach to conservation. The approach is old — about stewardship and our responsibility to bequeath to future generations the gifts we received from our ancestors — but its application to the environmental crises facing our homelands, including global warming, is new. The climate obscurantists who are in the same binary as the political environmentalists and who think themselves conservatives should read Scruton. They should be the first to understand the conservation in conservatism but, alas, ­cultural war has caused a degeneration on all sides.

Progressive socialists don’t know what Scruton is referring to: oikophilia, the love of home that speaks to people’s connection with their environment, which animates their responsibilities. Instead, they propose large schemes, imposed from above by state diktat, while doing violence to the most important engine of conservation: the local connection of communities with their environment, and their concern to leave their descendants what their ancestors left for them. Progressives are more concerned with environmental posturing, cutting the correct moral gesture, being seen to be more enlightened and selfless, in contrast to the deplorables and knuckle-draggers.

The green leaders all want to be the next Bob Brown, renowned for their own Franklin Dam or Wet Tropics. They trample over politically weaker communities such as Queensland property owners uncompensated for tree-clearing restrictions that underwrote our Kyoto target in the 2000s. It was John Howard’s federal government and Peter Beattie’s state government that dispossessed these landowners without proper compensation.

Indigenous landowners are another politically weaker community that are ridden roughshod over by political environmentalists.

The folly of all of this is now surely clear. What can be done?

Ever since Richardson alighted on the strategy of garnering the environmental vote, Labor began outsourcing its environmental policy integrity to the political environmentalists. This yielded electoral returns in 1987 and 1990 but ultimately led to Labor bleeding market share to the Greens and being held hostage to political environmentalism. Labor’s environmental credibility came from environmental group endorsements after adopting their policies and acquiescing to their demands.

Rather than undertaking the principal responsibility of government, coming up with policies that balance development with environmental sustainability, it did preference deals with the political environmentalists. Environmental groups became experts at marginal seat politics, turning 2 to 3 per cent of the environment vote to win 51 per cent victories for their pet campaigns.

The hook-up with GetUp is the apotheosis of Labor’s dalliance with political environmentalism. What electorate is not going to be suspicious of the next bunch of out-of-towners hectoring them about how to vote next time? GetUp was Bill Shorten’s long game at mobilising AstroTurf activism and it has all ended in tears.

Labor must define its own environmental credentials in its own right, not as an alliance with the Greens or as the lapdog of a certain environmental milieu. Watching Jackie Trad squirm as Queensland Environment Minister Leeanne Enoch approved the Adani mine this week told the whole sorry story. Labor can no longer walk two sides of the street at once. It worked for Annastacia Palaszczuk in 2017 but not for Shorten in 2019. Voters might be fooled once, but not all the time.

To develop environmental policies free from deal-making with the political environmentalists, Labor must balance human society and environmental sustainability. The last thing the environment portfolio needs is a progressive from an inner-city seat, surrounded by a milieu of political environmentalists. Labor needs to take environment policy back to first principles and get its philosophy right first.

The environment is too important to be left to the political environmentalists.

Noel Pearson is a director of Cape York Partnership and co-chairman of Good to Great Schools Australia.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/inquirer/the-environment-is-too-important-to-be-left-to-ecowarriors/news-story/f0e07fa43ae8965c0c96f3c8f2a27658?fbclid=IwAR2fpW3L97_UZYFj92eUDXdhRSFXuywrX8M4Tn6YxYsCksWxp8joappQ-Xs


sypkan, 1560656156

I really cannot believe what I'm reading here. Anyone, anyone at all, that loosely associates themselves with 'the left' of politics should be steadfastly against the marketisation of our primary and secondary school systems. As I said before, it's virtually the only government service left that hasn't (hadn't) been marketised/privatised/bastardised in a race to the bottom, and it should('ve) stay that way. Many of us thought that was an unwritten given, but clearly not for this labor party of oz ...ironically ...again...

"...Average fee paid by international students in Vicco is just over $10K per annum. 500 students would be paying $5M in fees yearly.

To construct a school for 500 students in Melbourne costs upward of $30M for the most basic of schools. This cost does not include the purchase of land which would be closer to $50M.

Then there are the running costs of the school , the interest owed on the borrowed money needed to build the school and the massive infrastructure impost required to look after 500 students , their parents and sibilants who are entitled to migrate and probably will."

Exactly!

The fees barely cover the most incidental of costs. It's absolute pittance when one looks at the whole costs of providing that service, so the economic argument is shaky and negligible at best. But the influence and undermining of a system this process involves is significantly significant, as we have seen with tertiary education, its now a mess, losing credibility by the day

"...Using the Tertiary school system as a guide , there is NO PLAN regarding how many fee paying foreign students can attend the public school system. As many as possible is the answer.

All accounts for requirements and costing of schools that I’ve provided stand . Australia gains nothing from this policy."

"As many as possible" is indeed the answer, as it is now a business, with a heap of leaches advocating it's future, spruiking the dodgy economics to ensure it's growth and their salaries. And you two say MB guys are dodgy dudes for raising it?

laughable

maybe it's actually you that's looking in all the wrong places...

"..So the schools and the government, who you claim are losing money on the deal, "see a carrot of cash dangled before them". Contradictory, confused, illogical? All over 0.5% of the enrollment in Victorian schools? Don't you have something more substantial to concern yourself with?"

It's the thin edge of the wedge, and you know it. Even at this minor percentage it has a huge influence on government policy, schools and teachers, as it's now seen as the only way forward. No matter how small the percentage, childhood education was obsessively protected from these pervasive undermining influences, and it bloody well should be! ...at all costs!!

split hairs all you want re. percentages, privatisation and who actually owns the schools, at the end of the day this IS the neoliberalism of childhood education, and you're defending it

"...I’m not sure how you can defend it , or even why you would feel compelled to defend it ?

Is it pure reaction to anything I suggest ? Automatic opposition ?"

I really don't know how king stooge and 'the teach' can defend it either. One can only hope in any other context or forum they wouldn't be doing so...

If not, it's only their party loyalty that could explain their betrayal of everything they claim to stand for.

Or, alternatively, all bullshit aside, they're both neo-liberal zealots at heart, with their whole anti neoliberalism schtick being an absolute fraud...

and that's that! Case closed.




factotum, 1560657612

Allied to the power and insidiousness of corporate media propaganda always on display here...

http://www.medialens.org/index.php/alerts/alert-archive/2019/907-buried-in-broad-daylight-the-free-press-and-the-leaked-opcw-report-on-douma.html?fbclid=IwAR0nv_YL-ky1dVukx3iniRFtKaeLLKoGd7iGFEfw1IvH_fJeCFB3ldo4_Tg




Laurie McGinness, 1560658693

sypkan, no-one has yet provided any evidence of the privatisation of public schools or the slightest evidence of an actual problem. All you have is an hysterical over-reaction to a scare campaign based on notional figures unsupported by anything beyond supposition. If that is your response to a total non-issue, maybe you need to think about building some resilience. Worse things will happen. The election results guaranteed that much.

Indo, Mundine has some fair points as long as you only consider the near past. I learnt about climate change in 1970. Rachel Carson published Silent Spring even earlier. Science has delivered the facts about environmental damage over a long period and those findings, with very few exceptions, have been totally ignored. Indigenous Audtralians should have had a major voice about these issues, but they have never been given it and that is the responsibility of successive governments, not the environmental movement. As for New Power, what did he think should have been done? Ignoring it would have been worse. So yep, a reasonable analysis of some of the problems. Hopefully he will have some solutions next time.


Laurie McGinness, 1560658904

The long term policy is a cap at about 0.5% of the total enrolment. If you think that's a problem you need to consider the possibility that you are suffering from some form of anxiety. If you want something to worry about there are lots of much more concerning issues.


sypkan, 1560659426

yeh there's anxiety. anxiety that it is thinking and justifications like your's above that has got us to this position

as long as you're getting your yearnings fulfilled I guess...


sypkan, 1560659825

from indo's article...

"...A fourth problem is the political environmentalists are highly selective in their adherence to science, and in so doing bring science into disrepute in public policy debates. Who really believed the black-throated finch was the environmental issue of Adani? The poor critters were used as a proxy for opposition to coalmining.

Why the charade? The Queensland Labor government should have been honest with the public and said: the policy question we face is whether the Galilee Basin should be opened up to coalmining in the context of its contribution to the crisis of global warming. But because they wanted to walk two sides of the street at once — intimating to greenies they did not support Adani while intimating to regional workers that they supported coalmining — they did not bring the crux policy question to a head and provide their answer to it.

They lacked the courage of their convictions and simply did not have the leadership to untie the Gordian knot that expanded coalmining in the Galilee Basin represents. And now the May 18 loss sees them stampeding over the poor birds and anything else standing in the way of their electoral prospects next year."

no conviction indeed

and faux issue distractions to enable the fence straddling...

the parallels!


sypkan, 1560660997

Its neoliberalism at a minimum. the actual system may not yet be privatised but it is certainly being marketised, a government assett, a public assett, being sold off to the highest bidder, globally, the very definition of neo-liberalism if there ever was one...

"...no-one has yet provided any evidence of the privatisation of public schools or the slightest evidence of an actual problem."

You've provided evidence yourself. The fact its currently only a minor incursion doesn't discount the insidiousness of such policy

in any other circumstances a person of your position would not be on board with this foot in the door

"...The election results guaranteed that much."

It's labor that's doing it!

and that IS the problem!!!

what part of that don't you guys understand?


Blowin, 1560662127

Quoting the historical cap as predictive of the future even though the cap has been lifted and school principals are now actively marketing their product abroad is the realm of the denislist.


Laurie McGinness, 1560663046

That is incorrect. The cap is in place as this link I have posted states.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-01/international-student-freeze-in-victorian-state-schools/11061342


sypkan, 1560686933

Id have thrown (solely) virtue signalling SJW in there too somewhere, but that'd be over doing it...no matter how true it is...


sypkan, 1560688330

You've got a cheek facto,

please explain how it's me that's 'all over the place'?

When its you - king of stooge - that's a cultural marxist socialist hardline marxist progressive union loving open borders neo-liberal ball bruising fence straddler intersectional feminist labor party propoganda merchant who cannot give a solid position on one single topic...

do please explain...


factotum, 1560727770

Hahaha, Sepp. Waaaaaaaay too much Yankee Kool Aid, dude.


factotum, 1560743349

Forget the split in the Liberal party we've endured since Tones got the arse as leader, how's the split between the Stooges on here?

Sepp's all over the place but shows signs of sophomoric intelligence, sometimes, despite an overdose of US Kool Aid.

B.I. is a transparent bigot who is more full of shit than Malabar. A perspex closeted "the working class can kiss my arse, I've got the foreman's job at last" Hansonite 'battler' and fully paid up member of the 'under educated, over capitalised' 'aspirational' brigade. A dime-a-dozen self-loathing downward-envying 'coward puncher'.

Oh, and a real McCoy One Nation man.

How does that truck with a former Greens voter, Sepp?

As for V.I., well, he's an embarrassment, hey fellow Stooges? No matter how hard you patronise him.

He won the election. Voted One Nation AND thinks ProMo is the bomb.

And owns his opinion.

Reconcile that, comrades.

You're a 'broad church', yeah?

Good luck.

And good night.


sypkan, 1560752771

Well that's a bit messed up...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/17/minefields-and-ruins-israeli-settlement-called-trump-built-on-conquered-land

talk about feeding the beast...


factotum, 1560768716

Hahaha. YOU won the election!

YOU should be rejoicing!

Congratulations 'battler'.

Blowindo rules!

How good is Australia?!


Blowin, 1560769717

No , we didn’t win the election.

Yet again, working class Australians are the ultimate losers when faced with the ALP/ LNP duopoly .

But at least it’s another nail in the ALP coffin . And let’s face it , the ALP will cease to exist in the not too distant future.

The sooner that happens, the sooner Australians will stand a chance.


Blowin, 1560770177

The working class can kiss my arse , I’ve got the foreman’s job at last !

Indeed.

Aspirational , over capitalised and......unemployable.

ALBANESE, Anthony Labor Marrickville (house), NSW investment
ALBANESE, Anthony Labor Dulwich Hill (house), NSW investment
ALBANESE, Anthony Labor Marrickville (house), NSW residential
ALBANESE, Anthony Labor Canberra (unit), ACT residential

Talk about battling !

The modern ALP ....as relevant to the working class as it’s ministers are to actual work......Wouldn’t recognise it if it was jammed sideways up their arseholes.


https://www.betootaadvocate.com/headlines/young-labor-hipster-applies-for-construction-white-card-like-a-real-life-worker/

Keep calling the actual workers “ Dime a dozen “ and see just how long the ALP can remain in opposition before they are dismantled.

I’m serious. Please , please keep alluding to FIFO workers as unwanted scum . Please keep insulting the crew labouring under the untenable mortgage situation which the political class has enabled the Capital class to inflict. Please keep revealing yourselves for the unrepresentative parasites you are , so that the doubt is completely removed and the decision is made for the workers to never , ever contemplate voting ALP again.

Your mask is slipping. Your hubris is causing your disgust at the working class you consider beneath you to be exposed and you don’t seem to really care anymore.

The ALP has long since wanted anything to do with workers . Why should they ? They’re the smartest people in the room according to themselves. They’re pure political class now. That’s who they are and they’re bored with being tethered to the DEPLORABLE beasts of burden they sadly still need for their voting base.

So please , please keep revealing your true nature so that the workers of Australia will no longer have their ambitions thwarted by your fraudulent claims to be their voice. The globalist ALP can go suck it’s own dick.

How’s that sound , comrade ?



Blowin, 1560772855

Wait a minute .....

Albo is ony 56 years old.

He grew up in housing paid for by the taxpayers. Which means he never had a house to inherit.

And he now has four properties in the most expensive real estate market in the world . Average house prices in the area are $1.5M EACH.

Just remember this little tidbit when you’re laying the boot into the regular people who work hard and dream of paying off their mortgages. You know the “under educated and over mortgaged “ aspirationals who make your stomach heave ?










Blowin, 1560773385

I saw K Rudd being his usual slappable self on TV the other morning.

He made a point of not knowing , and not caring to know , the name of the CFMMEU .

It’s getting closer. The ALP is jettisoning those bothersome workers , in order to lighten the load , so that they may ascend to the heights they so believe they are entitled.

There , they will consummate their relationship with the Extreme Left Fuctards of the Greens and form the Coalition of the Moral .

AKA the Social Justice Warriors Party.

They will then attempt to unite the nation by reiterating and casting in stone everything which divides us.

And they will then all proceed to Centrelink as they will have become Truly Unemployable.

All except for the battlers like Albo , who will live off the tithes they gleam from the serfs living on their estates.


factotum, 1560777735

"The One Nation fake working class gronk doth protest too much, methinks."

Big Bill Shakespeare.

Whoops, wrong thread?


Blowin, 1560807610

And that’s why the ALP has drifted away from its founding purpose and become the woke , ineffectual shit heap it is.

The politicians don’t understand what it’s like to have their work become insecure through the flooding of the labour force. They have no clue what it’s like to have a full time job casualised because industry has more workers than it requires thus allowing for the wholesale reduction in wages and conditions.

The ALP politicians have security of employment. Even if they are thoroughly rejected by their employers ( the electorate) they just resume duties within the party. They are never exposed to the vagaries of working life.

Anthony Albanese is hailed within the ALP and by the media as someone who’s seen the struggle. As someone in solidarity with the LABOUR that the Australian LABOR Party is supposed to represent.

Anthony Albanese is a multi millionaire through his networking abilities and the benevolence of party patrons. He has zero link to the people who are forced to compete with multitudes of foreigners for houses , jobs and living space.

Anthony Albanese doesn’t know what it’s like to graduate university only to find that his degree is worthless and that degree holders are the true dime a dozen.

None of the ALP do.

Fuck them off. Ring the bell and drop the curtain. They’ve abandoned the people.

They’ve given Adani the green light. All of their highly lauded moral superiority has been exposed as lies. No integrity. As they opposed it on the grounds of being an uncompromising stand against the destruction of the planet , it’s an even bigger fall from grace now they allow it in order to save THEIR jobs , not the jobs of any of the workers.

Fucking disgrace.



sypkan, 1560811679

Geez blowin you better tone it down a bit, a little too much truth telling there, that doesn't fit with contemporary discourse.

Can't ignore this gem though...

"...They’ve given Adani the green light. All of their highly lauded moral superiority has been exposed as lies. No integrity. As they opposed it on the grounds of being an uncompromising stand against the destruction of the planet , it’s an even bigger fall from grace now they allow it in order to save THEIR jobs , not the jobs of any of the workers.

Fucking disgrace."

greatest moral challenge of our time anyone?

All that moral superiority peddling sure fell in a big big heap...real quick when the chips were down.

Ironically, again, they'll save nothing, jobs, planet, the reef, voters, a tree, because they've shown just how pathetic they are. You've gotta stand for something, but day after day they just show they no longer stand for anything...

too long walkng both sides of the fence on every single issue, except IP of course, where it's all in, even though many minorities don't vote for them anyway, because of labor's obsession with IP....oh the irony....again!

I don't think its overstating it to say this could be the end for the labor party.

In their endeavour to be 'all things to all (wo)men', it's slowly but surely isolating everyone that once voted for them.

And now setka's talking about withdrawing funding for the labor party...

could be the beginning of the end....or a new beginning...

either way, we're fucked for a few election cycles, and it's gonna be scomo and his dysfunctional liberal party all the way...


Blowin, 1560812439

No way that LNP aren’t getting booted next election if there is a viable alternative ie NOT the ALP.

Look at the Brexit party in the UK. The ground the majors are built on is not as solid as they’d want you to believe.


Blowin, 1560812480

Peter Garret being deliberately hobbled so that he didn’t threaten to steal the spotlight of Kevin Rudd was an alarm bell to the people.

The ALP spun that into being due to Garret’s stupidity.

Sound familiar? The exact same process they are justifying their losing the unloseable election.

Standard MO for the Fake Labor Party.


Blowin, 1560812626

Everything wrong with the ALP writ large right there.

A worker claims that the ALP doesn’t represent him ? Just say he’s not a worker.

“ Authentic “ Albo , the leader of the ALP has , quite literally , never worked a day in his life outside of the ALP party cloistered workshop.

The last day I worked was the middle of January in the Pilbara.....43 degrees centigrade. You think I’m fake working class ....what does that say about the entire ALP ?

It’s the entire ALP of recent history who is fake working class.

Bill Shorten . Julia Gillard. Anthony Albanese .Kevin Rudd.

What a dreary litany of soft soled , self interested , career opportunists . None of whom has any real life experience. As close to being working class as the synthetic meat product raised in a Petri dish is to being a slab of rump steak. Is this really the best of the working class ? No. It’s a cosy club for retards who’ve never had to strive a single day in their entire lives. Fresh from university politics then parachuted straight past anyone with genuine credibility or ability into a safe Labor seat due to nothing more than their networking and arse licking .

Yet they are the very people who stab each other in the back to grab the reins of power which is granted by the united weight of the working class.

Mining tax ? Fail

Penalty rates ? Fail

Carbon scheme ? Fail

Stop Adani ? Fail.

Every failure is written off with the plea that it’s necessary to remain in power so that they can create change. But the change never comes.

It’s all just so much collateral damage so that they keep their jobs. They ignore the social contract they have with their voting base in the name of career self preservation.

Those days are done.

ALP should hurry up and die.

Not long now !




sypkan, 1560813118

"Look at the Brexit party in the UK. The ground the majors are built on is not as solid as they’d want you to believe."

absolutely!

'they' laughed at farage's brexit party, saying the brexit protest vote will never transfer to his party

seems 'they' were wrong...

again...

you've really gotta wonder how much is real analysis on their behalf, and how much is wishful thinking

because they keep getting it so wrong...

one could ask the same of the left's party platforms, how much do they believe this tripe they're selling, and how much is orders from the globalist overlords above?

because they keep getting it so wrong...

so so wrong!


Blowin, 1560813908

The ship is fatally holed but they still think they’ll be delivering us to the woke holy land.

This is where you’ll find them , sandwiched between the Australian Independents and the Australian Motoring Enthusiasts Party.

https://aec.gov.au/Parties_and_Representatives/Party_Registration/Deregistered_parties/index.htm


Westofthelake, 1560816472

Timely read I walked into regarding the Labor party and Setka.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2019/06/14/setk-j14.html


Blowin, 1560819603

It’s all there for anyone to see, Westof.

Nice to see it all put together though, cheers mate.

People don’t realise how much of a bullet has been dodged by not having the ALP in power. The LNP are ludicrously bad , but the ALP are wolves in sheep’s clothing and the sooner they are pegged as such is the sooner they can be dismissed and replaced with true worker representation. If they’d been re-elected it would have been a flood of their disingenuous identity politics used to distract and divide working class unity even further, as they convinced the people that the match towards unfettered globalisation and extreme neoliberalism is an unavoidable conclusion and somehow working in their favour .

It’s a shame this thread is relegated to the backblocks , I really enjoy the input of most people. There has been and will be much interesting and valid discussion if the petty personal shit is left behind.

I’m doing my bit.


factotum, 1560820569

Yep, Westie, I mostly concur with the article. There's a bit of a rosy picture of John-boy painted there, but if you know, well... that's why McManus is wedged. She knows. It's defo a beat-up over the Batty stuff, so to speak, but if you know the bloke and other stuff absolutely NOT related to the noises going on now, well, it's messy indeed anyway. He is a 'colourful' character, though absolutely committed to his members.

Labor is cooked. There's the election fall-out right there. The electorate has spoken and now they're all over the shop and looking in the wrong direction.

Labor's cooked, we're cooked. That's the grim reality.

If they had got in, they could have been pushed further towards the light. As they should always be when in power. Which post-war ain't very often. They should be the 'established' government we rail and kick against. Get them in and give it to 'em, but from the proletariat side, not the bourgeoisie (as expected, as always). But of course they're not.

This is Australia! Look at the half-digested media fed vomit from the Stooges above. And they're erm, 'politically engaged'! Talk about garbage in, worse garbage out.

So instead we go backwards again. And regression and damage is always hard, if not downright impossible, to 'fix' in this country, let alone offer something new. History tells us that.

Half step forward, 3 steps back.

Yew!

How good is Australia?!


factotum, 1560822383

"I’m doing my bit."

Hahahahaha. You sure have been, B.I. For years!

And it boils down to this...

"If they’d run on a reduced immigration platform they’d have a huge majority government."

B.I., I'm sure this isn't news to anyone, even the immigration glommers on here, the ones that have a stronger point of argument gathered round questions of the environment at least, well, stronger entirely relative to you...

because...

your scurrying arguments, your colourful responses, your grand over-arching vision as it were, don't even cut that mild mustard.

All roads lead back to you know where for you, don't they?

Why is this?

Actually, who really gives a shite. YOU won the election!

"There has been and will be much interesting and valid discussion if the petty personal shit is left behind."

Hahahahaha. Stop it!

Mate, your online persona here is a grubby archetype that needs constant skewering. It's a cultural cancer, always lurking, sometimes in remission, but full-blown since the mid 90s and early 2000s. And our body politic has suffered. It is suffering. My optimism is that it's not terminal. Cancer can be beaten!

Then again...

Maybe IT'S TIME!

For euthanasia laws.

Make it legal. Get it over with.

God bless Australia!!!!


factotum, 1560823480

Hahahaha, Sepp.

Did I say, "look at the half-digested media fed vomit from the Stooges above. And they're erm, 'politically engaged'! Talk about garbage in, worse garbage out"?

And then you posted THAT!?

You do know that too much Kool Aid causes neurological decline, yes?





sypkan, 1560825495

"...In an extraordinary television interview on Thursday night, Australian Council of Trade Unions (ACTU) Secretary Sally McManus said she had urged Setka to resign as Victorian state secretary of the Construction Forestry Maritime Mining and Energy Union (CFMMEU). She insisted that he should quit, even though he was “innocent” of making the reported comments.
McManus thus directly contradicted Albanese’s allegation, but still declared that Setka had to go, because of “a whole range of issues” that she did not specify. In other words, Setka’s alleged comments are a flimsy pretext to bring to a head previous plans to oust him as a union boss and Labor factional powerbroker."

Using you know what to oust him.. again...oh the irony...and again. The whole thing stinks of the kavanaugh trial - deemed guilty, no matter what

"..Writing in the Australian Financial Review on Wednesday, Phillip Coorey proclaimed: “In one move on Tuesday, Anthony Albanese asserted his authority over the Labor Party.” Albanese had “signaled a different culture to that under Bill Shorten,” his predecessor, a former union bureaucrat himself, who had relied heavily on the CFMMEU’s factional backing.
On the same day, an editorial in the Murdoch media’s Australian declared: “Anthony Albanese has finally done the right thing. After a build-up of public scorn and disgust, the Opposition Leader will move at the next meeting of the ALP’s national executive to expel militant unionist John Setka.”

Culture indeed. Bill's piss weak union culture was...well, piss weak, and now we have 'genuine' albo riding in to save the culture of the labor party. and now now, it turns out genuine albo's a bit of a joke, a bit of a fraud, a fraud with bad judgement, or at least he has an overlord with bad judgement..

Murdoch saying he's done the right thing. You know when murdoch says that,....you've done the wrong thing.

".. Notably, the same McManus who is demanding Setka’s scalp warned last December’s national Labor Party conference that a looming “tsunami” of working-class discontent would erupt unless a Labor government came to office and pretended to address growing social inequality."

Glad someone was aware of it, fuck that thursday night interview must have been hard for her.

I hope setka fights this to the bitter end and more, not least because the charge is questionable. Despite what the party think, it's not setka that's destroying the party...

and facto, you're a wanker, nothing less, and most certainly nothing more...


sypkan, 1560827780

you make no sense facto

my 'narrative' is totally different to the accepted media narrative yet you keep blabbing on...

my narrative is close to the world socialist website - which I was totally unaware of, thanks for that one westof - but it was nothng lke the accepted wisdom from your media mates

it's you that spews the ...'half-digested media fed vomit from the Stooges above. '

and the only three stooges here are factobum, talking turkey, and shattered bossom


factotum, 1560831961

Wait, I'm confused...so the world socialist website is OK by you and B.I. now??

Ipso facto, more programs and policies conceived and enacted through a 'socialist' prism are what is needed?

And this somehow trucks with the years of shtuff you've been peddling 24/7?!

Trump, Brexit, and One Nation.

FFS.

YOU MAKE NO SENSE.

Logic so twisted, it's broken.

Um, 'National Socialism' don't count!




Laurie McGinness, 1560834836

Don't waste your time facto. They can post as much nonsense as they like down here. No-one is going to see it.


sypkan, 1560836857

"Don't waste your time facto. They can post as much nonsense as they like down here. No-one is going to see it."

good onya blindboy, keeping ya no platforming idealogue mates happy


sypkan, 1560837155

never said socialist website wasn't ok

"Ipso facto, more programs and policies conceived and enacted through a 'socialist' prism are what is needed?"

possibly, call the prism what you want, I don't like the word socialist, but its pretty much what I've been pushing, the labels are so dated they mean little, especially after the sodomisation by the likes of you...

Never advocated for brexit or one nation, ever!

I'd argue I've never advocated trump, just that the alternative is so woefully corrupt and abysmal you may as well vote trump!

you've gotta stop reading what you assume people are saying ie. putting words in people's mouths, and read the words mate. your overzealous endeavour to win the internet stoush makes you look like a fool

you're confused alright, because you've been prodding your balls across the tips of fence palings for way too long, as you straddle the lefty/neo liberal fence... just like labor...


factotum, 1560837567

"you've gotta stop reading what you assume people are saying ie. putting words in people's mouths, and read the words mate. your overzealous endeavour to win the internet stoush makes you look like a fool"

There it is! We've reached peak "Sam Newman's non-self awareness disorder" AKA anosognosia.


Blowin, 1560897075

The classic thing is , Sypkan , that it’s Ol’ Constable Laurie from the Thought Police who’s opinion is best kept hidden.

The population knows what’s what .

Despite the constant gaslighting by the MSM and a few throwbacks like the Kneel and Bobbsy twins on here , the majority of Australians know full well that the non-mandated globalist push is overwhelmingly detrimental to our country.

Though it is still funny to hear the brittle old bugger blow his stack when his authoritarian dictating falls in a heap and his fragile opinions are destroyed.


factotum, 1560904355

"Though it is still funny to hear the brittle old bugger blow his stack when his authoritarian dictating falls in a heap and his fragile opinions are destroyed."

Destroyed by who? YOU??

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Watch out Gabby, there's a new pro-claimer in town!


Blowin, 1560905952

By everyone who disputes his fantasies.

You know who they are. Basically everyone except yourself.

The smart people.

Not too hard to refute the ridiculous claims that he makes ie Increased population doesn’t impact the environment, foreign investors don’t inflate house prices, Trump colluded with Russia etc etc.

There’s a litany of bullshit to dismantle for anyone who cares to wade into the morass of his self satisfied delusion.


Blowin, 1560916127

Oh , you’d like to argue that massive amounts of extra people won’t impact on the environment as Laurie did ?

Good luck with that.

Yes , he is full of shit.

And if you concur with him , you are also full of shit.


factotum, 1560918634

"There’s a litany of bullshit to dismantle for anyone who cares to wade into the morass of his self satisfied delusion."

"There it is! We've reached peak "Sam Newman's non-self awareness disorder" AKA anosognosia."

Bugger, Sepp! Beaten again! By B.I!

The Stooges are disbanding?

Yew!


factotum, 1560921349

Hahahaha. Stop it. You're killing us.

How can anyone believe anything you say on here, B.I?

YOU'RE THE MALABAR KID!

Even the other two stooges must be having doubts.

Mind, one's a socialist now, and the other one's a proud One Notion voter in the last election and keen ProMo fan...

So you must be a bit iffy about them too?

The band's breaking up!?






Blowin, 1560922468

Yeah , I know.

Seems unbelievable that someone would be stupid enough to put something like that out there , but it’s true, he said it.

So , what is it you do for a living, Facto ?

And what education have you got ?


Westofthelake, 1560940204

"Now that we’re safe from Labor’s retiree and death tax grab, their planned theft of our hard-earned franking credits, their promotion of gender-fluid lifestyles in our kindergartens, their confiscation of our utes and their freeing of hoards of Muzzy murderers and rapists to roam our streets we can relax and hit the complacency button. That was a close call. Now we’ll have three more years of stability and better economic management with the adults still in charge."

"Government by thought bubble has been in operation for six years. With no ideas and no vision, no foresight and no aspiration the crises will build, blindsiding a rag-tag assembly of colander-hatted science deniers and nose pickers whose only recourse will be to blame Labor while fellating the Senate to allow for the shovelling of more largesse to their chums. The demands from the Ginger Whinger and her feral homunculus Malcolm Roberts should provide some comedic relief."

Of more concern than Labor's problems is the fact that there's a whole circus of crazy clowns banging about in the big top.

Again.

Kaboom anyone?

https://theaimn.com/danger-uxb/


factotum, 1560943338

What do I do for a living? This and that. Who cares? Well, apart from you...

Education? I've had a few Alma Maters...maybe another one next year if I can free up some more time. And before this fucking government degrades the landscape even further.

"But it’s true, he said it."

Right..........

Like this, B.I?

"I've got a funny feeling they aren't direct BB quotes, Blowie."

"Facto - sad thing is that they are. That’s just the tip of the Blindboy bullshit iceberg. It’s all here in black and white if you care to look."

"Um, Blowie, I've cut and pasted those 'direct quotes' and they brought nothing up in Google. Nothing.

Well, from BB.

Just you pop up obviously.

So they're not direct quotes at all. As I thought.

Which doesn't look real good."

https://www.swellnet.com/forums/politico/459916?page=5

Hmmmmm.


factotum, 1560943537

But, but, LABOR...

How good is Australia?

Half step forward, 3 steps back.

Again.


Westofthelake, 1560944011

"Half step forward, 3 steps back."

Yea it's called "Doin' the Aussie 3-Step Reverse Floss"


Blowin, 1560975662

Looks like the tide may be turning on the shrill thought police

https://www.smh.com.au/education/sydney-university-to-adopt-principles-of-terrific-free-speech-code-20190619-p51zd3.html


Blowin, 1560975985

The “ demands from the ginger whinger “ are one of the only few voices in Australia’s parliament attempting to bring attention to the politically enabled energy crisis which is hobbling the economies of the states , businesses and individuals of the East coast.

Labour is no opposition to the LNP madness , so it’s only the Centre Alliance and One Nation addressing the issue.


factotum, 1560990013

Yeah, Hanson - the ex-Liberal - is 'firing up' and 'addressing' the issue. Well, last week. This week? Today?

https://thewest.com.au/business/tax/one-nation-leader-pauline-hanson-puts-new-coal-power-station-ahead-of-plans-to-back-scott-morrisons-income-tax-cuts-ng-b881225503z

Last year she wanted three new coal-fired power stations. Coalition backed her in. Didn't get the numbers.

Anyway, who's who in the senate zoo this time round?

https://www.michaelwest.com.au/australias-most-wanted-rex-patrick-and-the-senates-new-power-block/




Blowin, 1560990664

Facto - Askng you nicely, I don’t want anything to do with you anymore.

Just ignore my posts. Stay away from me.


Westofthelake, 1560991847

Re Michael West link.

Talk about balance of power....

I can't help but see Lambie as resembling a 'klingon' from Star Trek....hopefully she will keep her word towards ensuring equality for the working class re LNP tax cuts.

Half expecting Pauline to get up in the Senate and declare "It's ok to be red-haired"


indo-dreaming, 1561009710

"Facto - Asking you nicely, I don’t want anything to do with you anymore.

Just ignore my posts. Stay away from me."

IMHO we should all just ignore him, he is basically just a troll, always plays the man and never the ball.

I haven't looked in here all week, but still he is insulting me?

Dont agree with all that much Laurie/Blindboy has to say but at least he almost always plays the ball and not the man.


factotum, 1561017531

You are a ball, V.I. Sharp as a bowling ball.

And B.I., a quote from your least favourite red head, Julia Gillard,

"Stop writing crap!"

Simples.


sypkan, 1561070011

speaking of full of shit...

so much for this little gem from the resident swellnet anti echo chamber warrior...

"One of the issues that is widely mentioned in the rise of Trump and other populists is the ability of people to seek information and debate from areas of the mass media and social media where they will find those who agree with them. The viewers of Fox News are unlikely to be readers of The New Yorker and vice versa. Conservative Christians go to Facebook pages that reinforce their views. LGBT supporters go to their own pages and so on.
Swellnet, being mainly concerned with surfing, has no natural political constituency. Those contributing to the forums represent the full spectrum of opinion. This, from time to time, drives us towards what might be called incivility. Being just as guilty as anyone else on that issue I am not in a position to moralise, but what I will say is that we should value this place for the diversity of opinion it provides and hope that it never becomes an echo chamber."


Blowin, 1561072691

Classic stuff


factotum, 1561076258

"Being just as guilty as anyone else on that issue I am not in a position to moralise, but what I will say is that we should value this place for the diversity of opinion it provides and hope that it never becomes an echo chamber."

Um, hats off Sepp for ACTUALLY quoting BB DIRECTLY - not hard is it? -
BUT your ACTUAL point is??


sypkan, 1561080626

well facto I thougt my point was obvious, especially for one who likes to think he's as astute as yourself at reading between the lines...

but if I must spell it out for you....

my point is that bb claims to be cool with 'diversity of opinion', even claims the merits of swelllnet...

until labor loses 'the unlosable election' that is..... then he regresses to his default position of an overzealous narrative controlling pc nutjob no platformer.

sad and dissapointing to say the least

I thought he was making real progress in his personal development for a moment there...

the internet has unleashed a beast, for better or worse... and clearly the left of politics is struggling with this new paradigm, as 30 years of pc- ness unravels

some are unhealthily addicted to this long tired old control of narrative, as we are currently seeing across media platforms as they adjust to the new norm, and he's a shining example


Laurie McGinness, 1561097921

Sorry mate but the owners of the platform were forced to take action after complaints about the level of incivility. This was after they issued a warning about inappropriate language on the front page. I have no problem with diversity or robust debate. It was the libellous posts of one boring loudmouth troll that made me decide to put my name up there as that would at least draw a legal line he would not be likely to cross. So rattle on down here in the basement if it makes you happy.


Blowin, 1561102644

Laurie- You realise that publicly accusing someone of being a homophobe when they are demonstrably not a homophobe is libellous, dont you ?

And that I took screen shots of the offending posts.

I’m not kidding.

So maybe just slink back into your little hole with your victim routine whilst I remain gracious on the matter.

It’s unbecoming of a man of your years.


Laurie McGinness, 1561103767

Sue me anytime you like but you will have a big problem. The comment was addressed to an anonymous entity called "Blowin" the rights of this entity to the protection of its reputation are dubious to the point of non-existent.


sypkan, 1561109733

Ok, sorry I take all that back... well some of it...

seriously what the hell is wrong with people?

no one makes them click on the link, no one makes them read the link, it's the bloody internet!! look what else is out there, if you have a tendency to whinge, there's lots more worthwhile causes to focus your attention on...

if some petty name calling that doesn't include yourself ruins your day, you probably deserve it...

I find channel 7 and david koch offensive, I don't write emails to channel 7 telling them to take him off thr air. I make the adult decision to not watch, and allow those of small mind and intelligence to enjoy the fuckwit

grow the fuck up people, the world is now a place full of entitled little power hungry morons, this needs to stop!

no offence swellnet, but you should ignore such patheticness

maybe they should lighten up and toughen up a bit, rather than expecting the world to always conform and contort to them


sypkan, 1561109920

having said all that, I reckon threatening to sue is poor form

this is not america!!!!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bdw1Pw4nIv0


Blowin, 1561112070

Sypkan .... as if I’d threaten to sue. I’m just stirring. Screen shots of offensive posts ? Mate , I’d deserve every possible insult you can dream up if it were true.

Anyway-Laurie , Facto. Let’s give it us rest . We’ve , all three of us , fucked up a good thing here. We’ve all acted like children at various times. Most of the time lately.

This isn’t just boring, it’s embarrassing for all of us .

I’ve acted like a prick. I won’t anymore. But I’ll need a hand to do so because I’m no saint. So I’m formally apologising for antagonising you both. You’ve got to act in kind though. No one has to be sniveling toadies, just don’t acknowledge me for awhile and if you do , don’t be bitchy.

I’ll do the same. If we disagree then just dispute the issue, not takedown the person.

Cheers.


sypkan, 1561120259

I wasnt really having a go at you blowin. I know you were just reacting to threats...

Good onya for the above

We all get a bit loose on here. Bloody internet.... and politics!!


factotum, 1561128060

"If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for everything."

"Politics is the art of the possible."

Somewhere in between these two poles, ideology and realpolitik, sit our two major political parties.

And of course there's oscillation, when in power, sometimes towards more ideology, sometimes towards more realpolitik.

My contention is that the Liberal party since Howard has been explicitly tilted towards the ideological when in power.

And their ideology? Anyone got a real clue?

Have a go to get a go?!

https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2019/jun/06/socialism-for-the-rich-the-evils-of-bad-economics?CMP=fb_gu&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR2fJJFKGFGx8ILIlX-7V6ZqxvnrvhEwSVCvTOf9mNUTwohjxJBcsmDVeOg#Echobox=1559816208

I included this article (third time's a charm?) because it's a neat summation of the ideology propelling the likes of our government, and the 'false consciousness' that develops and is encouraged in the wider culture.

In Australia, this neo-liberal genie has been out of the bottle for 35 years or so. And where Labor tilted towards realpolitik in reaction, the Libs have gone full ideological. And why not? It's their revolution.

So chaps, back to the now. And the real world. Australia. With its media. And its history. And its innate conservatism!

Yep. Innate conservatism.

Don't think so?

As the meme goes, "change my mind."

I don't want to offend anyone's 'national pride' here, but we're not who we like to think we are as a nation. We're not 'firebrand rebels', I don't even know if we're larrikins anymore ("a person with APPARENT disregard for convention") if we ever were.

We're a nation of class clowns if anything. Bound up in class with the teacher at the front and centre.

Sure, there'll be times when some freak will break a window or punch the relief teacher, but that's what they'll be...a freak. An outlier. And we'll talk about 'em, and revel in their acts, secretly or not, but the majority of us are content with a few wisecracks up the back of the class and a cig behind the toilet blocks, or just hearing about it...if even that.

So, being who we really are, how the fuck is a political party gonna get 'radical' in this country for reals?

Whitlam's government got dismissed! Gillard's, even with her relatively pissy reforms and programs and policies (well to me), got crucified by the media. And now Labor going forward with even pissier reforms (again to me) didn't even get a guernsey.

Meanwhile the Libs are a worsening abomination that we keep voting in directly and by proxy (hello Pauline & Clive!)

And you Stooges reckon that's because what? Labor aren't bold enough?!

More ideology and less realpolitik is the go?

The sad truth is we're cooked if Labor is cooked. And I have always thought Labor was too far to the right. Politically and economically. Since I could vote. But then that's me. But the gronks on the other side of the chamber??

Let's get deep fried, full Seppo style.

Time to get real, hey fellas?

Them?

And/or you?






factotum, 1561128285

Blowie, surprise, YOU aren't the 'people of Australia'.

Like our PM giving himself a nickname, YOU can't give yourself that representative role and expect to be what? believed about anything??

Clive Palmer has got more 'voice of the people' cred than you, let alone Pauline.

Old Mr Creosote garnered the biggest overall swing outta the whole circus.

Still pissy, but with preferences both him and Pauline pushed ProMo over the line into a one seat HoR majority.

YOUR Pauline.

What does THAT tell us?

Clive and our ad-man ProMo's bought and sold flim flam plus both them and Pauline's FEAR shtick (covering all bases) is all you need to succeed?

Sheesh.

And Blowie, like your new go-to boys, the MBers, somehow all our wage and infrastructure and environmental and overall cultural and economic and social problems will magically resolve themselves if we just cut 'immigration'? What type and kinds, well, whatever, just cut it back. Preferably people of a certain erm, hue, and um, background.

Have the MBs gone into that sort of detail yet? At all??

Lest we forget their cut and pasting a paragraph or two from a couple of chapters in a 20 chapter, 5 part, 328 page book called The Wages Crisis in Australia: What it is and what to do about it, for example.

Sterling 'work' by the boys to what end?

Has Rupert put in an offer yet for their site?

I get the feeling - and the feels are all that matters it seems - that Australia is cooked. Deep fried, Seppo style.


factotum, 1561160440

And Sepp - king of the Trumpy Bannon buzzwords - dude, you cannot be serious!

Spouting "Australia, don't become America"?!

Hahahahahaha.

Never fear...

https://goat.com.au/australia/your-favourite-aussie-insult-is-back-in-vogue-and-your-mates-are-in-big-trouble/


sypkan, 1561167484

and how did I know you'd be here? saying ecactly that as I wrote it?

as I've said before ...as predictable as a poo...


factotum, 1561179069

And how'd I know you would be here posting something that doesn't make a lot of sense?

'Cos it's what you do, Sepp.

Even your little retort "predictable as poo" is pretty nonsensical if you have a think about it.

There's the rub. Thinking. Before posting.

More haste, less speed.

Again.

Ad infinitum. Ad nauseam.


factotum, 1561179875

Hahahahahahahaha. STOP IT.

Literally.

Or deal with it, B.I.

"As I have observed, those who plow iniquity, and those who sow trouble, reap the same." - Job 4:8

Whoops, wrong thread?


sypkan, 1561184006

dunno about you but my poo's pretty predictable...

between 8 and 9 every morning

....if ya interested...


factotum, 1561197517

No one's interested in your shit.

Well, that's not true.

Larry & Moe may still hold a torch?


velocityjohnno, 1561291173

this link is of interest - coming from Off-Guardian it's even more interesting. (Off Guardian formed by former staff who thought Guardian was too right wing and had sold out...)

https://off-guardian.org/2019/06/21/global-warming-carbon-dioxide-and-the-solar-minimum/

"In other words, before any of the science had been done, the IPCC’s assumption was that man-made activity was responsible and that Nature was not an active participant in a process within its own sphere of interest. As an interdisciplinary topic of multiple diversity, the IPCC is not an authority on all the disciplines of science within the CC domain.

While there is no dispute among scientists that the Sun and its cyclical output is the true external force driving Earth’s energy and climate system as part of a Sun-centered Universe, the IPCC’s exclusion of the Sun from its consideration can only be seen as a deliberate thwarting of a basic fundamental law of science, a process which assures a free inquiry based on reason and evidence."


indo-dreaming, 1561331088

Interesting read.

The more i read about this the more confused i get, i wouldn't call myself a human driven climate change denier, but I'm certainly a skeptic, the hard part is just trying to figure out what is true and what is BS that you read on the subject, the trouble is its now so much about money and politics on both sides of the debate.

Im sitting right on the fence on this one, just watching and waiting, it going to be interesting how we all view this topic in 20 years time.

I personally wont be surprised either way.


indo-dreaming, 1561502203

1 day 23 hours ago without a post in political forum.

I think this is a record.


Laurie McGinness, 1561622029

The rapist in the White House.
https://www.thecut.com/2019/06/donald-trump-assault-e-jean-carroll-other-hideous-men.html


Laurie McGinness, 1561622388

Just the usual rubbish science, vj. Off-guardian are a fake news site. There are two outright lies in the first few paragraphs. The first is that carbon dioxide was considered as the sole cause of climate change and the second is that the Sun was not taken into account. I mean bullshit doesn't even begin to describe that level of wilful ignorance ........ or well paid hypocrisy.


tubeshooter, 1561624084

Here's why your'e wrong..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpkQEq75y18


Laurie McGinness, 1561627418

...........but so is everyone else!


velocityjohnno, 1564381592

Now that this one's off the front page, not a reply for a month... how telling is that?!
Some of you just want to see your words out there on the big screen!

Any way, I'll see your Off-Guardian and raise you some more left-of-the-Guardian, Off Guardian: a very good piece on how Eastern Europe was treated once in the EU.

https://off-guardian.org/2019/07/27/the-eus-other-periphery/

"With the decimation of indigenous industry, the role of financialization and debt became crucial, as the new capitalist economies required a financial services industry that could support the growing tendencies towards property speculation and asset manipulation.

Different vulnerabilities arose from the actions of different institutions, but the overall effect was to create state dependency upon foreign direct investment (FDI), and support from the World Bank, IMF and the specially created European Bank for Reconstruction and Development (EBRD).

The general financialization of the region led to huge increases in debt, both personal and institutional."


factotum, 1564902811

They walk amongst us hidden in plain sight...

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-paso-shooting-and-the-gamification-of-terror/


factotum, 1565139234

An interesting historical take. Dads with young(ish) sons...or anyone really...have a look.

https://medium.com/@DaleBeran/why-does-8chan-exist-at-all-33a8942dbeb2


truebluebasher, 1565572521

Sacrificial Lamb Pell used Old Testament twitter scripture to out-fox 'MAP' security.
The immaculate deception elevates Pell beyond Sainthood to Son of God.

Melbourne Assessment Prison (Illegal Twitter text in part reads...)
"My faith in our Lord, like yours, is a source of strength.The knowledge that my small suffering can be used for good purposes through being joined to Jesus' suffering gives me purpose and direction."

No mention of Victims/Families suffering....only of our Lord Pell's suffering!
Doubtful our beloved selfish monster can reform with any more love in his heart.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/pell-s-letter-from-prison-being-investigated-by-justice-department-20190810-p52fsk.html

Scomo's Holy War advocates freedom to practice religion.(Unconditionally!)

(pause) Who else is smelling another 'Izzy' (Higher Power prisoner exemption).

Prison security breach buys immediate extra time on sentence. (It's gone quiet!)

'Vic 'MAP' labelled sacrilegious for denying martyr the right to brainwash sheep?'
Pell plays his... [ 'Get outta Jail free card' ] Lock up your sons...."The Resurrection"


sypkan, 1566693536

An interesting historical take. Dads with young(ish) sons...or anyone really...have a look.

https://medium.com/@DaleBeran/why-does-8chan-exist-at-all-33a8942dbeb2

well that was some deep dark shit.

I knew of most of those stories but haven't seen them put together like that. Scary stuff. some excellent journalism, aside from a paragragh or two...


factotum, 1566981843

From that article above...

"As the philosopher Slavoj Zizek points out in his book Trouble in Paradise, conservatism generates a “protective bubble” around the individual from capitalism. The constant invitations to a nihilistic lifestyle of empty materialism can be rebuffed by holding fast to a set of religious values, which offer a fuller, more optimistic conception for the point of existence. And the inherently isolating way capitalism tears apart social bonds is similarly inured by clinging to traditional modes of behavior."

Allied to the rise and appeal of fundamentalist Islam as a bulwark of sorts against consumer capitalism?


Sheepdog, 1576634740

The surfing community has always been at the forefront of politics. ALWAYS.
Such a shame the owners here have "PC'd out


factotum, 1578104746

News Corp. Rupe and son.

Worth looking at Rupe's MO. There's always worthy stuff in his political output on all platforms. BUT...the majority of it is as biased as he is. And he's always hedged his political bets in the past (Only up to a point. He likes to be seen as a winner and power-broker par excellence), especially in the broadsheets past, and now on the internet, BUT AGAIN...as he gets older, and as corporate media as a whole gets baser, well, he's REALLY starting to out himself as the propaganda merchant he always has been. It's really naked now.

And his son Lachlan is even more nakedly and purely political and further to the right. I'm guessing though that $$$$ may temper that at some stage.

Then again, stay tuned for SKY After Dark on free-to-air in the metropolitan regions. It's already a reality in the rural regions through WIN. Our very own Oz style FOX News.

I wonder how that will affect our politics?!

Either way, we're not best served by the Murdoch business empire (We as in 'we, the little people').

Check this Murdoch Empire primer. Yeah, it's The Guardian (the 'leftie' rag that officially backed Shorten's Labor this election in the editorial stakes, but funnily enough didn't last election. Actually, this one was surprising to me. The Sydney Morning Herald backed Labor in its pre-election editorial this time around...for only the 8th time ever! All Murdoch rags backed ProMo except the NT news!), but it is researched and concurs with and backs up longer studies, and books, produced elsewhere. Worth a perusal if you're genuinely interested.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/20/very-australian-coup-murdoch-turnbull-political-death-news-corps

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/21/inside-the-news-corp-tribe-how-powerful-editors-shape-the-news

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/22/follow-the-money-how-news-corp-wields-power-to-defend-its-interests

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/24/the-lachlan-ascendancy-is-news-corp-heading-for-a-cultural-change




factotum, 1599199893

"And that ridiculous, nay stupid, bollocks you wrote yesterday about why people are coming down this way, Blowie, was very revealing. Well, not really. Your veneer was stripped off long ago. Even accounting for the goldfish memories on here."

"White flight is when people who didn’t grow up in high density crush zones with a high proportion of foreign culture move to an area where they are surrounded by a culture they are comfortable with. You know , that’s why people move to a whitebread town like Margaret River, to be amongst a familiar culture."

Yelling out 'ad hominem' ain't cutting it, Moey. What a crock of ridiculous shit!

At least this crud was funny. Kinda.

"Australia in the period 75-95 was as good as life has ever been for anyone in the history of the world."

Curls & Larry loved it! Didn't get the joke, but. Says it all.


pipahaha, 1640233965

I look forward to receiving more useful information like this! https://wordcounter.tools


basesix, 1695512869

nice nostalgic thread...
Glenelg vs Sturt SANFL grand final today, if yr bored.
to watch you can sign up for a 7-day free trial, then cancel subs later if you want.
https://www.sanflnow.com.au/videos/gfc-v-sfc-2023-hostplus-sanfl-men-s-league-grand-final


sypkan, 1697803726

"Dismantle The Censorship-Industrial Complex: The Westminster Declaration

We write as journalists, artists, authors, activists, technologists, and academics to warn of increasing international censorship that threatens to erode centuries-old democratic norms.

Coming from the left, right, and centre, we are united by our commitment to universal human rights and freedom of speech, and we are all deeply concerned about attempts to label protected speech as ‘misinformation,’ ‘disinformation,’ and other ill-defined terms.

This abuse of these terms has resulted in the censorship of ordinary people, journalists, and dissidents in countries all over the world.

Such interference with the right to free speech suppresses valid discussion about matters of urgent public interest, and undermines the foundational principles of representative democracy.

Across the globe, government actors, social media companies, universities, and NGOs are increasingly working to monitor citizens and rob them of their voices. These large-scale coordinated efforts are sometimes referred to as the ‘Censorship-Industrial Complex.’

This complex often operates through direct government policies. Authorities in India[1] and Turkey[2] have seized the power to remove political content from social media. The legislature in Germany[3] and the Supreme Court in Brazil[4] are criminalising political speech. In other countries, measures such as Ireland’s ‘Hate Speech’ Bill[5], Scotland’s Hate Crime Act[6], the UK’s Online Safety Bill[7], and Australia’s ‘Misinformation’ Bill[8] threaten to severely restrict expression and create a chilling effect.

But the Censorship Industrial Complex operates through more subtle methods. These include visibility filtering, labelling, and manipulation of search engine results. Through deplatforming and flagging, social media censors have already silenced lawful opinions on topics of national and geopolitical importance. They have done so with the full support of ‘disinformation experts’ and ‘fact-checkers’ in the mainstream media, who have abandoned the journalistic values of debate and intellectual inquiry.

We do not want our children to grow up in a world where they live in fear of speaking their minds. We want them to grow up in a world where their ideas can be expressed, explored and debated openly – a world that the founders of our democracies envisioned when they enshrined free speech into our laws and constitutions..."

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/dismantle-censorship-industrial-complex-westminster-declaration

what a list!

I'd rather be assiciated that list... than factlessdalecoopershateredbossomwhitemanscream's hit listers...









gsco, 1697849060

Censorship-industrial complex, that’s a good one.

And that’s exactly what it is. We’re now moving head first into the censorship wars in which individual “fact checking” services are being set up but are aligned with one side of politics (like our ABC):

https://twitter.com/Heritage/status/1715430807639097576

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/elon-musk-newsguard-fact-checker/2023/10/19/id/1138987/


sypkan, 1698465402

did leigh sales just join gsco's 'far right rabbit hole' vanlyfe tour?

or is 'reality' just getting too hard to ignore?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theaustralian.com.au/business/media/abc-host-leigh-sales-criticises-journalists-for-being-activists-and-crusaders-blaming-it-for-lack-of-trust-in-media/news-story/2afa2267f9c69237ec07840d2677b5cb%3famp


frog, 1698468831

Yep, Aunty ABC joined the JWs (Journahovas Witnesses) a few years ago.

You. MUST believe otherwise you will fall into the hellish abys of disinformation.


Pop Down, 1698471582

Is gsco's vanlyfe ??? tour , like a Coming OUT Tour ?

Or is it I'm Going INTO retirement ( van life ) and I am looking for another job like tour ,


Pop Down, 1698472906

I couldn't read the whole article .

Leigh has been a household name in Australia for a long time .

An important role at the ABC .

I think , the ABC has been very consistent , for 20 years plus , politically , while she has been there , and before her arrival .

I am guessing , she doesn't include herself , in the SOME journalists , group .


sypkan, 1698473470

[quote=Pop Down]Is gsco's vanlyfe ??? tour , like a Coming OUT Tour ?

Or is it I'm Going INTO retirement ( van life ) and I am looking for another job like tour ,[/quote]

I think its more an... 'I can no longer afford / find accomodation in australia - because the goverment has fucked up everything... so fuck it... I'm going to live in my van and read too much shit on the internet tour'

been there a few times myself... does give you time to read a lot... and time to check out for a while, ...and reflect...

as did leigh sales

seems she's come to the same page / conclusion as gsco

people stuck in the daily grind will probably never get it, way too busy, with way too much routine

routine is good, makes you productive...

but terribly blinkered


Pop Down, 1698475649

I don't believe Leigh is ready to retire and move to Bali .

I believe she loves Australia and overseas travel , First Class , of course .

She has Clout .

I think this Rose ( one of the prickly ones which usually smell the nicest :) has more blooming to do .

Not ready for any compost heap , yet .

She might join Tony on the Board at Fox ?

It would be funny if they did work together .
Leigh absolutely made mince meat out of Tony , numerous times .
Poor Tony is too honest ( not at all suited for a pollie role ) and couldn't lie straight in bed haha .
I bet Tony likes her .

They say if U want to hate Tony , don't meet him .


I hope so , she is very smart , imho .

A routine is vital for humans ! Look at Hunter Gathers , one year into a gazillion seasons ( so cool ) , nearly .

To make sure U don't get blinkered , remember to let in the light and do something just for fun .
Like singing with the kids or going surfing .


frog, 1698476585

A very good talk by Leigh Sales. I expect a few journos in the room had sweaty armpits through embarrassment listening to it.

Good that she hinted that the ABC was part of the problem and was not just naughty News Corp.

And the terrible binary option certain politicians presented - Dan - and media breathlessly reported as essential by many (lockdown and be safe or let it rip and advocate killing people) propoganda style covid coverage was her main example.


sypkan, 1698477723

seems a lot of crew are ready to say enough is enough...

https://twitter.com/RichardDawkins/status/1718070593445126565


sypkan, 1698477771

the slippery language game hasn't served us well


Pop Down, 1698480460

syp

U are right .

Has been a big problem through the ages .

Especially if there is only ONE source of information .

I stopped listening to and watching all mainstream news ages ago for important information or analysis .

I believe ALL journalists , even Leigh , project their views , even if subconsciously , I do , most people do imo .

They have a difficult job . Have to pretend to be experts in so many complicated conundrums .

Some do it so well imho .

My mum believes everything Leigh says , actually , anything she sees on the Telly .

That is fine , I expect that ( it's the ones that chop and change with opinion polls that shit me ) .
That is good .

Where it can become a big problem , is if it is Public Owned and has a Charter to be unbiased ( according to whoever is in charge ) .

We will either Labor or LNP in charge for ages imho .

We could have ABC 1 as Labor and 2 for the LNP , fuck it , give 3 and 4 to other aspirants for control .

Everyone goes where they want !


sypkan, 1701871947

I used to think uni's and academia were so broken because they were trying too hard to appease dumb rich kids... customers...

but nah, the whole thing is broken, starting from the very top

https://twitter.com/EricRWeinstein/status/1732285819376095489

and, as the comments suggest...

imagine swapping out the word jews with muslim or black people...

imagine the reaction... the meltdown...

and, this all started with open slather being unleashed on white people...

racism is ugly, whatever the form


sypkan, 1701872188

also, whatever happened to...

'words are violence'

these useless dogs have so many double standards its hard to believe anyone takes them seriously

yet here we are...


sypkan, 1701872992

thats the non gender specific version of 'dogs'...

(before someone starts)


green room, 1701891627

Hey sypkan, dig reading your posts, man! You're one of the real ones on this site, keeping it real with the facts and not just regurgitating that left-wing ideology.

Dude, our universities are a total mess, no fixing that dumpster fire.

They've turned into toxic hotbeds breeding activists all about that radical leftism and anti-Western Marxism crap. I'm talking antisemitism, pro Islamic terrorism, decolonization, post-colonialism, critical race theory, LGBTIQA+ queer theory, radical anti-male feminism, post-structuralism, post-modernism, indigenous studies, eco cult warrior activism – you name it. It's like a buffet of socialist revolution ideology.

You can forget about teaching real, evidence-based stuff like history, economics, law, political science, philosophy, even natural sciences. All these foundational subjects are now just drenched in this radical Marxist nonsense.

We're raising a whole bunch of citizens who straight-up despise our society. They've ditched our values of freedom, individual liberty, liberal democracy, the rule of law, equal rights, freedom of speech, personal responsibility, rational scientific inquiry, religious tolerance, and cultural pluralism. Students are being brainwashed to believe these are just white privilege power structures that oppress everyone else, so they gotta be torn down. Comrades, unite for the cultural revolution!

Our universities are a lost cause, man. But hey, there are new ones popping up, like UATX: https://www.uaustin.org/, that are all about teaching the real liberal arts deal in the enlightenment tradition. Check it out!


old-dog, 1701894582

I'm hearing you pal. The so-called progressive looney left always go too far until the silent majority get fed up and turn against them. Hence the emergence of the equally disgusting far right white supremacy movement. The woke sheep don't mind you having an opinion as long as it's the same as theirs. Today the extinction rebellion activist idiots are causing traffic disruptions in Melbourne and doing untold harm to a worthy cause. Cheers.


basesix, 1701894723

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIMrlXRD3_8


green room, 1702330664

Yo, dudes, did someone say universities are broken, infected with left ideology?

Bari Weiss is the realest queens of our era, no equal. Standing up and fighting the spread of extreme left totalitarian ideology infecting Western civilization.

This ideology is a mental illness that straight-up despises the voting public, thinking they're uneducated imbeciles that can't make the right calls for the country. So it's derailing democracy by setting up this massive paternalistic nanny state public service blob stacked with folks who worship cultural Marxism. Big government they say! They're also pushing these censorship and disinfo laws, aimed at silencing the conservative center-right. It's all about totalitarian top-down control, snatching democratic choice from the people and putting it in the hands of the left 'elite' public service blob. The Long March of the Left has reached its destination in all our institutions.

Down under, they tried to pull this antidemocratic stunt on you with 'The Voice,' attempting to hook up special racist political rights and snatch decision-making from regular folks into the hands of city-educated Marxist 'elite' crew. And your universities are infected by it more than you think: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-11-17/qut-defends-removing-merit-from-hiring-policy/103114562.

But the left Marxist ideology pathology got seriously called out by the Hamas terrorist attacks and war on Israel. The left 'elites' in our universities showed their true colors, siding with Islamic terrorists and letting anti-Semitism run wild on our campuses!

Australia, seriously, save yourself while you still can. Stand up! Fight back! We are in a battle for civilization and freedom!

https://twitter.com/theammind/status/1734276200904757386

https://twitter.com/nfergus/status/1734093796759994560

https://twitter.com/michaelshermer/status/1734270074972971132


AndyM, 1702332795

To quote old mate Chomsky -

"(post modernism) is extremely convenient, you can beat people over the head with your opinions with perfect self-confidence because there's no reality anyway, it's just their narrative and your narrative".


frog, 1702630321

Opinions are unsafe microaggressions unless they are acceptably "progressive".

Word salad combinations of:

equality, safe, inclusive, diverse, justice, trigger, privilege, systemic, affirmation, colonial, patriarchy, lateral violence etc.

are now sufficient to get a distinction in most Uni essays and are a firm basis for a PHD with some AI content thrown in.

In engineering degrees, such progressive answers are now acceptable instead of answering difficult exam questions on structural design or on voltage, current and resistance which are inevitably unfairly biased towards the mathematically literate.


Coaster, 1702639779

Yes, and afterwards they’ll be eligible for a role in a large organisation’s People and Talent Group, formerly known as HR.


sypkan, 1703240873

a bit of a reality check...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aTfwqvNuk44

(especially for labor and their current policies - they should all have to sit in a room, watch this, then answer questions!)


sypkan, 1704097951

'hoeflation'

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/has-feminism-and-hoeflation-destroyed-dating-west


velocityjohnno, 1704189102

That's a pretty good summary of what the internet has revealed over the last 1/2 decade or so. Question, is it real and applicable to Australia as much as it seems in the US now? I'd have no idea if it is tbh.


lostdoggy, 1704189607

Re: hoeflation

Read like the biggest pile of shit I’ve ever seen by a complete loser that has serious trouble getting laid.


sypkan, 1704769628

sounds a pretty reasonable asessment of the year ahead

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/joe-biden-will-pull-out-of-2024-presidential-race-jpmorgan-predicts/news-story/88b0411a6cf89a8c8dfe79a2ea5e366f

biden is irredeemable

and electric scooters are a pain in the arse...


sypkan, 1705152562

any market dudes with an hour and a half of their life to waste?

the first half's a bit over my head, but it all kinda resonates with a lot of what's currently going on...

(he assures us there is no conspiracy and there are no lizard people...)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dk3AVceraTI


monkeyboy, 1705209411

[quote=sypkan]any market dudes with an hour and a half of their life to waste?

the first half's a bit over my head, but it all kinda resonates with a lot of what's currently going on...

(he assures us there is no conspiracy and there are no lizard people...)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dk3AVceraTI[/quote]

I've read the book. The premise is based on a change in definition of security entitlement in the US, UK and Europe and essentially who owns what...not you in other words.

So, extrapoloating a bit - basically if you "own" anything that has a debt attached to it what he is saying, and what the definition appears to say is that...actually you dont own it, the entity that holds the debt is entitled to it.

I need to read it again...back when I read it mid last year I started trying to piece what that meant if you held shares, ETFs and even a home loan using debt. And then what would that also mean if the ETF you bought held any debt and what me as a holder in units of the fund was actually entitled to.

Anyway, it was too much for my brain.

I'm no conspiracy theorist. If you look at major western economy trends the amount of "public" debt is huge and not slowing down. Who owns this debt and therefore who is entitled to the so called assets that underpin this debt.

Anyway, we have property rights in Australia but....read the constitution, it's pretty weak.

I think we are in one of the safest jurisdictions in the world. Just try to make sure you own things in your name, stay liquid and ideally without much debt.








frog, 1705234898

I would not be at all surprised if the legal framework has been set to allow a "great taking" as per the book. But it would be more likely be for the purpose of targeted "taking" (rather than some mass theft across all peoples) at some point to individuals and groups deemed to be stepping out of line.

Keep the masses onside with bread and circuses but fearful of being targeted for "the taking". Then strip the wealth of the targets as needed.

This could be internal in the US....

People campaign for or donate to Trumpy? Then they are insurrectionists in current Democrat logic. Flick the switch and all their wealth is confiscated to fund the Democrat campaign to "save" democracy and freedom. One party rule is just a few steps away.

Far fetched 5 years ago. Quite plausible today.

Or it could be for internationally geopolitical chess i.e. to more readily target the elite's wealth in countries not part of the Empire in geopolitical conflicts to penalise them or have leverage over certain assets to encourage a coup against a non compliant leader.

The tools for total control (mass surveilance, AI etc.) and massive wealth accumulation are largely in place...

And, given the path to being a political, federal bureaucratic or mega business elite, in places like the US, almost self selects for sociopath and psychopath characteristics, such tools would be willingly used by many currently in positions of power.




velocityjohnno, 1705304856

Hey Sypkan I had a look. Need to go back and read further.

I found two summaries that took his vid and put it into quick paragraphs that were OK

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2024/01/the_great_taking_you_really_no_longer_own_your_securities_and_you_could_also_lose_your_freedom.html

https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/geopolitics/the-great-taking-how-they-can-own-it-all/

It seems to appeal to the American liberty minded blogs, lots reporting on it. I've seen this before where they all for example go nuts and claim that the COMEX is insolvent, let's bring it down by exercising on silver etc etc etc, nothing happens...

Recent test cases were MF Global in about 2013ish, and the recent crypto exchanges going down...

Excerp from first link:

"In 1970, the Banking and Securities Industry Committee (BASIC) was established to standardize and automate the processing of securities certificates and set uniform rules for trading and settlements. This led to the creation of the Depository Trust Corporation (DTC) in 1973, a Fed subsidiary that would serve as a repository for all securities. Now known as the Depository Trust & Clearing Corporation (DTCC), it is the world’s largest electronic depository of securities. Curiously, Webb points out, William Dentzer, a career CIA operative with no background in finance and banking, was made chairman and CEO of the DTC.

The next step was amending the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC) to redefine ownership of securities and change bankruptcy laws. Full-fledged ownership was changed to “security entitlements,” and the investor was transmogrified into an “unsecured creditor” with mere pro-rata securities claims. Legal ownership now vests in the entity that controls, but does not really own, the securities. Issuers can borrow pooled securities as collateral for trading and financing or confiscate them on insolvency. Securities are now fungible assets held in pooled form, to be taken as needed sans judicial review."

I'd have to investigate and confirm to satisfy my own interest (joy! More reading the small print and law!), for US, and then go looking to see if in Aus as well - do the guy's claims stack up? Never heard of him prior to this. If so, we've lived under this system for a long time and it hasn't done this (Sep 2008 came close to total failure) - doesn't mean it can't happen if the framework is in place. Even if it does, they won't get my classic surfboards cos that possession is 9/10s of the shed space mwhahaha!


batfink, 1707025955

[quote=green room]Dude, our universities are a total mess, no fixing that dumpster fire.

They've turned into toxic hotbeds breeding activists all about that radical leftism and anti-Western Marxism crap. I'm talking antisemitism, pro Islamic terrorism, decolonization, post-colonialism, critical race theory, LGBTIQA+ queer theory, radical anti-male feminism, post-structuralism, post-modernism, indigenous studies, eco cult warrior activism – you name it. It's like a buffet of socialist revolution ideology.

You can forget about teaching real, evidence-based stuff like history, economics, law, political science, philosophy, even natural sciences. All these foundational subjects are now just drenched in this radical Marxist nonsense.![/quote]

I’m going to go out on a limb here and suggest that people on here complaining about universities becoming “toxic hotbeds of anti-western Marxism crap” hasn’t been on a university campus since the ‘80’s, if at all. Certainly not Australian universities, and your general willingness to swallow American cultural war bullshit that has absolutely no relevance to Australia is really quite naive.

It just ain’t happening here. That busload of genuine leftists in Australia don’t have that much clout.

And green room, those “evidence based stuff like history, law, economics, political economy and philosophy” aren’t actually ‘evidence-based studies’, except perhaps making an exception for law, which at least studies precedents and common law.

You couldn’t be further from the truth citing them as ‘evidence-based’. They are a contest of ideas, no more or less than that. Even history!

By the way, there seems to be a common melt-brain, zero-synapse fear of the leftist cultural Marxism taking over the world stuff here. Let me assure you, from the other side, that the right wing philosophies are absolutely smashing the left in the contest of arguments (but not ideas, the right has no ideas). The right are killing it. They are even sending in pawns like you into fight wars that don’t even exist here (and not really in USA either)

Cultural Marxism! Critical Race Theory! Moral relativism! The rightards here and everywhere squeal and squirm at just reading those terms, and yet none have the slightest idea what they mean.

And here’s a hint - they are such abused terms that like ‘woke’, they don’t really mean anything any more.

But it’s worth making some genuine enquiry to see what they really meant, and you’d probably be surprised to learn that they are rather inoffensive terms that aren’t particularly disagreeable in the most part.

And if you doubt whether ‘the right’ are winning the culture wars (that they invariably started) just look at the postings on the swellnet forums. It’s a rightard fantasy land in here.


Pop Down, 1707028455

I don't feel I am going out on a Limb by saying OUR Universities definitely follow the Lead set buy the US Universities .

The USA has the MOST prestigious Universities on the Planet .

Some US Universities are segregating students based on race .
I read their reasons for doing so .

ALL Universities require Funding from Outside sources .

Have a look at how well Biden old Uni was treated .

Both my daughters are at Uni and OUR Uni's aren't Hot Beds of Marxism lol haha lol !

Monash was like that when I was there in the 70 and 80's .

But that was US students .
At Monash our leaders name was RED , really !

Scared off Fraser and we locked Prince Charles Up , somewhere haha or visa versa !

I was a spectator , and only in the Surf Club ( we ran a tournament at Bells , somehow ) .

Most Teachers , Lecturers and Tutors at our schools and Universities have always been firmly Left ( Socialist ) , mostly . Same with Journalists .


san Guine, 1707044026

Great post Batfink.





seeds, 1707044459

Yes indeed.
I’ll have what Batfink is having.


sypkan, 1707718562

bernie bro goes rogue...

https://www.usfra.org/groups/PoliticallyIncorrect/videos/plandemic-3-the-great-awakening-full-unedited-movie


batfink, 1708115210

[quote=Pop Down]I don't feel I am going out on a Limb by saying OUR Universities definitely follow the Lead set buy the US Universities .

The USA has the MOST prestigious Universities on the Planet .

Some US Universities are segregating students based on race .
I read their reasons for doing so .

ALL Universities require Funding from Outside sources .

Have a look at how well Biden old Uni was treated .

Both my daughters are at Uni and OUR Uni's aren't Hot Beds of Marxism lol haha lol !

Monash was like that when I was there in the 70 and 80's .

But that was US students .
At Monash our leaders name was RED , really !

Scared off Fraser and we locked Prince Charles Up , somewhere haha or visa versa !

I was a spectator , and only in the Surf Club ( we ran a tournament at Bells , somehow ) .

Most Teachers , Lecturers and Tutors at our schools and Universities have always been firmly Left ( Socialist ) , mostly . Same with Journalists .[/quote]

True Pops. Most lecturers are lefties, except in the business schools, because they are mostly just preaching slightly right of centre ideas. Oh, and engineering, because they don’t do politics, oh, and science and medicine because they are actually about the science and don’t really give a stuff about politics (and generally aren’t good at it).

So that leaves the social sciences, where it’s fair to assume that most lecturers are lefties. So that’s about 20% of the average uni staff, and that’s declining because the LNP don’t want people to learn ‘the humanities’. So a dwindling number of academics are lefties, granted.

And they wield no power, none at all.

And mostly they are of the real left because they are still thinking and learning. Not the confected left, this supposed army of people everywhere espousing CRT and Marxism (what even is that?). Just the real left, the group of people who think there is a real debate to be had about where the market mechanisms are best deployed and where markets should not be left to their own devices because the results are always bad.

And US universities do rank highly in terms of prestige and academic research output, as does UK, China, and a few other countries.

Our universities do not follow the lead of US universities in any significant way. Mostly the Aus unis suffer from a cultural cringe with respect to Europe, not the US. But that’s another topic.

“Some US universities are segregating based on race”.

Segregating? Did you really mean that word? That they have ‘whites only’ areas, and toilets, and taps and classes, and ‘blacks only’ areas, and bubblers, and taps, and classes?

Is that what you meant by ‘segregating’?

Really! You’re going to go with that?

And journalist? Mostly leftist. Fark, I can’t think of any genuine lefty journalist but I can name you 20 right of centre journos in the more established media, and all of Fox, and nearly all of The Australian and The Financial Review. Pretty much everyone in Murdoch land.

And you think most journalists are lefties? In which country? Not here.


Pop Down, 1708116885

baty

Great 2 hear that U think the Right arguments are smashing the lefts bad ideas , at the moment .

Secure boarders and Immigration is helping atm . The US is being invaded .

Great Australia is safe !!!

The truth does usually emerge and a sensible path forward is found , eventually .

ALL my lectures and tutors at Uni were Left , including Economics .

Add in Law , Medicine , Politics and what is Left ??

Add in the whole Administration of the Uni .

No problems as the Lecturers never worked in the REAL world .

Why would that have changed now ?

My daughters confirm it hasn't .

Name ONE industry where it is dominated by RIGHT .

Journalism haha lol , 20 rights U can name lol ( I couldn't :)

Lets start with the Public Funded and unbiased 1's , the ABC and SBS , FFS !!!

I read newspapers and read these sites !

The Financial Review is Left imho ( maybe everything is left of my centre ? :) .

The successful journos MUST be the only good ones that are getting good ratings like Peta and that guy Hadley !

Mate , I have seen the US Uni's trying to SEPERATE their students based on race .

And NOT just prayer rooms and change rooms ffs .

Everyone is talking about its in the US and U DO know what I mean !!!

I would argue , if I wanted 2 , that Judiciary are very Left Leaning at the lower levels .

They are way 2 SOFT imho !

So we disagree on our Left and Right's , but on the the other hand ?


Pop Down, 1708117038

baty

Great 2 hear U think the Lefts ideas are getting smashed atm !

Immigration and secure boarders are a good example .

The sensible way forward is found , eventually !

ALL my lectures and tutors at Uni were Left , including Economics .

Add in Law , Medicine , Politics and what is Left ??

Add in the whole Administration of the Uni .

No problems as the Lecturers never worked in the REAL world .

Why would that have changed now ?

My daughters confirm it hasn't .

Name ONE industry where it is dominated by RIGHT .

Journalism haha lol , 20 rights U can name lol ( I couldn't :)

Lets start with the Public Funded and unbiased 1's , the ABC and SBS , FFS !!!

I read newspapers and read these sites !

The Financial Review is Left imho ( maybe everything is left of my centre ? :) .

The successful journos MUST be the only good ones that are getting good ratings like Peta !

Mate , I have seen the US Uni's trying to SEPERATE their students based on race .

And NOT just prayer rooms and change rooms ffs .

Everyone is talking about its in the US and U DO know what I mean !!!

I would argue , if I wanted 2 , that Judiciary are very Left Leaning at the lower levels .

They are way 2 SOFT imho !

So we disagree on our Left and Right's , but on the the other hand ?


andy-mac, 1708117471

Reckon ya nailed it Batfink.
AFR left wing???? Good joke.


Pop Down, 1708119175

Andy

I have read the AFR for 30 years , back 2 front .

With all news outlets it's the Editorial that Sets the Tone of any publication .

The AFR has always been Fairfax and they appoint their Editor .

I can't think of one journalist they have that is Right .

Please help !

The Wall Street Journal used to be unbiased .

Now they are a mouth piece for the US Elite ( Left and Right ) .

I am maybe left of Caesar and right of centre on many issues :)


andy-mac, 1708119497

Peter Costello head of Nine, former Fairfax.
Editor of AFR Michael Stutchbury.
Both men hard core lefties?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Stutchbury#:~:text=He%20is%20the%20father%20of,Young%20Liberals%20President%2C%20Harry%20Stutchbury.

I use to read the Australian religiously until 2000's. Was good paper, now nothing but propaganda pamphlet for LNP, disgrace the bias really. Not journos but hit men and women.
Geez I would say I am left socially and tend mid right economically with a belief in strong institutions and public service.
Implementation of NACC so far to me has been Labor's biggest failure/ disappointment. Probably concerned some of them would be brought down.
Anyway getting off track. Have a good weekend hope you get some waves.


andy-mac, 1708120521

[quote=Pop Down]Michael has been very balanced , I agree .

The AFR readers were sick and tired of the AFR bias and readership was plummeting .

In EVERY election they went Labor .

Michael has made a difference and has helped stem the tide .

Good work for pointing that out as I should have noted that change !

The Costello family are a mix of hard left and centre right .

Murdoch is Right ish , World MSM eg the US is LEFT except FOX .

They all have propped UP a Lame Duck President .

They ALL jumped on the Fauci Bandwagon .

They ALL went WOKE !!!

They All do the fn SAME , Leaning Left all the time imho ![/quote]

Maybe so re USA...
Pete's brother maybe left, but sure he has no influence over Nines direction under his bro.
Only people who seem to be pushing woke is the right making up something to fight against. They need a enemy to keep people scared, angry... Formula works well..
Murdoch is right of Mussolini... Yep bit rightish. ;)


Pop Down, 1708120524

Michael has been very balanced , I agree .

The AFR readers were sick and tired of the AFR bias and readership was plummeting .

In EVERY election they went Labor .

Michael has made a difference and has helped stem the tide .

Good work for pointing that out as I should have noted that change !

The Costello family are a mix of hard left and centre right .

Murdoch is Right ish , World MSM eg the US is LEFT except FOX .

They all have propped UP a Lame Duck President .

They ALL jumped on the Fauci Bandwagon .

They ALL went WOKE !!!

They All do the fn SAME , Leaning Left all the time imho !

Thats why everything is wonky over there and they are going around in a circle ( anti clock wise ) .


Pop Down, 1708120904

Nine , mate who cares , who watches them lol and why ?

Murdoch hates Trump and has voted Left in Australia .

Ok , Right has 9 and U have concede the Left has the ABC and PBS .

U can have a draw .

So Rights are now pushing 4 Transgender participation in Woman's Sport .

Mate , Putin is Right and Russia is NOT going Woke FFS !

So Right is Woke ???

F Me , I am then a fn Lefty as I hate Woke Stuff !!!!!


andy-mac, 1708123104

[quote=Pop Down]Nine , mate who cares , who watches them lol and why ?

Murdoch hates Trump and has voted Left in Australia .

Ok , Right has 9 and U have concede the Left has the ABC and PBS .

U can have a draw .

So Rights are now pushing 4 Transgender participation in Woman's Sport .

Mate , Putin is Right and Russia is NOT going Woke FFS !

So Right is Woke ???

F Me , I am then a fn Lefty as I hate Woke Stuff !!!!![/quote]

Murdoch hates Trump now, but Trump would never have been el Prez without his support Fox etc.
Anyway for record I'm against males/ or any other pronoun competing in female competition in any sport.
Reckon ABC is left wing ya dreaming.
Might be a few journos lean left, but geez check the board and all the ex Murdoch employees. David Speers is a real commie! Ha Another thing for Murdoch to attack. Been many investigations in ABC re bias and none ever stick. But carry on....
Anyway I'm trying to keep away from swellnet vortex for a bit.


Pop Down, 1708123702

Good work Andy and I will try 2 .

Just started a holiday with my daughters , so we both don't need to chat about this .

Perhaps , it is not so much about left and right anymore anyway .

I am guessing U and I agree on the important stuff .

The times are a changing .

Left and Right are finding so much common ground atm .

We are all getting fed up with the way Politicians are taking us , The People , for granted .

I hope U get some waves , mate .


Pop Down, 1708123775

Wasted Pop space .


andy-mac, 1708125198

[quote=Pop Down]Good work Andy and I will try 2 .

Just started a holiday with my daughters , so we both don't need to chat about this .

Perhaps , it is not so much about left and right anymore anyway .

I am guessing U and I agree on the important stuff .

The times are a changing .

Left and Right are finding so much common ground atm .

We are all getting fed up with the way Politicians are taking us , The People , for granted .

I hope U get some waves , mate .[/quote]

Enjoy your family holiday time.
Precious moments.


basesix, 1708127054

good on you @Pop, excellent andy-mac thoughtfulness, I can see the edge of a cute lil' hutchie basic card peeking out of the pack, go enjoy some family time before you evolve it ; )

(good time to keep forum posts minimal - it is the bored, lonely, agitator time of year - see patagonia film. Also a year ago exactly from when the 'timely reminder to fucken behave' thread was front and center).


blackers, 1708134863

Sound advice basesix. I'm checking out for a while too, too much of the negative. The return of the dark lord seals it for me. Keep smiling, catching waves and seeing good musos do their thing.
This sums it up. I know I posted it recently but it's too good to ignore.


Pop Down, 1708135181

hey base 6

Down at Portsea for 10 days with my girls and their cabal .

Not expecting 2 c them much but loving being at home base 4 some family time .

Can pop up now , so we will be surfing .

At the Pub last night there was a wedding .

A group of women were perving on the ceremony , so I went up and had a chat .

Came back 2 our table and told my daughters they were the Uninvited Group who had to C the ceremony .

My daughters were horrified and then mortified .

Youngest said she would tell them to F off , 4 sure .

I went back up 2 them , 20 minutes later , after hearing a cheer .

The Ring Bearer was a pooch ( brown lab called Bonnie ) who made a successful deposit .

I thought it a bit OTT .

I then asked the women if they were also , STAYING for dinner ?

They then asked my daughters to pull me away from them , all in good humour .

A beautiful sunset completed a nice summers day .


AlfredWallace, 1708157884

[quote=Pop Down]hey base 6

Down at Portsea for 10 days with my girls and their cabal .

Not expecting 2 c them much but loving being at home base 4 some family time .

Can pop up now , so we will be surfing .

At the Pub last night there was a wedding .

A group of women were perving on the ceremony , so I went up and had a chat .

Came back 2 our table and told my daughters they were the Uninvited Group who had to C the ceremony .

My daughters were horrified and then mortified .

Youngest said she would tell them to F off , 4 sure .

I went back up 2 them , 20 minutes later , after hearing a cheer .

The Ring Bearer was a pooch ( brown lab called Bonnie ) who made a successful deposit .

I thought it a bit OTT .

I then asked the women if they were also , STAYING for dinner ?

They then asked my daughters to pull me away from them , all in good humour .

A beautiful sunset completed a nice summers day .[/quote]


PopDown

Hope you and your girls are having a great time on the MP.

Just looked across all of the current forum topics, you are spread out like an old Federal Mills woollen blanket.

You are spreading faster than an amoebic parasite, chugging down , white blood cells, bacteria and bodily organs and multiplying at a rapid pace.

Good on you, may the oral/written word never be forgotten.AW


kirwoods, 1708164322

Love it @blackers .. such a solid album - cum the raw prawn! reckon Macka has taken them to a new level.


seaslug, 1708211870

Love it as well blackers, it's my new theme song for Markup River


sypkan, 1709023810

biden went hard with his little (pathetic) tough guy routine against putin the other day

again...

I thought to myself... geez its a bit early for that...

and now...

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ukraines-top-spy-chief-says-navalny-died-blood-clot-rejects-murder-narrative


Jelly Flater, 1709026031

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XexHvjG4asY


seeds, 1709026395

^^^^;);););)


sypkan, 1709029994

well that was awkward...

https://twitter.com/EndWokeness/status/1746515707360088486

most people that cook the books are smart enough to be much better prepared than that...


seeds, 1709030778

Indeed


sypkan, 1709730992

'misinformation' and 'fact checkers' hey...

https://www.skynews.com.au/world-news/exclusive-bombshell-dossier-of-secret-emails-proves-mark-zuckerbergs-facebook-fact-checking-program-has-been-compromised-by-activists/news-story/b8ea56f25f400379e0852540593209ac

bit of a self serving cesspit actually

(hardly a surprise)


andy-mac, 1709754344

Sky news calling out facts....
Strange world we are living in.
Any dead girls phones bugged in process?


oxrox, 1709762812

[quote=sypkan]well that was awkward...

https://twitter.com/EndWokeness/status/1746515707360088486

most people that cook the books are smart enough to be much better prepared than that...[/quote]
As far as I know you cannot pay a female employee less than a male in this country. That's law.
The above is an embarassment to all involved. Unbelievable in fact.
So from that do we infer that females can work less hours than males for the same pay? Is that what they're trying to establish?


velocityjohnno, 1710114948

[quote=sypkan]well that was awkward...

https://twitter.com/EndWokeness/status/1746515707360088486

most people that cook the books are smart enough to be much better prepared than that...[/quote]

That's pure gold. If you are a bloke in those organisations, you are going to have to strive hard to bridge the gender pay-per-hour-worked gap. Knock off at 3 each day. On Fridays, take a traditional long luch at 11, and just don't return until Monday morning, like Dad and his mates did in the good ol days.

Towards the end the lady says (paraphrased) they might have people sitting at a desk for 12 hours a day, doesn't mean they are getting 12 hours of work out of them. Too true! I know of a couple of young fellas in one of these departments, they get a list of outcomes to achieve each day, they've satisfied the quota within the first hour, spend the rest of the day playing League of Legends against each other - triple figure salaries. You go boys!


Pop Down, 1710116877

My work life always required me to reach Targets .

Maybe I am not that ambitious , but once a Daily , Monthly or Annual Target had been met , I took it , a bit easy .

As I was , sort of , my own Boss , I could then Do , almost , whatever I wanted 2 do .

U just can't be stupid ( get caught Stuffing Up ) .

Definitely , a few long lunches and FTR's .

Go for a run ( playing footy ) or a surf .

Same as Uni !

I HATED sitting in an Office , killing time .

I retired ONLY , as I was required ( Or get sacked , had 4 Official Warnings and was still going :) 2 sit in an office now , 4 a MIN number of fn hours ( Ex Civid shit which Fair Work AGREED with ffs ) ) , and work stopped being Fun .

If U deliver numbers , U get left alone , in Most organisations .

Some of the women in our office , were also very good at going AWOL , and knew all the cool places 2 eat and drink .

Go Girls 2 .


Slackjawedyokel, 1710314743

Wrong thread


sypkan, 1710858302

seems the wheels have well and truly fallen off the open borders wagon...

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/ive-changed-my-mind-swedish-open-borders-mp-makes-complete-u-turn

Is it any wonder why...

"...After being one of if not the safest country in Europe, Sweden now records the second most bombings out of any country not at war besides Mexico..."


frog, 1711145798

All this trouble for Sweden was foreseeable with a mostly young male influx, who did not want to integrate (maybe the bombs were not foreseeable!), but who could argue with the virtuous idealists in charge of policy - that is before the bombs started. Bombs are hard to ignore.

https://www.politico.eu/article/sweden-new-normal-bomb-attacks-suburbs-kristersson-elections-2024/

Soros and the globalists are nodding with approval over their cigars - "going better than we ever hoped". Tick. Another nation weakened, dazed , divided and confused - ripe for harvesting. All we had to do was fund some NGOs, amplify some memes and demonise any objectors as far right. Easy.


Pop Down, 1711147936

hey froggy

Not just foreseeable but bloody obvious at the time , guns and bombs 2 .

Anyone in Europe can get access 2 them , once organised .

Just By George ( Soros , Mr Small Elite )

How can an Influx this big , of new People into a country , NOT lead 2 a Change in the Country's fabric .

The Dutch are trying to Stop this happening , now !

The Only time a Country's Cultural Fabric usually changes , is by Force .

They get Invaded !

Immigration is exploding , as a Political issue , All around the World .


Pop Down, 1711154493

Merkel opened the German boarder , 2 Syrian refugees in 2015 .

Germany ( and Klaus ) ran the EU , and it became an EU Policy , 2 Open the Gate , 2 Europe .

The British ditched the Idea and got out of the EU .

A group called Frontex , are Responsible for Managing the EU , Immigration Programs .

Run by a Dutch bloke called , Hans ( Leijtens ) .

Hans said " Nothing can stop people crossing a boarder , no wall , no fence , no sea , no river . "

His responsibility is " 2 find a Balance between Boarder Management and Respect for fundamental Human Rights " .

That's the EU view on Immigration .

The Dutch are fighting Hans and Brussels , about Who's Human Right's , the Dutch are supposed 2 look after ffs .

Sounds bloody Double Dutch 2 me , again !

edit

While I am on What's What , I will say I will NOT , now , ever write the name of the Prophet of a certain religious group .

It's a strange feeling , but I think , I am happy to let that one , Go 2 the keeper .

My suggestion is that all on SN , try and avoid it .

Pop .


Data retrieved 29/03/24 08:33:38