457 visa
Only a surfer knows the feeling .... of a 457 visa.
Was in a remote part of Tassie earlier this year where youth unemployment is around 20%. Over 1/2 the staff working at the resort we stayed in were from overseas (as confirmed by management) and could hardly speak English. Work that out.
Maybe the youth don't want to travel to remote parts of Tasmania and work in resorts for the mimimum Autralian wage (which by the way is pretty good compared to the rest of the world)?
I live in "remote Tasmania"..... "Resorts", aye?...... Ok.....
Cradle Mountain. There are several lodges up there. Have stayed at 2 of them over the years and wouldn't go back to be fleeced again. The one we stayed in this year is a "chain" with tourist operations throughout Australia. Pretty much everything about the accommodation at CM is a fucking rip off.
Sheffied is an hours drive from Cradle Mountain. That is where I will stay when I go back again.
In the 2011 census Sheffied had an unemployment rate of 7.7% (Can't find youth figures)and a medium family income of $711.00. ON unemployment its fairing better than the region in which it sits but a medium family income is pretty low.
457 visas are meant to be an action of last resort not a means to lowing wages of Australians by stealth.
Floyd... Yeah fair enough.... No "resorts" in my neck of the woods...... Mind you, a "lodge" is a bit different to a "resort".....
Mate, Oz is so overpriced in every facet of tourism.... Friends just got back from SW WA, and they couldn't fuckn believe it..... Even just buying a round of drinks blew them away....
As far as Tassie goes, I've whinged more than once to the locals about how pricey accommodation is down here.... Outrageous, really....
This 457 visa thing is work choices by stealth. a cunning stunt by the conservatives. And that dickhead senator (no not lambie) but abetz* from tassie is selling his state down the derwent.
* abbott's employment minister
Sheepdog wrote:Floyd... Yeah fair enough.... No "resorts" in my neck of the woods...... Mind you, a "lodge" is a bit different to a "resort".....
Mate, Oz is so overpriced in every facet of tourism.... Friends just got back from SW WA, and they couldn't fuckn believe it..... Even just buying a round of drinks blew them away....
As far as Tassie goes, I've whinged more than once to the locals about how pricey accommodation is down here.... Outrageous, really....
Sheepie running a small business is a little more complicated than that, and I am sure you are endearing yourself to the locals by calling them ripoffs, but whatever.
Okay let's drop the price of accommodation to what you all think is right, which I imagine the same price as you would pay in asia.
Tell us sheepie what's going to be the result of that?
shaun wrote:Sheepdog wrote:Floyd... Yeah fair enough.... No "resorts" in my neck of the woods...... Mind you, a "lodge" is a bit different to a "resort".....
Mate, Oz is so overpriced in every facet of tourism.... Friends just got back from SW WA, and they couldn't fuckn believe it..... Even just buying a round of drinks blew them away....
As far as Tassie goes, I've whinged more than once to the locals about how pricey accommodation is down here.... Outrageous, really....Sheepie running a small business is a little more complicated than that, and I am sure you are endearing yourself to the locals by calling them ripoffs, but whatever.
Okay let's drop the price of accommodation to what you all think is right, which I imagine the same price as you would pay in asia.
Tell us sheepie what's going to be the result of that?
"Sheepie running a small business is a little more complicated than that"
Hmmm.... No shit, Sherlock? Nope, never had anything to do with small business.... And yes, that was sarcasm. Mate, I wont compare Hobart to the sunny coast or the goldy.. That would be a bit unfair.... So I will compare it to Darwin.... Both are "Capitals".... Both are gateway destinations - Darwin is for Kakadu/outback etc... Hobart - Port Arthur/Huon Valley etc...... Now, a quick look at lets say "wotif", and You'll find Hobart only has 28 places that charge under $110 per night..... Darwin has only 25.... But here's the catch, Shaun - Hobart population is 220 000....... Darwins population is 140 000.... Two similar gateway destinations.... One with a 50% gross larger population yet it only an 8ish % gross increase in "budget accommodation"..... And the Tas tourist mob wonder why this state is fucked?
Facts, shaun.... Plain facts......
Ps - never been to SE Asia... Will never go to SE Asia....
You tell him sheepie, you've googled it so you would know.
My theory is that they get those prices cause they can and being seasonal small business paying staff casual rates and the vacancy signs would be up for a month both sides of winter, like any small business in a remote coastal town they have to make a yearly wage in 6 to 8 months.
It's easy for you to say all this as I would assume you are getting a steady income from a disability pension. I'm sure your opinions a valued by the locals and taken into consideration.
$711 a week Floyd, wish I could earn that.
Really, Morris? What would make you come to the conclusion I'm on the government teet? You have seen me write about our bakery? I'd suggest you take that back....
Secondly, why is Tasmania struggling? Why are accommodation houses going to the wall.
Get a new crystal ball.... ps - interesting you know how much the pension is... Must've googled it, right? Or did you just check your bank statement?
Without getting into a shit fight about irrelevant issues the law, what is legal and illegal about 457 visas is that its meant to be an action of last resort after local businesses have attempted to employ Australians. That is the law not something business can choose to consider or ignore.
If your own fucking government can't stand up for Australian families and Australians in Australian jobs what's the fucking point of having a government?
Now Rinehart and others wanted cheap wages here but the conservatives learnt they can't be honest with voters about work choices and deregulating labour so this is what we have. The mass abuse of 457 visas with the governments quiet consent.
Is the current Billabong chief exec Neil Fiske on a 457 visa ?
No sheeepie, don't hang on every word your write, what did you say about the bakery? I'm sure local people luv hearing your opinion based on life experience on the gold coast.
morris was quoting the $711 that Floyd mentioned not your pension,
@ sheepy,
been to tassie 9 times so far and there are many many great places to stay and eat where the cost is bloody reasonable for what you get, where the owners are having a honest crack and its excellent value for money. just have to look around and stay at places not used by international tourists. yes accommodation is expensive at CM, Freycinet, overlooking the water in Hobart and at Strahan but equally there are great lower cost options in those places and great value in the Huon, Bruny and up and down the east coast. stayed on a working beef stud farm out of Stanley once right on the tidal inlet, man was that good picking oysters off the rocks every morning. The Hotel Charles in Launceston is just the best and at reasonable price.
Interestingly every time i go to tassie I'm reminded of the south island of NZ and every time i'm on the south island of NZ I'm reminded of tassie. Tassie isn't as cold in winter and it doesn't have the alps but i reckon there are things the kiwis do really well that could equally apply to the apple isle.
your bakery do date scones?
Yeah, Floyd... And we do also do scallop mornay pies... Only bakery that does them... Most other bakeries do curry scallop.. We do them too.... Hours are a bitch, but I get to sit around during the day and get insulted by shaun and Morris... There are only a few bakeries south of Kingston..... Next time you are down, make sure you do a pie run..... You'll find us...... Scallop Mornay pies mate... ;)
I'll set it straight too.. I shouldn't have said "our bakery".... We are part owners... 1/2 our bakery is technically correct, before more accusations are thrown around...
Shaun, I live here, work here, have respect here..... I am currently in direct conversation with Will Hodgman and co regards to boosting tourism in the southern region of Tasmania..... You really have no idea because you don't live here..... My partner and I have poured $1000s of dollars into our community.. Just sold out acreage, which blogger Mitchvg knows about......So when you and Morris come down here and chip in instead of throwing pathetic pot shots, I'll take your opinion seriously.... The region is still charging pre gfc prices in a post gfc world... Simple as that... All the stats show Tas tourism is in freefall.... Something has to give.... Even if it just 20% drop in accommodation prices.....
And BTW, Darwin is also "seasonal"..... Only idiots go to Darwin for a holiday between November and early April.....
457 Visas, well.
Inzider, the company I work for (Neptune, NAIS), which associate with many oil and gas conglomerates around the world, WoodSide, Conoco-Phillips, BHP, Shell, Apache etc etc, they pay the same wage or day rate for a Kiwi travelling from NZ or Scots and Poms who travel from their home lands....?
So what you are saying if true do you get NZ wages coming to OZ working....? Kind of weird IMO..!
NAIS the rope access division within Neptune have probably about 30-40 full FTE's now, compared to 3 years ago only 10..? Many of the FTE's are Poms and Scots all on 457 Visas.. Yes. So out of 40 FTE's probably 95% of them are from Scotland or England....?
There is a couple of reasons I believe Neptune do this,
1: They have a lot more experience and Qualifications in (NDT Non-Destructive Testing) UT, MT LP, etc..
2: They have an office in Aberdeen Scotland..
3:It is a way for NAIS to have them here for 2 years to solidly work for them and not stray to other companies, so when a big work load comes on they have numbers. All whilst these guys and girls are on 457's to apply for residency.
4: IMO, Most of them are so arrogant and they are the best at everything, annoying sometimes....? The classic call coming from them is "you don't do that in the North Sea" haha cracks me up, as I just turn around and say "have a good look over the side champ, now thats the Indian Ocean Timor Sea or the Bas Straight, ok...?"
Anyways they all get the same day rate or FTE rate depending on their quals......?
There is a place out in Timor Sea where I work a bit, called the Bayu Undan, Conoco-Phillips, huge gas reserve and have turned over between 15-25 million a day for the last 10 or so years, with anothee 20-25 years remaining....? F.F.S.
I find it hard sometimes as they have a huge work force of Philippine'os... I love working and socialising them they are awesome, although some have a chip on their shoulders about pay rates. I hear it a lot when sitting around lunch or having a ciggy...?
Most Westerners are on between $850-1200 day rate, where as the Philippine'os earn $45-$50 a day....???
I say to them how many packets of ciggys you can buy with your $50..... 50
How many can I buy...... 40...?
How much to buy a house there..... $4000
How much for me to buy a house in OZ $450 -$600,000.....?
They are quite wealthy where they live, way above the average wage..
So really many big companies are money hungry greedy Cunts and will get every little penny out of you, because they have specialised people working that out everyday. When we do the hard yards.
You know Uni heads, like yourself;)
Sheepio ol mate don't worry, Shaunio did a good job to get the right answer out of you, I know its a tough lamb bone but she'll be right mate, You might even get a knock on the door one day by a bloke wearing a diaper asking for one of your special Scallop Mornay pies...
thats right welly, the best legal and accounting minds in the world are on it .... how to avoid tax and gain maximum advantage out of government policies like 457 visas. any punter working his 40-50 hrs plus raising the kids etc is the mug. want to stop ebola or aids or famine just tax those multinationals just some not even at the rate us punters get slugged.
Yeah Floyd I hear ya,
Even on the Bayu Udan many of the blokes who work for Neptune live in Thailand or Indo cleaning up...
Living cheap as chips earning great money and still whinging......;)
Not sure why that is...? I think Neptune can only get a certain amount of 457's per year or even just total amount employed etc. So they hire the Poms and Scots on the Bayu because it is a joint adventure (JPDA)tax out of Aussie waters...?
Assuming this is your establishment as you make the only scallop mortuary pie, I'll pass thank you.
www.tripadvisor.com.au/ShowUserReviews-g504330-d2480093-r187124807-Swing...
Swinging sounds pretty good for you Morris.
You might meat someone ...!
Stanley only about 200 Kms north of Kingston and the Sheepy says he's south of that way. If ya gunna be a smart arse get ya facts right!!!
Stanley only about 200 Kms north of Kingston and the Sheepy says he's south of that way. If ya gunna be a smart arse get ya facts right!!!
That's a double shot...!
Once for each brain cell
Welly, It dosnt matter where in the world I get sent , I get the same day rate. I was living in OZ last year on a NZ contract paying tax in NZ while working in the cooper basin. Its a bit different for us sheep fondlers.
The rig Im on now (yeah Im hard at it) has Ozzie tool pushers on ozzie contract workin in NZ, so it can go both ways which is good. However some of the 3rd party companies name scumberger the french stains,
are the main ones in drilling that are getting away with the dodgy shit on the reg. Its utter bollocks. There are squillions of Geology grads in NZ and OZ that could be doing these jobs that 457 visas are stealing. I only work onshore so cant speak for offshore drilling but there isnt many rig pigs from the UK I have come across. The ones I do know however are all residents now and one just got citizen ship. Cant blame them really, they love the naki and are not the type to bleat about the "north sea".
I just worked in Japan on a geothermal rig and worked with a Phillipino who averaged about 300 days in the field a year, and paid didly, but as you say its all relative. I was in middle easti year before talking to cuply Jordanians about the cost of living in OZ and NZ and they were horrified when I told them I needed $800 a week just to keep a roof over head and buy food for the gannets, petrol costing $2.30 a litre and shit, mans gotta do some serious graft these days to keep afloat thats for sure. Take me back to the winter of 93 Q town living in that cave any day cuz. Is hat Bruce springsteen I hear in the back ground?
welly u r are a poor excuse for a white neandearthal yowie chaser. After all the pyschochotehrapy. spellling may be an isue here but i am talking to a kiwi misfit, u make so much common sensse. all i can say is baaaa- do not reply, i am a very classic friend- do not reply
wellymon, we spoke about this, it is about u, not the money, not the lifestyle. my last post was a gee up, brother, u know where we live, i am not here to say how u should live your life, but u authentic, be true to u. how much fun fun did we we have. this is me, concrete tanks solar panels etc etc do not email me until after G20. 29-28 u do n ot contact me, i will contact u= u r an inbred- christian cullen the best
Foreign teachers on 457s while Australian teacher graduates can't find work ........
http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/foreign-teacher...
@inzider you say you were in the middle east last year and Jordanians were horrified about cost of living here. Is Jordan one of the Middle Eastern countries that bring in their "labourers" from places like India & Bangalesh and pay them chicken fed? Where there are no industrial safety standards and where the workers are "housed" together and maybe get to go home to see their families once or twice a year?
Gday, Floyd... I know we're going off track a bit, but we have had European backpackers down here just shaking their heads re' how expensive Australia is....
Let's look at one of the universal points....... Alcohol..
Here is a link to a std USA town, with a std USA carton of piss.....
http://www.liquormart.com/coors-original-24pack-cans-00366.html
Yep $19.00 for a carton of piss..... Even if the Aussie dollar was 50c USA, it'd still be $10 cheaper.....
Unbelievable...
Hey Sheepdog,
The little I know about the legislative environment in the US its all about/around deregulation and divesting responsibility downwards to State or County level, just like Abbott's Good Ole Boys want to do here. So in the US you have a race to the bottom/competition between States on taxes and public health programs.
Interestingly, on a recent post we were all chatting about Tax Havens, well one US state (Delaware) is a massive tax haven for big multinationals and US companies all because it was this state's way of dragging itself out of the bayou.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/business/how-delaware-thrives-as-a-cor...
I digress.
So comparing the US and Aussie on alcohol prices is problematic.
Here we have (relatively speaking) a centralised system of government that takes its public health responsibilities +- seriously and in the US its a relative free for all.
What this means is we tax alcohol and cigarettes etc seriously to try to deter people for use/overuse and in the US its let the market decide.
I personally think our community is awash in alcohol and its associated social and health problems so I say tax even more but I'm an old fashioned socialist/hippy and what would I know anyway?
Yeah, fair points.... But lets look at food instead of alcohol...
http://coloradobeefstore.com/3.html
Chicken legs - 69c per lb
Pork chops - $1.99 per lb
Eggs - 99c per dozen
I chose Colorado due to it's smaller size and relative isolation.... New York, Chicago, and L.A are even cheaper due to size/competition etc....
As far as taxing the bejesus out of alcohol/cigs.... I am not for a nanny state.... And you say Australia is "awash" with alcohol... So taxing the crap out of it hasn't worked... Just made it more expensive, putting more money into wasteful governments hands, and cutting the household budgets of drinkers which can't be good for their children......
How many millions of illegal immigrants are in the US working for how much an hour? I think its still true that real wages for the punter haven't increased in is it now 20 years. This notion of the working poor in the US where mom and dad have to work 2 and 3 jobs (how many hours can a person work in a day?) to pay the rent/food while the kids see themselves to and from school and then the buy take away for dinner on the way home ... is that good for families?
I once meet a women whose family ran gift shops in Hilton Hotels throughout the US. Her family back then employed people for $6 US an hour. She agreed people were fucked in the US the day they were born.
We can all bitch and complain about the sort of prices we pay here but the real question is do you really want to be like the US or India or some other country where the inter-generational poverty kills your opportunity before you stop shitting your nappy.
So what sort of country do we want for us and our kids?
floyd wrote:@inzider you say you were in the middle east last year and Jordanians were horrified about cost of living here. Is Jordan one of the Middle Eastern countries that bring in their "labourers" from places like India & Bangalesh and pay them chicken fed? Where there are no industrial safety standards and where the workers are "housed" together and maybe get to go home to see their families once or twice a year?
Yeah Floyd, worked on land in Oman, Oman LNG down by Sur, a few years back.
Similar scenario as you stated above, all Indian employees working for fuck all, all living in a big 5 storey walk up together, there without going home to their loved ones for 3 years minimum...!
Pretty hard core for real.
Like I said above, Hey the Indian fellas I was working with haha couldn't tell if they were sAying yes or no...!! With their sidesways wooble on ;) Anyways they showed me pictures of their houses in India OMG they looked liked 3 million dollar mansions here in OZ....?
They were all pretty focused on a mission except for the sideways wobble on:) " get the paint pump ready with some paint in it Patel...! " Whilst hanging 30M up in the air, Would look Down and see the wooble, " Is that yes or no Patel" as Patel walks of into the distance..? Got used to it. Until Patel put a mixed up can of paint with a brush in it on the end of my ropes...! Ha
Like I said before these big companies know it's all in perspective with who earns what...!
Inzider haha the little gannets would love to live in a cave with the old boy.
hey sheepdog, your point about cheap food in the US, lets expand to cheap milk here.
cheap food is bad business/social/environmental policy.
diary farmers here get reamed here so down down can sell milk at a $1 litre meanwhile the:
public undervalues the true worth of a quality food product and consumes / wastes more; and
farmer gets reamed and looks for short cuts to stay afloat maybe less care of the pastures degrading for the future. farmer also doesn't get true value for work and inputs like water (scarce resource).
so supermarket stuffs the sustainable milk industry and we think that's good?
Now you mention eggs, chicken and pork in your last post ... shall we leave the ethical arguments against intensive farming to another day? Fair to say the way those products are generally been produced here and elsewhere should leave us sick in the guts. If keeping a pig in a small wire cage is how consumers get a pork chops for $1.99 a pound I'm turning vego.
Coors is not Beer!!! sheepie ,i t may be labeled as such but beer it aint.
Tax the fuck out of alcohol and tobacco, price it out of use.
Sheepie you hold up America like its a got a good system going , well it hasn't. Wish I had a dollar for every time I heard the line, "it's not a very good job , but at least it has health cover".
Welly, floyd, Jordan dosnt have Oil so they cant abuse a workforce from another country like the UAE for example where there are over 500,000 construction workers on as little as 650 dirhams a month ($200 aus) ,They work 12-14 hours a day 7 days a week and get housed in concentration like camps 10 to room 1 toilet to a hundred , that sort of shit. They spend most of their wages on food and consider a piece of meat every few weeks an extreme luxury, Those filthy rich dune coons are wankers, no doubt.
This shit is well documented and the worst thing is there are Australian construction companies like GROLLO who are building in the UAE and are using this slave labour, it is seriously fucked up.
GROLLO is actively trying to squash the CFMEU in Vicco to drive down wages, GROLLO sites have killed 4 people recently I believe in Vicco. Ive worked on a GROLLO site In downtown melbourne and they are cockheads. Lieghtons , lend lease are other OZ construction companies over there making the most of the slaves.
http://www.vice.com/read/slaves-of-happiness-island-0000412-v21n8
When i was in ABU DHABI I went into the city at night on my skateboard, they have this epic waterside walkway on the Corniche which has 10 kilometres of marble ledging from tip to toe, They have extreme wealth and treat these poor slaves like animals.
457's have so much to offer business.
Lower wages through surplus labour force ( there was never a labour shortage ).
Increase the population.
Virtual genocide of the union movement.
Create a more docile workforce. A lot of 457's I know have a clause in their contracts whereby if they get the arse they lose residency and have to pay back all of their relocation costs. That sure makes for a more compliant worker, especially when industrial action is a sackable offence.
It's win / win for business. Maybe not so amazing for the labour force...
inzider wrote:What a joke this is.
http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/leaked-report-r...
Australia needs to tighten up on 457 visas not loosen up. Abbot is such a git.
NZ needs to adopt a more strict regime on imported labour.
There are big multinational oil companies hiring kiwis on NZ contracts and pay conditions and sending them to work in OZ so they can then send Indians and the like to work in NZ on peanuts . The situation is bullshit. Indians on peanuts taking Kiwi jobs and kiwis on peanuts taking Ozzie jobs.
457 visas definitely have a place and a purpose to allow Businesses to get skills they can't find locally.
Those NZ workers don't need a 457 visa. NZ citizens work in Oz without restriction .
I am very stoked that Indians and the like get to come here and to NZ and step up out of poverty...
Which business can't get which skills ?
Burgsurfer, maybe if those nations stopped breeding like rabbits they would have a better chance.
It never ceases to amaze me how many people on these forums miss the basic point.
Kiwis in oz are on "special visas " which gives them less access to education health etc etc than refugees.
I am not very stoked on Indians taking jobs kiwis can do
Hi Inzider,
Yeah, Kiwis are on SVC and get it automatically when they arrive, with or without a job... 457 visas are granted for a certain person to fill a position an employer can prove they can not fill and they can take up to about 6 months to be approved - they are an individual visa for an individual person and individual job vacancy but everyone on NZ passports could rock up tomorrow, without jobs, and get SVCs automatically . A kiwi can apply for PR as soon as they arrive and with PR will get all those benefits you mentioned. Only thing they can't get is hecs study debt... I have been recruiting people from all over the world for 11 years now but mainly from NZ, UK, Canada, USA so I know a bit on this subject but funnily enough a lot of employers over here won't hire Indians and the like who breed like rabbits... They don't like em cause they are racist.
I get your point that jobs are being taken that can be filled locally, often when you post forums though not everyone using the www is going to agree with your rant... I think that is why mist are posted - to get a discussion going. It never ceases to amaze me how many people on forums don't get that a forum is about conversations and oh my gosh sometimes people have varying opinions and angles to view things...,
Floyd and Shaun...
Shaun - "Coors is not Beer!!! sheepie ,i t may be labeled as such but beer it aint.".... And neither is VB or XXXX, shaun.... Piss flavoured water..... Point is having a beer in the USA, or Germany, Spain, or even China so so much more ridiculously cheaper than here, Australia, a country renowned for having a few frothys.... I don't drink, shaun... Gave it away over 12 years ago.... And I only used the USA because it is a comparable judeo Christian democracy.... Wouldn't live there..... My simple point is that Australia has become one of the most expensive places in the world.... Across the board....
http://www.smh.com.au/business/australia-the-costs-are-spiralling-201304...
Petrol is 71% more expensive here than the USA, and 41% more expensive than China...
Electricty... Floyd, this is for you, too..... Some of the most expensive electricity in the world;
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-21/australians-pay-highest-power-pric...
Floyd, it's pretty hard to get "organic egg prices" on the net.... And I agree, caged animals is shocking.... But Woolies and Coles sell caged eggs. They sell mass produced pork too... The masses eat it.... So my price comparison was just that, a comparison without the ethical angle.... If I put the time in, I'm sure you and I would both find that organic produce in the USA would also be cheaper than organic produce here...... Cheaper power, cheaper petrol, cheaper water.... The ethical angle is moot.... Our power bill was obscene....
I might join Morris down a clink yet.... ;)
Our Environment Minister is getting to know me quiet well these days. Mr Hunt will be attending the G20 in a role of the environmental portfolio. Here's our latest conversation.
Hi Dave,
It is a significant coronet of the meeting.
Cheers and many thanks,
Greg
Sent from my iPad
On 22 Oct 2014, at 11:55 am, "Dave Burdon" wrote:
Thank you for your reply Greg
I am glad to hear that the issue of Energy Efficiency/Sustainability will be an important priority at the G20 Summit. I take it when you use the word "plank" you are referring to a foundation, or major priority.
The quicker we use energy more efficiently and cleanly, all human societies and economies will be more functional.
Thank you again and I wish you all the very best at the Summit and I hope all the other delegates realise the importance of this issue as you have.
dave
[email protected]
From: "Hunt, Greg (MP)"
Sheep ie Alot these articles you are using as an example are are expensive cause they are taxed much higher than the U.S. and that is the reason why our standard of living is much better, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
My perfect economy would be to fuck of all income tax and raise gst to 30 to 35 %, it can be a user pays system.
Yes costs are higher here than elsewhere.
Yes wages are higher too.
But sheepy would you prefer your customers to have some money in their pockets to buy a pie or no money?
Its not a race to the bottom with wages and costs.
Well managed businesses selling quality services or products will make money and still pay their employees well e.g. VW biggest car marker in the world and many of their models are made in high wages Germany. It fact, the German economy is doing pretty well despite high wages.
BUT
The point is what is happening with 457 visas is ILLEGAL under Australian law. If we want a low wage economy where people are working full-time and living below the poverty line fair enough BUT LET THE VOTERS DECIDE THAT AT AN ELECTION. My guess is whatever party proposes it will be voted into the wilderness for a decade. So that's why Abetz and the other cunning stunters / conservatives are turning a blind eye to the mass abuse of current Australian LAW.
Now, if multinationals paid tax, even some, governments around the world could tax individuals less and that would improve people's standard of living and place downward pressure on wages ....... remember the Hawke/Keating wages accord?
hear hear floyd, i'm voting for you!!!
You forgot about "skimming", Shaun..... And profits for shareholders... And Big corporations crushing competition (woollies etc)... Since woollies and co sucked everyone in with their vouchers, the little service stations went to the wall.. They then put the prices up.... Corner stores are going... Now woollies and coles are selling fucking car insurance.... Monopoly.... Price rigging, power companies shaking hands behind closed doors.... A 30% gst wont fix any of that... Just give more money to the puppets in government to piss against the wall....
Burgersurf,
It is in your best interests to like the 457 visa as it brings in money for you, at the expense of your country men.
Granted there are highly specialised positions that need this visa from time to time, how ever
The reason there is huge skill shortages around NZ and OZ is because the youth are not being trained they are being left to rot on the dole. Big companies are bringing in 1000's of workers because they cant be bothered investing in the youth, they just want to maximise profits, and to hell with all the kids unemployed around the country, let them get into drugs and alcohol etc.
How many apprenticeships are out there ? Sweet fuck all my importing 457 visa champion.
Parts of OZ have youth unemployment rate as high as 20 % like Adelaide. Who is failing these kids ?
You think its lovely that all these imported labour blokes from every corner of the globe are getting a leg up from poverty, well aint that rosy, how about starting to think about looking after your own back yard before being on some moral high ground warm and fluffy high horse. Kids are the future who have to pay for the ever increasing grey wave thats coming. nah fuck it , lets just keep importing labour I;m makin my buck I hear you say.
Thanks for your posts wellymom you have cleared up that mysterious world of fifo workers and 457 visas...a little. I can understand them being used for skilled jobs needing qualifications like wellymons, but inzider is right, the government should be training people really.
Maybe the kids are not willing to travel to earn $850 a day, but I doubt it. The kids are soft but not that soft, and that's. some serious coin. Clearly the kids are too soft to work in a resort in tassie though, and that is sad. Normally the libs would be all over this with various expose's on bad current affairs shows. But nothing, because they are happy to undermine oz labour laws. Gina will gets all on Asian wages eventually, maybe inevitably. Pretty sad labor has said nothing about all this, but it appears they donr even stand up for workers anymore which makes one wondet what they do actually stand for, maybe they don't want to stir up their happy doley voters in tassie.
As to the shaun sheepdog (a shaved sheepdog, sorry) food debate, I certainly don't want American style prices if it means american wages. But even that issue doesn't seem that simple, I work with a recently arrived pommy chick who reckons she can buy a bottle of SA wine cheaper in the UK than she can in mclaren vale where it is made, but that could be about a nanny state controlling its hethans.
I think it will be debateable in the future whether this mining boom was good for oz, because it seems we are squandering the profits whilst undermining the good things about oz. The greens talk about having a controlled boom making things more sustainable (not just environment) probably just more idealistic fairy talk but it makes sense to me. Most people I know were better off before the so called boom.
What a joke this is.
http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/leaked-report-r...
Australia needs to tighten up on 457 visas not loosen up. Abbot is such a git.
NZ needs to adopt a more strict regime on imported labour.
There are big multinational oil companies hiring kiwis on NZ contracts and pay conditions and sending them to work in OZ so they can then send Indians and the like to work in NZ on peanuts . The situation is bullshit. Indians on peanuts taking Kiwi jobs and kiwis on peanuts taking Ozzie jobs.